Rivian knows when you use an aftermarket NACS adapter?

[Brian-MS90D]

This is a really simple one, guys.

Obviously, there is near zero technical credibility to their warning because according to Rivian we can't even use an official Ford adapter when both Ford's and Rivian's are made by Tesla and are both identical. Rivian is simply doing legal CYA because they can and to discourage claims and bad actors.

Next, there is no requirement that we use only the specific official adapter Rivian sends us. We are free to use another's, use Tesla's MagicDock, buy another's second hand, etc.

Next, just because a company announces to the world that they have no liability for XYZ does not make it so. Rivian's position is like Michael Scott in The Office yelling out loud to his coworkers one day to "declare" he is going bankrupt ("I declare bankruptcy!!!"). Rivian's position is also like stadiums and other ticket venues that print on the rear of the ticket that accepting the ticket precludes you from suing for anything; or, the dump trucks with stickers "Not liable for objects falling from truck." Neither of these disclaimers are true and the stadium and dump truck can certainly be liable despite their printed proclamations to the contrary (which are merely to fool and discourage normal people from considering suing).

Finally, if your Rivian (or any EV) melts down at a DC fast charger you will unfortunately have a terrible logistical, financial, and legal mess on your hands even if you used an official adapter. Everyone involved (Charging company, utility, your insurance, you, Rivian, adapter manufacturer, charging real estate owner, etc) is going to defend their positions and probably with attorneys. Negotiations will ensue to determine where the most culpability lies and then settlements will be reached. Unless you did something heinous like try to hotwire a broken station cable directly into your battery pack, judges are not too punishing of every day consumers for doing normal things. There are a lot of trivial things we all do with products that are technically illegal or disallowed by the manufacturer that at the end of the day does not strip you of all rights. And, even when we follow everything to the letter that by no means guarantees we still won't have to fight for our rights (sadly this is probably the most prevalent).

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[SPITmadFIRE]

If Rivian cared, it would certainly be easy for them to mine the data and see who is charging through to Tesla and whether or not they've received an official Rivian adapter. It won't work for too long because as soon as there are a couple thousand adapters out there how are they to say that you didn't use one of theirs? I guess there could be serial numbers or something passed from the Tesla SC to Rivian...

This still has no correlation to who's using Tesla provided adaptors and who isn't. I could be using my friend's approved Ford adaptor for all they know. There's nothing preventing me from doing so, and there's no warranty voiding claim to be made there. They're the same adaptor.

 

[SPITmadFIRE]

Rivian is simply doing legal CYA because they can and to discourage claims and bad actors.

This is absolutely the only element at play here. It would be a mess if Ford or Rivian or any other manufacturer started pursuing or locking out owners for using third party adaptors -- they just want a fighting chance should EVERYONE start using a specific adaptor that causes serious damage to the vehicle or charging infrastructure.

 

[Riviot]

We strongly recommend using the Rivian-approved NACS DC Adapter. It's essential to ensure the safety and integrity of your vehicle, as using non-approved adapters may lead to damage and void warranties.

"Recommend," "may," ... That's a should, not a shall. Charge away with A2Z!

 

[nellbarr]

"Recommend," "may," ... That's a should, not a shall. Charge away with A2Z!

I ordered an A2Z....it MAY be months before I receive the Rivian adapter Took 30 months from order to delivery for my R1s.

 

[strykerwsu]

I just used mine again today. RJ called my cell immediately. All that I could hear in the background was "Someone's Watching Me". Double creepy.

 

[Dave Cundiff]

I call BS. Rivian can't void the battery warranty for using an aftermarket adapter unless they can prove conclusively that the adapter cause a failure. Even then they can't totally void the warranty they could just refuse to cover that repair.

The only way Rivian can know if your using one is to check your account for Tesla billing and then check order history to see if they shipped you their official adapter.

Once UL2252 comes this will be a non issue. Lectron is already building their adapters to meet the new upcoming standard.

Ken, my understanding is that the standard of evidence in civil litigation is generally "preponderance of the evidence," not "prove conclusively."

