Wall chargers

[3121]

The older Emporis units are not UL certified, they are well built but not certified. They do have a UL certified one that is supposed to start shipping in May for $50 more.

According to the engineer I spoke with at Emporia there is no hardware difference between the UL ones and pre UL cert. They just started charging $50 more to recoup the cost of the cert now that they have it and can print the logo.

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[SANZC02]

According to the engineer I spoke with at Emporia there is no hardware difference between the UL ones and pre UL cert. They just started charging $50 more to recoup the cost of the cert now that they have it and can print the logo.

I agree, the units are well built but they will need to make changes. For UL certification they will need to limit the amps through dip switches right now you can do it through the app, they can leave the app setting but will need to limit the max through the dip switch. I think they will need to shorten the plug in cord as well. It is currently 24 inches, I think it is supposed to be limited to 12 inches but not positive. Not sure if there are any other changes they will need.

I thought the charger was a great deal, have one in both of my houses. I like their plugs as well and the software features.

 

[Gshenderson]

I drilled a hole today thru the wall, which is always the most nerve racking part for me since you never know if there’s another wire, water line, etc running through there. The good news is that it came thru into my garage pretty much where I expected / wanted it to and I didn’t hit any concrete or other nasty obstructions. I’m going from a main panel in my basement to garage on first floor, so had to go through a structured wood I-beam and wasn’t quite sure where it would come out height wise or what all I might hit on the way thru.

Bad news is that because I had to go thru an I-beam, I probably wont be able to run the wire up through garage wall. Instead I’ll need to put in a junction box where the wire comes thru the wall and the run conduit up 3 ft into the Rivian charger. Requires some additional supplies and not as clean of a look, but it’ll work. Back to HomeDepot tomorrow and should have everything wired up and ready this weekend. Then I’ll just be waiting for the charger.

My guide did tell me that the charger must be “professionally installed”. This will be the second one I’ve done. Does that make me a pro?

 

[Cactus]

Here is my setup.

14-50 Outlet used by our Tesla Model Y. Max circuit output is 40A but the Tesla Mobile Connector tops out at 32A
I used the Rivian mobile charger for a week on the 14-50 outlet. It tops out at 34A but that is pretty slow charging for the Rivian.

This past weekend I added an Emporia Energy 48A hardwired Charger on a separate 60A circuit.

The Emporia units are $380-400 depending on the day, they sell on Amazon and their own web site. Great unit, UL certification and no major faults on the Amazon reviews. They also come with a 14-50 pigtail that allows up to 40A or you can hardwire on a 60A circuit and set it to 48A.

Since our main panel is right on the outside of our garage it was pretty easy to pop a couple knock outs and route the 6AWG. Pretty inexpensive too since they are short runs. I think all in i spent $600 for the Emporia and 14-50.

With 200A service we can run both chargers simultaneously and still have plenty of juice left over for the house and our upstairs AC zone (40A). That said I tend to stager the charge times so the panel does not run hot all night.

@3121: Looks awesome. I want to do something similar so I can charge my model S and Rivian... probably staggered charging like you mentioned.
How many mph do you get from your emporia 48A setup?

 

[astonius]

I’ve been riding the fence for 2x Wallbox 48As in a load-sharing config, then today Tesla drops the price on their wall connectors which also do load-sharing to $400 a piece. Wallboxes are $700 a piece .

Admittedly they don’t have the scheduling and usage features Wallbox provides (at least not yet), but a $600 savings is hard to pass up.

 

[3121]

@3121: Looks awesome. I want to do something similar so I can charge my model S and Rivian... probably staggered charging like you mentioned.
How many mph do you get from your emporia 48A setup?

Not sure on MPH, probably 25-27 - it’s putting out about 11.7-12kW per hour. Our service voltage is pretty hot at 245v so The juice is going in a little quicker.

 

[3121]

I agree, the units are well built but they will need to make changes. For UL certification they will need to limit the amps through dip switches right now you can do it through the app, they can leave the app setting but will need to limit the max through the dip switch. I think they will need to shorten the plug in cord as well. It is currently 24 inches, I think it is supposed to be limited to 12 inches but not positive. Not sure if there are any other changes they will need.

I thought the charger was a great deal, have one in both of my houses. I like their plugs as well and the software features.

Good to know, mine came with a 12” cord so maybe I have the UL model just without the stamp? Not sure if it has the dip switch as I just set it up with the app and wasn’t looking, i will check if i take the cover off again.

Agreed, super high quality connector and cord, solid software/app. I also use their wireless Zigbee/HAN device to read our meter in realtime. It breaks down the difference in usage between the EVSE and the rest of the house. All that data feeds into our Home assistant system.

 

[R1Sky Business]

I ended up getting a Chargepoint Flex installed on a 60 amp breaker yesterday. That way everything is ready when I either get my F150 Lightning or my R1T.

Or both

 

[R1Sky Business]

I drilled a hole today thru the wall, which is always the most nerve racking part for me since you never know if there’s another wire, water line, etc running through there. The good news is that it came thru into my garage pretty much where I expected / wanted it to and I didn’t hit any concrete or other nasty obstructions. I’m going from a main panel in my basement to garage on first floor, so had to go through a structured wood I-beam and wasn’t quite sure where it would come out height wise or what all I might hit on the way thru.

