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R1S Split Hatch/Tailgate

sevengroove

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For me, the only thing better would have been french doors a la the Isuzu Trooper.
Interesting - I had to look up a picture to see how this worked. I think it would get at some of the benefits (like not needing enough clearance to open the back) but you'd still miss out on the ability to sit on the tailgate, protect things from rolling out, or climb on top of it to access the roof. Not to mention, that interruption in visibility across the back window and the need for two wipers (or a wiper only on the larger side).

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SlaterGS

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I think the biggest downside is that for shorter people it makes it a bit more difficult to reach all parts of the cargo area, just like the tailgate of the R1T.
I did not think about this so good point!
But now I have sat here pondering your response and originally came to the conclusion that I am not sure it will really apply to just about everyone ?

Theory is that the space behind the 3rd row is very small. Even with the split tailgate I don't think shorter people will have a problem accessing every nook and cranny of that particular cargo area.

So I decided to look at some numbers.
A 5' woman on average would be able to reach in about 23.1" (without bending)
(calculated by taking the average shoulder width dimensions of an American female at 14.4" then reducing that from the average armspan of someone that is 5' and cutting that in half.)
I don't know the height of the tailgate on the R1S (somebody help me with this and the cargo dimensions behind the 3rd row) but I'm going to guess around 18-22" (Ford Maverick is 25" for reference). Depending on where this "hits" the shorter person will limit how much they can lean in to the cargo area.

In the end I think you are correct that it has the potential to make it more difficult for the vertically challenged among us though I think the lifting things over top and setting them down (ie a gallon of milk) will be the bigger challenge especially if the suspension is lifted fairly high.

Not sure why I spent any time on this as I am 6' and my wife is 5'10" ?
 

R1T7777

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I don't have much to add here, as I've never had a vehicle with anything other than a traditional hatch. But I am curious what others have to say, as well.

Best I can figure is that maybe it's nice having that lip there, so stuff doesn't risk falling out once you pop it open? I've had things shift around on me while driving, such that as soon as I opened my hatch, a milk jug fell out and exploded on the ground. It'd be nice to avoid that (besides properly securing my groceries, I know....)

On a related note: I'm more than a little disappointed if we we're actually getting is the material build quality that RJ showed in the video that he climbed into the back. Looked like this in his video:
1639494603247.png


Looks like it on the current pictures on the website, too. Was really hoping for the fancy finish we'd seen on the early builds, which seemed to include Chilewich instead of traditional carpet and a much nicer aluminum (or some other metal) sill plate:
1639494691141.png
The split rear gate is nice, a roll down rear window, or flip up rear window would have been nice too.
 

IHScout

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When hooked up to our trailer, the suburban liftgate would barely clear the electric tongue jack, but my expedition liftgate is a little larger so it doesn't clear it. This makes it difficult to get our goldendoodle out from the back on camping trips on long drives. I am pro split hatch/liftgate.
 
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RexRemus

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I did not think about this so good point!
But now I have sat here pondering your response and originally came to the conclusion that I am not sure it will really apply to just about everyone ?

Theory is that the space behind the 3rd row is very small. Even with the split tailgate I don't think shorter people will have a problem accessing every nook and cranny of that particular cargo area.

So I decided to look at some numbers.
A 5' woman on average would be able to reach in about 23.1" (without bending)
(calculated by taking the average shoulder width dimensions of an American female at 14.4" then reducing that from the average armspan of someone that is 5' and cutting that in half.)
I don't know the height of the tailgate on the R1S (somebody help me with this and the cargo dimensions behind the 3rd row) but I'm going to guess around 18-22" (Ford Maverick is 25" for reference). Depending on where this "hits" the shorter person will limit how much they can lean in to the cargo area.

In the end I think you are correct that it has the potential to make it more difficult for the vertically challenged among us though I think the lifting things over top and setting them down (ie a gallon of milk) will be the bigger challenge especially if the suspension is lifted fairly high.

Not sure why I spent any time on this as I am 6' and my wife is 5'10" ?
99% of the time the 3rd row will be folded flat for us. And likely at least some reasonably high percentage for most users I suspect. I have no need for the 7-seat version, but since it's the same cost, and as far as we know there's literally no benefit to the 5 seat version beyond a 3 degree flatter rear cargo area, it makes sense to opt for the 3rd row just for resale and on the odd chance we ever do need to use it - I think that's going to be most people's position honestly. So the "rear" of the cargo area will be long enough that it will not easily be loadable from the rear with the gate up or the gate out. At least for smaller folks. It's not like you NEED to load things up against the back all the time - I get that but the default operating mode for most 7-seaters is 3rd row down unless needed
 

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kurtlikevonnegut

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Not sure why I spent any time on this as I am 6' and my wife is 5'10" ?
Wow that's crazy that you and your wife are the same height!
 
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RexRemus

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Also, to be clear - I am not "against" it. This thread has revealed a lot of interesting benefit and use cases which is what I was looking for. I still think it might be a mixed-bag for me (or the other smaller people in the household) but I was looking for reasons why they might have opted for splitting it as the list of benefits seemed pretty small to me - like... watermelons not rolling out I get but that's gonna be an infrequent benefit most of the time :D but I do get the gist of having a lip to hold things in being good at times. Rear clearance is another, carrying longer items while still having room for small stuff underneath and hot worrying about it spilling out. There's been a lot of "love" for the split. I am just hoping that in practice i find the same benefits and that they outweigh any possible inconveniences - of which there are at least a few as have also been mentioned.

