Bidirectional Mode Module Failure and Service Experience

[DevSecOps]

(PS, if these warranty terms make you uncomfortable, probably a good time to sell your Rivian.)

Here's the thing about that language, which I previously looked over when they said it was remanned. The language about the pack being of comparable capacity is only in regards to packs that fall under the degradation part of the warranty. There's no language about what you get if it's anything else.

Rivian's pack design isn't really meant to be serviced because the seal has to be damaged to open it. It's a big seal and there's a lot that could go wrong for a vehicle that's designed to have the pack completely submerged in use.

That's true with all packs. From what I was told it's not about sealing it, it's purely about the risk and training associated with working on HV modules that could instantly fry someone.

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[Dark-Fx]

Here's the thing about that language, which I previously looked over when they said it was remanned. The language about the pack being of comparable capacity is only in regards to packs that fall under the degradation part of the warranty. There's no language about what you get if it's anything else.

You missed the last line then. Maybe Rivian should move that into it's own paragraph but it applies to any reason they are replacing the pack.

 

[DevSecOps]

You missed the last line then. Maybe Rivian should move that into it's own paragraph but it applies to any reason they are replacing the pack.

I think people are missing my point. I said before that I understand that they have to do something will packs that need repair. I'm not against remanned packs in general. I'm against them in a 2 month old truck without knowing what I got. I never once even DCFC'd the last pack. The warranty language doesn't guarantee me a pack of equal capacity as that only applies to degradation claims. If Rivian said, we gave you a remanned pack that had a module failure and was 3 months old with 60 cycles on it I would be perfectly fine with that. It would be about the same as what I had.

 

[Dark-Fx]

I think people are missing my point. I said before that I understand that they have to do something will packs that need repair. I'm not against remanned packs in general. I'm against them in a 2 month old truck without knowing what I got. I never once even DCFC'd the last pack. The warranty language doesn't guarantee me a pack of equal capacity as that only applies to degradation claims. If Rivian said, we gave you a remanned pack that had a module failure and was 3 months old with 60 cycles on it I would be perfectly fine with that. It would be about the same as what I had.

It guarantees you will have a pack that will still be eligible for the degradation warranty of >70% when you hit 175,000 miles.

 

[DevSecOps]

It guarantees you will have a pack that will still be eligible for the degradation warranty of >70% when you hit 175,000 miles.

I'm well aware of that. This is my 3rd EV and I've been very active in the EV community for years now.

You realize that those warranties are based on someone who DCFCs 100% of the time to 100% SOC in the middle of the sahara desert right? They are based on worse case scenarios. The reality is that 99.99% of EV owners would never torture their batteries like that and will never have a SOH claim. Therefore, Rivian could easily replace a 100% SOH battery with a 90% SOH battery and likely still feel very comfortable that they would never hit a 70% SOH claim.

Once again, if they replaced the battery with a remanned of like capacity I don't have an issue with that at all. Unfortunately, the warranty language doesn't say that at all for anything other than a degradation claim. I would have preferred that they remanned my pack in the field and just replaced the module.

 

[Dark-Fx]

Once again, if they replaced the battery with a remanned of like capacity I don't have an issue with that at all.

Charge it up to 100% and drive it till it dies, see how much energy the truck says it used. That's all any of us can do to evaluate the state of health of the pack without access to the diagnostics that Rivian has. If you've been in the EV community for a while, I'm both surprised and not surprised (I've been in the EV community for a while) that you're worried about some degradation boogeyman without evaluating it yourself.

 

[connoisseurr]

Todd - it might be worthwhile asking for some sort of extended pack warranty, beyond the standard manufacturer warranty, because you truly have no knowledge if you're getting a pack that has 10 miles or 10,000 miles.

Otherwise, great write-up and glad to see your contributions within this community.

 

[DevSecOps]

Charge it up to 100% and drive it till it dies, see how much energy the truck says it used. That's all any of us can do to evaluate the state of health of the pack without access to the diagnostics that Rivian has. If you've been in the EV community for a while, I'm both surprised and not surprised (I've been in the EV community for a while) that you're worried about some degradation boogeyman without evaluating it yourself.

Ok, I get it, you don't care if you are given like capacity batteries to those that are removed. I do. Battery degradation is not some boogeyman, it's proven battery science. I'm not asking for anything other than what I had replaced. I don't expect 3 year old vehicles to get new packs. Likewise, I don't expect 2 month old vehicles to get 3 year old packs. The remanned pack is something that I said "doesn't sit well with me". It's not the purpose, nor the title of my thread. It's an observation regarding the overall experience.

With Rivian we have no way to track SOH, unlike the other EVs I've owned. Checking capacity by a full cycle run is not perfect science and has far too many variables therefore there's no accurate way to "evaluate it myself". As I said in another post, I'll be watching range.

I have put in a request for information on the battery I received and I'll see what I'm able to extract from Rivian. It could very well be a battery, as I said in my OP, that is brand new that just didn't pass original QC. This could go either way.

 

[kayabusa]

Let me ask you a question, if Rivian included a Battery Health Status Report with the remanufactured battery showing that the battery they are installing has the same capacity and health than the one they took out, should be good enough ?

I'm pretty sure they have that information, the problem is they didn't share it with you, ask the manager if he can source it.

Regarding, having a lose bolt, every time I went for service I found something crocked, fingers marks, scuffs, and so on and I heard other people said the same.

I really afraid of a replacement so complex (like yours) , which a torque not properly applied, wires not properly seat in place, etc etc, could led to other issues in the future.

Thanks for the detailed Experience.

 

[DevSecOps]

Let me ask you a question, if Rivian included a Battery Health Status Report with the remanufactured battery showing that the battery they are installing has the same capacity and health than the one they took out, should be good enough ?

Yes ... That would be perfect.

I'm not asking for any special treatment. I'm not entitled to anything other than what I paid for. I expect only comparable to what was removed, nothing more, nothing less. The only reason I said it should be a new pack is because the truck is only 2 months old, basically new. But if they have a 2 month old remanned pack, that's fine.

 

[mkhuffman]

Todd, this would be a PIA, but you could try running it down to 0% SoCD and charging it to 100%, while monitoring the kW supplied using your HA automation. Then at least you would know the total capacity at that point in time. Maybe do it on a day when the temperature is around 80? I would assume 10% loss for L2 charging, unless someone has figured out a better number for the R1 charger.

 

[Hillbilly]

Maybe there was a soup kitchen in your Rivian. Was there a letter from dirty mike and the boys inside?

 

[NY_Rob]

I would be unhappy with a re-manufactured battery in a 2-month old vehicle if I intended to keep the vehicle for many, many more years. But, if I knew that I would be selling it in a few years I wouldn't lose any sleep over it. The chances of seeing degradation in the next couple year are probably quite minor seeing how Rivian babies their batts on DCFC.

 

[ImAI]

Oh no @DevSecOps
That truck was returned dirty and that they didnt give you a loaner R1T is disappointing to hear. I hope the High Voltage Battery replacement is a rare occurrence and your's was simply a unuique case and not a pattern. I remember our Ford Mach-E fiasko for which I lost confidence in Ford completely.

 

[Budman]

I followed you closely on the MME forum. I had simultaneous orders for the MME and R1T. The R1T actually was delivered quicker by months over the MME estimate. I canceled the MME and have had the R1T for 14 months now. 28,000 miles with no issues.

Best of luck and thanks for your sharing your experiences in thoughtful detail. Keep up the good work for the benefit of the EV community.

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