Rivian Needs a No Re-Sale Clause Now

[Tall_Rider]

100%, Sir. If you're buying a Rivian after this goodwill gesture with intentions to flip it. GTFO, now. If life situations change...totally understand that. A year is reasonable.

PS - That "negative" energy you're feeling is called GREED.

100%, Sir. If you're buying a Rivian after this goodwill gesture with intentions to flip it. GTFO, now. If life situations change...totally understand that. A year is reasonable.

PS - That "negative" energy you're feeling is called GREED.

Not sure what kind of emotional connection you develop with your vehicle or its manufacturer, but being able to freely trade the things you buy with cash a fairly basic right. It's not like Rivian is looking out for you and provides downside risk protection should the price crater because of recession, war or the fact that flaws are uncovered they're new to vehicle manufacture.

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[Keith_Been_Waiting]

I have zero intent to resell. If I actually do get this truck, I intend to keep it, as I usually keep my cars long term. I would sell the used Tesla I bought for our household a few days ago as a stop gap measure, but I always purchased the Tesla with the intent that I will have an EV now, and then once Rivian comes, sell that Tesla..

BUT, there is a No ReSale clause in your actual PreOrder Agreement. It is clause 14

 

[nc10]

How does this qualify as "scalping"? Most of us put in an order b/c we liked a product at the price that was advertised. We didnt corner the market in something to then sell it at an artificially inflated price later on. None of us knew that this massive px increase was coming.

Also, if people w early orders do sell their Rivian, will they get some windfall profit - yes.

............................ Money circulates, it doesnt just stop. Its not a drag on the economy.

If someone is in possession of an asset that now commands a higher price b/c of scarcity or being early, is that bad? ............................................Houses are in short supply now and prices are rising ........................ - should we all sell our houses at the 2019 prices b/c we bought it earlier at a lower price? Should we sell our AMZN stock from 10 years ago at that price? .......................................

Not 100% sure I know what you mean by "this" in the first sentence.

If you have a change of heart, financial difficulties, ok by me to resell at market value. I also think its ok for Rivian to limit sales to actual users of their product initially, ex some circumstances, and not to someone who is buying to immediately resell at higher pricing.

If you owned AMZN stock, for 10 years, your financial support as a AMZN owner helped create value, provides hugely popular services. (understand concerns about how AMZN does business, but hypothetically you did good)

But if someone just buys and locks up products/waiting list slots in tight markets to resell at a quick profit, I don't see the value created. The money circulates, but it could be doing something that creates value. With scalping, I'm just not seeing the value created.

Sell your house at market value.

 

[Drogon]

Not 100% sure I know what you mean by "this" in the first sentence.

If you have a change of heart, financial difficulties, ok by me to resell at market value. I also think its ok for Rivian to limit sales to actual users of their product initially, ex some circumstances, and not to someone who is buying to immediately resell at higher pricing.

If you owned AMZN stock, for 10 years, your financial support as a AMZN owner helped create value, provides hugely popular services. (understand concerns about how AMZN does business, but hypothetically you did good)

But if someone just buys and locks up products/waiting list slots in tight markets to resell at a quick profit, I don't see the value created. The money circulates, but it could be doing something that creates value. With scalping, I'm just not seeing the value created.

Sell your house at market value.

by "this" i mean someone selling their Rivian b/c the price is higher. the ORIGINAL intent was that someone put a reservation in for a product that they liked at the price. the ORIGINAL intent wasnt that you were buying to flip it - no one years ago knew this price increase was going to happen. No one also bought enough reservations to create some sort of artificial secondary market. It would require way too much scale and Rivian would have known this - see two posts above.

As I said in another post, I intend to keep mine. I just dont think anyone should have any rights curtailed on their property they purchased with their own money because the market value of their purchase is now higher.

The windfall profits will find their way into the economy - that is just how money works. You are simply redistributing that money from Rivian and more into customers hands. Those customers will then spend that money elsewhere, or invest it to fund other company's endeavors.

 

[nc10]

by "this" i mean someone selling their Rivian b/c the price is higher. the ORIGINAL intent was that someone put a reservation in for a product that they liked at the price. the ORIGINAL intent wasnt that you were buying to flip it - .............

