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kanundrum

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At least 5 years away if I had to guess.
 

electruck

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I most certainly won't be waiting for solid state batteries but I do hope Rivian is very generous when it comes time to trade my R1S for their next generation tech. Translation: I'm somewhat concerned that the value of my first gen Rivian will effectively be zero when they go solid state.
 

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I wouldn’t be to worried. We will probably be on our second Rivian by then. I don’t see solid state batteries making into mass production for at least 8 more years. Even then the technology will have a premium price.
 

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Random question - we talked about battery degradation, but is there a point will the batteries STOP degrading? Like 50% in 10/15 years?
 

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The interesting thing about these positions is that they're not for reseach/R&D, but rather "Manufacturing Engineering". Also interesting that the description mentions technology partners.

Does Rivian have some solid state battery IP, or already have a partner that does?
 

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electruck suggests that the value of lithium-ion powered Rivian's will collapse on the introduction of a solid state battery. But is that the case?

Shouldn't it be possible to swap out the li-ion battery for a solid state battery? This might require a software adjustment, but I would think this would be a serious option for the long term.

If I'm right, it certainly creates an incentive to look after a vehicle.
 

RobBot

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Shouldn't it be possible to swap out the li-ion battery for a solid state battery? This might require a software adjustment, but I would think this would be a serious option for the long term.
Sure, but battery packs are expensive, and the labor for the swap would be difficult. At very least, it'd lower the value of however much it costs to do the swap, which I imagine would be significant.
 

Reed

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That's true RobBot, it wouldn't be cheap to replace a battery. I would hope there would still be some value in the li-ion battery, either as a second use battery or for recycled materials, to help defray upgrade costs.

Another factor might be the vehicle itself. Can it be replaced with a similar configuration.

My little 2002 Toyota Tacoma is an example of what I'm referring to. There are no new trucks like this available in the US or Canada. If the engine blew out on my truck, and I refused to move up to a bigger vehicle, my only option would be to re-engine the existing truck.

By the way, this isn't an entirely hypothetical comment. A few years back, the frame in my truck rotted out. I was influenced to go along with an expensive frame replacement by Toyota's offer to pick up the majority of the cost. But, I was also reluctant to walk away from a truck size that isn't available in the market anymore.
 

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I most certainly won't be waiting for solid state batteries but I do hope Rivian is very generous when it comes time to trade my R1S for their next generation tech. Translation: I'm somewhat concerned that the value of my first gen Rivian will effectively be zero when they go solid state.
If your rivian is zero, imagine what a gas truck would be
 

jjwolf120

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That's true RobBot, it wouldn't be cheap to replace a battery.
I think unless the vehicle is designed for easy battery replacement (Nio), replacing the battery is probably somewhat similar to replacing the engine in an ICE car.
 

electruck

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electruck suggests that the value of lithium-ion powered Rivian's will collapse on the introduction of a solid state battery. But is that the case?

Shouldn't it be possible to swap out the li-ion battery for a solid state battery? This might require a software adjustment, but I would think this would be a serious option for the long term.

If I'm right, it certainly creates an incentive to look after a vehicle.
In theory, yes. In practice, Rivian has explicitly stated they will not be supporting battery upgrades. They could always change their mind but I suspect this is unlikely.
 

electruck

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If your rivian is zero, imagine what a gas truck would be
ICE vehicles will be on the road for at least another 20 years, their value will not drop immediately because of an improvement in BEV tech. And since not everyone can afford the latest and greatest or to buy a new vehicle of any kind, the second hand market for BEVs should also remain reasonable after the launch of next gen tech. In theory. It's also not clear how aggressively Rivian will pursue trade-ins given they have a second-life strategy for batteries. It will be very interesting to see where the Rivian adventure leads us....
 

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