Bad news is that because I had to go thru an I-beam, I probably wont be able to run the wire up through garage wall. Instead I’ll need to put in a junction box where the wire comes thru the wall and the run conduit up 3 ft into the Rivian charger. Requires some additional supplies and not as clean of a look, but it’ll work. Back to HomeDepot tomorrow and should have everything wired up and ready this weekend. Then I’ll just be waiting for the charger.

My guide did tell me that the charger must be “professionally installed”. This will be the second one I’ve done. Does that make me a pro?

Indeed it does

 

[3121]

I’ve been riding the fence for 2x Wallbox 48As in a load-sharing config, then today Tesla drops the price on their wall connectors which also do load-sharing to $400 a piece. Wallboxes are $700 a piece .

Admittedly they don’t have the scheduling and usage features Wallbox provides (at least not yet), but a $600 savings is hard to pass up.

Why share a 60A circuit vs. putting in two separate circuits. If you have 200A service to the panel you should have no problem running both at the same time unless you are also planning to run multiple AC zones and have all The lights and the oven on at the same time.

Max load on 200A service would be ~43kW
Our nominal household load is between 1.5kW and 2.5kW depending on what appliances are turned on.
A 48A EVSE pulls 11.5kW so x2 = 23kW
That leaves 20kW for AC and the rest of the house.

 

[astonius]

Why share a 60A circuit vs. putting in two separate circuits. If you have 200A service to the panel you should have no problem running both at the same time unless you are also planning to run multiple AC zones and have all The lights and the oven on at the same time.

Max load on 200A service would be ~43kW
Our nominal household load is between 1.5kW and 2.5kW depending on what appliances are turned on.
A 48A EVSE pulls 11.5kW so x2 = 23kW
That leaves 20kW for AC and the rest of the house.

The house does have 200A, but the panel I’m tapping into is only 90A. The HVAC is wired into the main panel outside of the house with over half of the allocated capacity. The 90A sub-panel in the garage feeds the entirety of the rest of the house. We often trip breakers when using appliances. I figured a 48A load-sharing setup would give us the best balance of stability and performance.

 

[3121]

The house does have 200A, but the panel I’m tapping into is only 90A. The HVAC is wired into the main panel outside of the house with over half of the allocated capacity. The 90A sub-panel in the garage feeds the entirety of the rest of the house. We often trip breakers when using appliances. I figured a 48A load-sharing setup would give us the best balance of stability and performance.

Ah that makes sense.

You could also put in a couple 14-50 outlets and use the included travel chargers which top out at 32/34A. And you can set the cars (Rivian or tesla) to lower amps in the settings. Same result for much less money than dual hardwired.

 

[astonius]

Ah that makes sense.

You could also put in a couple 14-50 outlets and use the included travel chargers which top out at 32/34A. And you can set the cars (Rivian or tesla) to lower amps in the settings. Same result for much less money than dual hardwired.

I considered that option as well, though I would want dedicated units for home and mobile use anyway, and the slightly higher cost of hardwired units for a cleaner setup and higher max output is worth it to me. Also my understanding is current code requires GFCI breakers for NEMA 14-50 outlets which are significantly more expensive and would eat any cost savings.

 

[3121]

I considered that option as well, though I would want dedicated units for home and mobile use anyway, and the slightly higher cost of hardwired units for a cleaner setup and higher max output is worth it to me. Also my understanding is current code requires GFCI breakers for NEMA 14-50 outlets which are significantly more expensive and would eat any cost savings.

Technically the code only calls for a GFCI breaker if you specifically tell the electrician you are using the outlet for car charging. Just say it’s for a welder or “tools” or punch it in yourself . There is no GFCI retrofit required if you decide to plug your car into your “welder outlet”

There are also 3rd party portable 14-50 chargers that go up to 40A. Maybe do one 14-50 and one hardwired charger.

Do you know what AWG wire is running from your main panel to the sub? If it’s 2AWG you might be able to swap that 90A for a 100A

 

[astonius]

Technically the code only calls for a GFCI breaker if you specifically tell the electrician you are using the outlet for car charging. Just say it’s for a welder or “tools” or punch it in yourself . There is no GFCI retrofit required if you decide to plug your car into your “welder outlet”

There are also 3rd party portable 14-50 chargers that go up to 40A. Maybe do one 14-50 and one hardwired charger.

Do you know what AWG wire is running from your main panel to the sub? If it’s 2AWG you might be able to swap that 90A for a 100A

Good to know on the GFCI requirement! I still think the cleanliness and option to max out at 48A on each charger is worth the extra upfront cost for me, but it’s certainly a solid suggestion.

Unsure about the wire gauge to the sub panel. May have my electrician take a look when he does the install. I’m sure the original builder electrician did this setup to save cost on wiring runs, so it wouldn’t surprise me if they did the bare minimum. To their credit we’ve never tripped a breaker on the exterior panel, so at least it’s been easy to reset them in the garage.

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