Need more range for skiing

[Yossarian]

I got a real shocker here. EVs aren't for everyone. But here's the part 2, that's ok.

I get really frustrated with people that try to force EVs on everyone. There are some truly serious downsides to EV ownership and while there are ways to mitigate those downsides, it's acceptable to say "it's not worth it".

Now, there are some serious upsides as well. And for others, it is worth it, that;'s ok too.

True dat.

Folks like the OP, me and several others who've posted on this thread need to use a roof top carrier on their vehicles, EV or ICE. Winter use of the R1S means limited range under all conditions, with or without a roof box, and not just in the more extreme conditions that the OP described. While it looks like the R1S is a solid vehicle for much winter recreational use, that is not universally so.

If your use case involves driving longer distances in winter with a cargo box on your vehicle, the downside for an EV like the R1S - shortened range requiring frequent charging - may have to mean that "it's acceptable to say 'it's not worth it'". A robust and well-distributed charging network would largely mitigate that and while we will get there, we ain't there yet.

Folks like me now have to decide if it's a good bet that will happen sooner rather than later and make our EV decison accordingly.

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[HighVoltOverland]

Has anyone done any testing into the hit of roof cargo vs a hitch box?

That may be a room for gain that at first blush could get back some losses in drag just changing the location of exterior cargo

 

[sub]

Has anyone done any testing into the hit of roof cargo vs a hitch box?

That may be a room for gain that at first blush could get back some losses in drag just changing the location of exterior cargo

Hitch mount gets significantly better range.

 

[runwithscissors]

It seems like you’re just not ready for an EV yet. Admittedly the support infrastructure is a work in progress. It is well known that a cargo box, speed, temp, tires and altitude climb are things that affect range (it seems like conserve mode would be inappropriate for OPs particular ride?). Manage your own expectations and be an educated owner…or wait to be an owner until it suits you. The Rivian batteries are already ridiculously large….its the efficiency that needs to be improved….the answer most definitely is not trying to cram in more battery…

I enjoy it but it's not for the masses yet. NACS will help tremendously on road trips but we've essentially bought into an early product with a lot of inefficiencies since it's such new tech. People want to reliably get from point A to point B and that's just not how it is with Rivian. The maps are so outdated and give no context to charging availability on road trips. Do I soft reboot the infotainment or hard reboot it? All these workarounds are just not something that most people want to deal with when driving. They don't want to open all these different applications on their phones, do calculations and suffer with the frustrations of public charging while going on trips with a family. I bought it for the tech and performance and it delivers but most people I drive in it says it's nice but they would rather stick with ICE cars/trucks and I get that.

 

[Supratachophobia]

I enjoy it but it's not for the masses yet. NACS will help tremendously on road trips but we've essentially bought into an early product with a lot of inefficiencies since it's such new tech. People want to reliably get from point A to point B and that's just not how it is with Rivian. The maps are so outdated and give no context to charging availability on road trips. Do I soft reboot the infotainment or hard reboot it? All these workarounds are just not something that most people want to deal with when driving. They don't want to open all these different applications on their phones, do calculations and suffer with the frustrations of public charging while going on trips with a family. I bought it for the tech and performance and it delivers but most people I drive in it says it's nice but they would rather stick with ICE cars/trucks and I get that.

See, here's another misconception. NACS in and of itself won't fix the problem. European Teslas have CCS ports in Europe, but they can't charge on CCS stations.

Sure it will help if we don't need adapters, no doubt about that. But Tesla needs to push their updates to the superchargers AND change out internal hardware where needed AND test AND finalize billing where needed.

 

[uphill]

Dumb question here out of actual ignorance: what are people putting in those cargo boxes that's worth the significant range hit? I've never needed one and they don't look long enough for skis.

 

[usulio]

Dumb question here out of actual ignorance: what are people putting in those cargo boxes that's worth the significant range hit? I've never needed one and they don't look long enough for skis.

Skis. They just look small because cars are so big. R1S is 16 feet long and skis are only 6.

 

[Sethsak]

Dumb question here out of actual ignorance: what are people putting in those cargo boxes that's worth the significant range hit? I've never needed one and they don't look long enough for skis.

It’s skis.

 

[ads75]

All of the RANs in California really make it simpler.

There are 49 other states.

 

[Cycliste]

Some people on this forum call RAN the California Adventure Network. We have a long way to go.

 

[emoore]

True dat.