If Rivian -- hypothetically -- were to determine that an unapproved adapter caused Problem X, anyone challenging that determination would have to show that it was more likely than not that Rivian was wrong.

Rivian has more engineers, attorneys, and cash than I do. I'm just saying....

Best wishes!

 

[rbrak29]

OK I contacted Rivian directly regarding providing a list and verifying when the adapter can be expected. I received the following response which mentions "warranty".

	3:46 PM (34 minutes ago)
to me

Hi Nelida,

I understand you are awaiting your NACS adapter alongside many other Rivian owners and take your concern seriously. At this point of time I have no visibility on what that time line looks like as they are sent out in batches nationwide. We strongly recommend using the Rivian-approved NACS DC Adapter. It's essential to ensure the safety and integrity of your vehicle, as using non-approved adapters may lead to damage and void warranties.

If you opted-in to receive your free adapter, the next step will be an email from us. This email will ask you to confirm your mailing address – indicating your adapter is ready to ship along with a tracking number! Thank you again for your understanding and I thank you personally for being the best part of Rivian.

Your fellow adventurer,

Avar

Got this same email just now.

This is my reply:

I cannot make our two summer trips without an adapter. Ford has delayed shipping their adapters until August. I suspect Rivian will have supply issues as well this summer since I assume it’s made by Tesla as is Ford’s.

We will be starting our first westward trip in mid-June from North Dakota up to Canada, across to Calgary, down to Seattle and back across to Idaho, Montana, and North Dakota towing a 16ft Airstream.

Very few fast CCS chargers in ND or MT. There very few Magic Dock Superchargers west from ND to the west coast, almost none from ND to Calgary.

I bought this truck because it had 410 miles of range (towing) and was on Tesla’s network. Being on the Tesla network means ABSOLUTELY NOTHING without an adapter.

There are many Rivian owners (rivianforums.com) that have purchased and our using NACS adapters from A2K and Lectron with no issues. They are willing to lay down $200 of their own money
and risk possible Rivian repercussions like voided warranties instead of waiting for a Rivian adapter. Summer travel will not wait.

I think it would serve Rivian well to clarify its position on after market NACS adapters from REPUTABLE manufacturers sooner rather than later.

Rivian could start testing them in-house and see if problems arise with Rivian’s charging hardware and software.

Please cc this to RJ for his consideration (wishful thinking).

 

[UnsungZero_OldTimeAdMan]

Got this same email just now.

This is my reply:

I cannot make our two summer trips without an adapter. Ford has delayed shipping their adapters until August. I suspect Rivian will have supply issues as well this summer since I assume it’s made by Tesla as is Ford’s.

We will be starting our first westward trip in mid-June from North Dakota up to Canada, across to Calgary, down to Seattle and back across to Idaho, Montana, and North Dakota towing a 16ft Airstream.

Very few fast CCS chargers in ND or MT. There very few Magic Dock Superchargers west from ND to the west coast, almost none from ND to Calgary.

I bought this truck because it had 410 miles of range (towing) and was on Tesla’s network. Being on the Tesla network means ABSOLUTELY NOTHING without an adapter.

There are many Rivian owners (rivianforums.com) that have purchased and our using NACS adapters from A2K and Lectron with no issues. They are willing to lay down $200 of their own money
and risk possible Rivian repercussions like voided warranties instead of waiting for a Rivian adapter. Summer travel will not wait.

I think it would serve Rivian well to clarify its position on after market NACS adapters from REPUTABLE manufacturers sooner rather than later.

Rivian could start testing them in-house and see if problems arise with Rivian’s charging hardware and software.

Please cc this to RJ for his consideration (wishful thinking).

Moot correspondence and complaint. Tesla can make only so many in any given period of time. And, god knows, recent events over there may have added a speed bump to the already slow process. The adapter is to be given to you FREE. You can't really complain as you are not owed any cash or cash equivalent.