But that's all, nothing more. This isn't an AA/Carplay rant just a discussion :D
 

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Pro Case Scenario:
- A lot of film crews use split gates and window pop-outs.

Con Case Scenario:
- Explaining deliveries for curbside grocery pickups.

:) I will say for all the baby gear or having children help load the trunk, anything that is automated, saves an extra pair of hands, or time, however miniscule, i'm all for it.
 

SlaterGS

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It's not like you NEED to load things up against the back all the time - I get that but the default operating mode for most 7-seaters is 3rd row down unless needed
Great point. Though split gate or not if you want to load things the whole way against the second row that is a stretch even for taller people.

Not sure I agree with your last statement because it doesn't line up with my own personal use ?
Did I miss a study somewhere that indicates 3 row SUVs are almost always used with the 3rd row down or what leads you to this conclusion? Serious question, not being snarky lol
 

SlaterGS

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Wow that's crazy that you and your wife are the same height!
Is it a rare thing to be this close in height? lol

Edit: Looks like a UK study had the average height difference at 5.6" for couples and another US one at about 6"
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bd5400

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Is it a rare thing to be this close in height? lol

Edit: Looks like a UK study had the average height difference at 5.6" for couples and another US one at about 6"
TIL
This is just a guess...but I'm thinking the joke is that you're probably 5'10" and just tell yourself that you're 6' so you can feel taller than your wife. The general theory is that any male who claims to be exactly 6' tall is likely slighter shorter.

Again, I'm sure it was said as a joke and not an actual accusation :CWL:

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KenJ

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This makes me think of a stupid question; I've seen pictures of the rear fully open. And a few with just the top hatch opened. But *can* you open the bottom tailgate without opening the top hatch?
I can’t think of any car where you can open the bottom without opening the top first (X5, Range Rover, Volvo, etc.). The latch mechanisms overlap.

With or without the split tailgate wasn’t a show stopper for me, but I love it on my X5.
 

dleewla

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Used to own XC90 with split gate and we loved it.

Its a great short surface that you can sit, use it as a table to set things down and occasional extended carrying things beyond the length of cargo space without having the tailgate up or using a roof rack (as long as its flat enough to fit within the bottom gate height).

Volvo used to (may still) have a folding seat that plugged into the hitch receiver that used the bottom split gate as a table for picnic or any other outdoor use.

My guess is that lower gate opening can be used to slide the camp kitchen without having to open the upper gate (to keep the cooking smoke/splatter and what have you) out of the interior cargo space.
as of a couple of months ago, CS told me that you cannot open the lower gate without first opening the upper gate. i asked again today but this person did not know. and new developmet, they said the glass in the rear does flip open! lets hope this CS rep wasn't guessing and thats indeed been added.

personally, i think having the rear glass being able to open is very useful. just gives you a lot of flexibility depending on what you want to load and what you might already have in the back. for example, on long roadtrip/camping, we might have stuff filled in the back space and we dont want to open the entire tailgate to access stuff or it to fall out, so things we need more immediately we'll place at the top of the "pile" and we can get to it easily through the rear glass. or maybe you have something long from Home Depot and its needs to stick out the back, its nice to be able to open the glass instead of having the entire back gate or even split gate open as you transport it.
 
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kurtlikevonnegut

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This is just a guess...but I'm thinking the joke is that you're probably 5'10" and just tell yourself that you're 6' so you can feel taller than your wife. The general theory is that any male who claims to be exactly 6' tall is likely slighter shorter.

Again, I'm sure it was said as a joke and not an actual accusation :CWL:

c69bbiymk8751.jpg
This guy gets it.

One of the saddest things I ever heard was one guy talking to another guy at lunch and he said "I mean I'm 5'11 and a half so I'm basically 6' tall. Being 6'5, anyone under 6'2 looks the same to me: short.
 

mkg3

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as of a couple of months ago, CS told me that you cannot open the lower gate without first opening the upper gate. i asked again today but this person did not know. and new developmet, they said the glass in the rear does flip open! lets hope this CS rep wasn't guessing and thats indeed been added.

personally, i think having the rear glass being able to open is very useful. just gives you a lot of flexibility depending on what you want to load and what you might already have in the back. for example, on long roadtrip/camping, we might have stuff filled in the back space and we dont want to open the entire tailgate to access stuff or it to fall out, so things we need more immediately we'll place at the top of the "pile" and we can get to it easily through the rear glass. or maybe you have something long from Home Depot and its needs to stick out the back, its nice to be able to open the glass instead of having the entire back gate or even split gate open as you transport it.
The bottom gate has to be opened AFTER the top gate. Then, close the top gate, leaving the bottom open is what I originally meant and did with XC90.

If the glass flips open or even cracks open, that would be wonderful. The airflow inside the cabin is dramatically increased if the tailgate window can be opened. The 4-Runner has this part right.
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