.................. I just dont think anyone should have any rights curtailed on their property they purchased with their own money because the market value of their purchase is now higher.

The windfall profits will find their way into the economy - that is just how money works. ........

If you buy next month hypothetically, only intending to resell at a higher price, I support Rivian's ability/desire to cancel the sale.

Rights aren't being curtailed. You can choose to accept/decline the hypothetical (or not so hypothetical) contract Rivian is offering.

This specific transaction wasn't associated with an additional product or service or other new value. Not even upgraded paint protection or seat covers for the higher price. Its clearly better if value is created/added with each transaction, and its better if the money goes to the value creator.

 

[mgc0216]

Just a thought here, but with the reliance of these vehicles on ongoing technology and updated software, I wonder if companies like Rivian, if not allowed to restrict resale, could refuse certain updates that diminish/restrict functionality in the event of an ownership change within a stated period of time.

Along these lines: If you buy a membership into Disney Vacation Club on the secondary market you are severely restricted in where you can travel with that membership. Whereas if you buy "new" from Disney you have no restrictions.

 

[LoneStar]

BUT, there is a No ReSale clause in your actual PreOrder Agreement. It is clause 14

Big difference between Rivian sniffing-out that they "believe the intent to resell" is there (and canceling the order) and trying to intervene or interdict in a subsequent resale of a vehicle. They have no recourse or mechanism to "unsell" you the vehicle, not to mention the tax incentives that come the moment ownership transfer happens with the original sale from Rivian. Are they going to work with the feds and state officials to recoup it for tax evasion?

 

[westwinter]

Fuck that. Who's side are you on sucker?

 

[Mr.Bourne]

Nah... I have zero plans to sell my truck but I don't particularly like someone telling me what I can and can't do.

Epic amount of flipping coming. The teeth-gnashers will be some of the first to flip. Built in 25k “profit” for being a preorder holder.

 

[Sgt Beavis]

Epic amount of flipping coming. The teeth-gnashers will be some of the first to flip. Built in 25k “profit” for being a preorder holder.

Yea, I can see that happen. But the best way for Rivian doing that is to build enough trucks that they market doesn’t exist.

For me, this will be my first BEV. I’ll keep it for a minimum of a year to make sure it fits within my life. If it doesn’t, then I’d flip it. If it does, I’ll keep if for at least 5 years.

 

[Zoidz]

Let someone who sells us something dictate what we can and can't do with it after we pay our hard earned money for it???? Can't sell it, can't let someone else use it, can't make changes to it, etc.......No way!!!!!

Oh snap.......... Software license agreements..... ?

Seriously, it's just wrong to encourage/allow a manufacturer of a hard good to impose major restrictions on its use or resale. What if I really hate my Rivian after buying it - I can't sell it for a year?

 

[SeaGeo]

What if I really hate my Rivian after buying it - I can't sell it for a year?

Or need the money because you walked out of your job because they cut you off from the snack closet.

 

[Tall_Rider]

If you buy next month hypothetically, only intending to resell at a higher price, I support Rivian's ability/desire to cancel the sale.

Rights aren't being curtailed. You can choose to accept/decline the hypothetical (or not so hypothetical) contract Rivian is offering.

This specific transaction wasn't associated with an additional product or service or other new value. Not even upgraded paint protection or seat covers for the higher price. Its clearly better if value is created/added with each transaction, and its better if the money goes to the value creator.

I cannot understand why you want to curtail your rights while accepting downside risk in some misguided attempt to protect Rivian. An individual buying a Rivian, deciding for WHATEVER reason they do that they no longer want it and potentially reselling for a profit does not harm Rivian in any way.

 

[Surfnturf]

Pretty sure we as consumers have rights to do whatever we want with a product we own. I know there is a clause from Rivian but that implies Pre order status. Rivian can't tell us what to do with our vehicle when title has changed hands. If Rivian is selling to an employee or someone affiliated with Rivian I can see there being a clause for a period of time. But in my case if I go through with my order of the R1S without even seeing the color, interior space, test drive, etc. and find out the vehicle is too small for my family of five then I am for sure going to try and resell it. Rivian can't tell me that I can't....

 

[lefkonj]

Have these ever really been enforceable? I own the vehicle, I can burn it down, give it pink spots or sell it.

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