More productive use of time: Go watch State of Charge's reviews on the A2Z and Lectron adapters. Understand what they are and how well they are designed/made. Understand the reasons behind the warning/disclaimer from Rivian (discussed exhaustively in this thread alone). With that understanding, make your own risk assessment. Then, once deciding you do want to take the risk, just order either the A2Z or Lectron. A2Z for sure takes roughly 4 weeks from order to delivery; it's what just about everyone is reporting.

And did you really have to be so specific as to rat this forum and its members out? C'mon man. That was dumb. SMH

 

[rbrak29]

Then, once deciding you do want to take the risk, just order either the A2Z or Lectron. A2Z for sure takes roughly 4 weeks from order to delivery; it's what just about everyone is reporting.

And did you really have to be so specific as to rat this forum and its members out? C'mon man. That was dumb. SMH

I did order an A2Z...four weeks ago.

You think Rivian does not monitor this forum and others? SMH

 

[A2ZEV]

Got this same email just now.

This is my reply:

I cannot make our two summer trips without an adapter. Ford has delayed shipping their adapters until August. I suspect Rivian will have supply issues as well this summer since I assume it’s made by Tesla as is Ford’s.

We will be starting our first westward trip in mid-June from North Dakota up to Canada, across to Calgary, down to Seattle and back across to Idaho, Montana, and North Dakota towing a 16ft Airstream.

Very few fast CCS chargers in ND or MT. There very few Magic Dock Superchargers west from ND to the west coast, almost none from ND to Calgary.

I bought this truck because it had 410 miles of range (towing) and was on Tesla’s network. Being on the Tesla network means ABSOLUTELY NOTHING without an adapter.

There are many Rivian owners (rivianforums.com) that have purchased and our using NACS adapters from A2K and Lectron with no issues. They are willing to lay down $200 of their own money
and risk possible Rivian repercussions like voided warranties instead of waiting for a Rivian adapter. Summer travel will not wait.

I think it would serve Rivian well to clarify its position on after market NACS adapters from REPUTABLE manufacturers sooner rather than later.

Rivian could start testing them in-house and see if problems arise with Rivian’s charging hardware and software.

Please cc this to RJ for his consideration (wishful thinking).

SMH. A2K? You rebranded our whole company with a single email. ?

 

[SANZC02]

I think what people may be missing is that those policies about using after market adapters could be part of the agreement that they signed with Tesla.

There is no reason Tesla could not pump out thousands of these adapters, they are not high tech items, seems like the slow role is by design.

They are being provided free of charge, again probably part of the agreement making it harder to claim a monopoly.

This allows Tesla to slow role the integration of other manufacturers while still claiming to be open.

 

[Electrified Outdoors]

Ken, my understanding is that the standard of evidence in civil litigation is generally "preponderance of the evidence," not "prove conclusively."

If Rivian -- hypothetically -- were to determine that an unapproved adapter caused Problem X, anyone challenging that determination would have to show that it was more likely than not that Rivian was wrong.

Rivian has more engineers, attorneys, and cash than I do. I'm just saying....

Best wishes!

Fair enough. I'm not an attorney of course. The well known and tested adapters are fine to use IMO.

The very sketchy unknown Amazon/ebay special adapters are the ones I would avoid and likely what Rivian is trying to deter owners from using by their language.

I have tested the Tesla/Rivian official adapter. The Lectron adapter feels more solid to me than the official adapter. I have not had the opportunity to test the A2Z unit.

Totally get that some folks want to wait for the official adapter too. To each their own.

 

[rbrak29]

SMH. A2K? You rebranded our whole company with a single email. ?

Brain fart ?
Can I get my adapter by June 13?

 

[agentfive]

I ordered an A2Z....it MAY be months before I receive the Rivian adapter Took 30 months from order to delivery for my R1s.

Same - I need one to do a trip in deep Maine and it doesn't look like the Rivian adaptor is coming soon enough and the A2Z will hopefully get here if not I may borrow a Rivian Adaptor from a neighbor who got the R1T a bit earlier than we did and was in the first round.

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