Folks like the OP, me and several others who've posted on this thread need to use a roof top carrier on their vehicles, EV or ICE. Winter use of the R1S means limited range under all conditions, with or without a roof box, and not just in the more extreme conditions that the OP described. While it looks like the R1S is a solid vehicle for much winter recreational use, that is not universally so.

If your use case involves driving longer distances in winter with a cargo box on your vehicle, the downside for an EV like the R1S - shortened range requiring frequent charging - may have to mean that "it's acceptable to say 'it's not worth it'". A robust and well-distributed charging network would largely mitigate that and while we will get there, we ain't there yet.

Folks like me now have to decide if it's a good bet that will happen sooner rather than later and make our EV decison accordingly.

The charging network will get much better this year when we get access to most superchargers. And it will only keep getting better. No reason to hold off on a Rivian or an EV.

 

[DTown3011]

It’s skis.

This. If you pack an entire family in the car with gear, boots, ski bags, etc. there is likely nowhere to fit your skis. I have been loving the ski rack on my R1T but of course I don't have a 3rd row and only room for 5. But we used to use a box on the top of our SUV as well.

 

[chrismc]

I discovered just how bad the factory ATs are today- I had my first winter storm drive up the mountain to ski on my new Nokian Hakka LT3 20” snow tires and they are night and day better than the ATs! I highly recommend adding a pair of winter tires if you’ll be spending a lot of time on snow.

You should add new tires to your list of things you can do without hindering your ability to ski.

Road tires(or snow tires) will get you better snow traction than the factory 20" tires in addition to having better range.

Pirelli's all-terrain tires are really bad in the snow.

https://www.tire-reviews.com/Article/2023-Best-All-Terrain-Tires-In-Snow.htm

 

[Tahoe Man]

I feel the same and chalk it up to new battery tech and too small of battery for the truck. It's frustrating to do all the calculations with different apps and show up at charge stations that are unreliable as of now. I will never use my R1S for long distances and will stick to my other ICE vehicles because it will be years before the infrastructure is reliable. I've been burned too many times going to an EA station with 2 out of 4 working and Ioniq's sitting there for free juice. Then I have to wait 40+ minutes because the R1S is slow to charge. Around town and charging at home is great but long trips are just a hassle at this point. Driving below 70 with the heat off and all the other workarounds because of inefficiency is just not a fun experience and it's why the average person should not get an EV until it gets better.

Did you know all this before you bought your truck? I can understand if not, I was approached by someone today, she told me she didn't realize how much range gets hit from the cold weather in her EV.

EVs aren't for everyone and if I was skiing I wouldn't want to be worrying about charging either.

 

[KootenayEV]

I run a Thule Motion Alpine on my R1T and did some controlled testing - it was about a 10% hit in the early fall when it was warm out at ~70mph (110 Canadian mph), I'm guessing it is closer to 12 or even 15% now in colder/denser air. If you go slower, it will be less of an impact by %, and if faster, worse.

As an aside, like another poster, I swapped to Nokian LT3 studded tires. Again in a controlled test, found that they have no measurable hit to efficiency as compared to the 20" Pirelli's.

My general advice would be to:

• slow down by 5 mph next time and see how much difference that makes
• charge to 100%; in the winter it isn't a big deal; you just don't want to leave it for a few days in summer heat like that
• I agree you should try the box in different positions and do a controlled test (see my post here for method; I've done the same thing in my R1T now but haven't posted results yet on my blog; see screenshot below though for the table without a lot of context). I suspect a fairing won't really be noticeable, but I've never tested one directly. (I really wanted to mount my ski pod over my truck box, but it wouldn't fit)
• Draft a bit on the freeway if the headwind through the Gorge is particularly bad
• Run Conserve on the bare pavement (look at screenshot below, makes the singled biggest difference). I've been getting up to speed, then switching to Conserve (ie I avoid heavy acceleration/deceleration in Conserve to save wear on the front tires).
• I'm still undecided on running suspension in Low; I don't want to adversely wear my tires so I leave it in Standard for the most part; however, when I really want to stretch range I run Conserve Low - it probably won't affect the tire wear that much.

Note: the right hand table has some problems in that the DH section caused me to 'pin' the efficiency meter, skewing the averages in blue. Look at the values in cyan. The shaded ones match up for comparisons (e.g. for Drive Mode, Test 5 and 6 were run in Lowest and compared Sport to Conserve; ie Conserve is 5% more efficient than Sport in Lowest; and 6% more than All Purpose in Standard Height).

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