Study on EV battery lifespan yields 'shocking' (positive) results

[SANZC02]

This is an interesting study on EV battery life. Granted there is not a lot of EVs on the road to get real long term numbers but this should help people concerned about premature wear.

Researchers make surprising discovery about lifespan of EV batteries: ‘That was a shock’

https://www.yahoo.com/news/researchers-surprising-discovery-lifespan-ev-110000330.html

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[COdogman]

It is interesting. I had no data to back it up, but I always felt like the rest of the truck will be more likely to fall apart before the battery degrades or dies.

I do wonder if they surveyed charging behavior. Will be interesting to see how this plays out as more EVs age.

 

[Blueassassin]

" replacing an EV battery can range from $5,000 to $22,000"

Anyone have any idea what a Rivian full battery replacement might be when the time comes? Something tells me more than that.

 

[Blueassassin]

Also I Rivian should add a battery life into the settings just like an Iphone. Would be usfull for just knowing and also if you were to buy a used car you can tell how the battery has been treated, what kind of life it has left.

 

[Killer95Stang]

I would consider the battery in an EV to be equivalent to engine in an ICE vehicle. Hundreds of click bait articles focus on a $20k battery replacement. In an ICE veh that costs $75k - $100k new, the engine replacement is $15k on the low end and $25k - $30k on the high end. People resisting EV's focus on the good Ole days when you could swap an engine in a weekend in your driveway. Cars are so complex now that those days have passed. Instead replacing one battery in the life of an EV, is being made out to be worse than the "death by a 1000 knives" of owning a new ICE car.

And don't get me wrong, I'm still an ICE owner with a couple hotrods, a truck I love and probably a couple more ICE purchases before I'm done... But my mind is changing....

 

[Skigh]

" replacing an EV battery can range from $5,000 to $22,000"

Anyone have any idea what a Rivian full battery replacement might be when the time comes? Something tells me more than that.

I had mine replaced after a critical battery failure. I asked out of curiosity how much the replacement would have cost me if I had to pay out of pocket and was reluctantly told that it would have been approximately 50k.

 

[tosehee]

I had mine replaced after a critical battery failure. I asked out of curiosity how much the replacement would have cost me if I had to pay out of pocket and was reluctantly told that it would have been approximately 50k.

Sadly, I think that's the actual cost includign the labor.. idk where they got this $5-20k from, but that's far from the reality.

 

[TexasBob]

Sadly, I think that's the actual cost includign the labor.. idk where they got this $5-20k from, but that's far from the reality.

The cost Rivian pays for a 135 kwh battery pack will be around $18,000 today (industry average $130 kwh ev pack price). The projected cost of the same pack in 2028 is $9,000. Even with markup and labor, a sub $20k replacement cost five years from now is reasonable but it will also be unnecessary since everything will still be under warranty (+/-) in any case.

 

[tosehee]

The cost Rivian pays for a 135 kwh battery pack will be around $18,000 today (industry average $130 kwh ev pack price). The projected cost of the same pack in 2028 is $9,000. Even with markup and labor, a sub $20k replacement cost five years from now is reasonable but it will also be unnecessary since everything will still be under warranty (+/-) in any case.

Will have to see.. Buddy of mine drives Tesla S and he had a faulty battery right before the warranty expiry. He got quoted for 40k if it wasn't covered...

I am hoping that the battery costs go like as you mentioned, but if the EVs are projected to go high, I am not so sure if it'll acutally go down.

Same goes for labor.. The laborat 2028 is not going to be same..

 

[TexasBob]

This is an interesting study on EV battery life. Granted there is not a lot of EVs on the road to get real long term numbers but this should help people concerned about premature wear.

Researchers make surprising discovery about lifespan of EV batteries: ‘That was a shock’

https://www.yahoo.com/news/researchers-surprising-discovery-lifespan-ev-110000330.html

We have known for awhile that battery packs can take 1000+ cycles without too much strain or degradation (300,000 miles on a Rivian). We have seen good data that even frequent DCFC charging does not affect that. So EVs for high duty cycle / high mileage applications are very good.

What is less positive is the aging that happens with time. The same recurrent database indicates that vehicles are losing ~8-10% of their capacity in the first six years regardless of mileage. OTOH, it seems to level off after 10% and the decline gets extremely slow. But the only vehicles on the road for ten years at this point are a handful of Model S from Tesla (and some poj Leafs that do not count because of their terrible battery design).

 

[R1Thor]

The cost Rivian pays for a 135 kwh battery pack will be around $18,000 today (industry average $130 kwh ev pack price). The projected cost of the same pack in 2028 is $9,000. Even with markup and labor, a sub $20k replacement cost five years from now is reasonable but it will also be unnecessary since everything will still be under warranty (+/-) in any case.

Will have to see.. Buddy of mine drives Tesla S and he had a faulty battery right before the warranty expiry. He got quoted for 40k if it wasn't covered...

I am hoping that the battery costs go like as you mentioned, but if the EVs are projected to go high, I am not so sure if it'll acutally go down.

Same goes for labor.. The laborat 2028 is not going to be same..

Bear in mind that with time comes opportunity. If Rivian is even partially successful, there WILL be aftermarket (non-OEM) options. It just happens. Competition and all of that. And with EV/Battery/tech in general always finding its footing with time, the price of these items will be subject to competition.

And if EV mass adoption does take off (whether through legislation or natural selection), your local garages will have to adapt and will start to wrench on them. Or they'll go out of business and someone who will then takes their place.

Right to repair laws and Moss-Magnuson warranty (similar) acts will prevent Rivian from keeping everything in-house-proprietary forever. I think the second we start seeing R1s out of warranty who want to have someone else working on their vehicles, this will become a very real situation and Rivian will have to let go of their control.

Bottom line: time will tell, but I would anticipate, if nothing else, the costs of replacing or refurbishing/refabricating batteries will come down to more reasonable levels.

 

[SeaGeo]

I do wonder if they surveyed charging behavior. Will be interesting to see how this plays out as more EVs age.

There was a recent "study" looking at the impacts of DCFC on Tesla's and their interpretation was that it had a negligible impact on battery health.

 

[Mjl]

" replacing an EV battery can range from $5,000 to $22,000"

Anyone have any idea what a Rivian full battery replacement might be when the time comes? Something tells me more than that.

You can get a quote now, but when it's time to change in ~15 years who knows what the price will be. I'm guessing quite a bit lower.

 

[SDH]

The cost Rivian pays for a 135 kwh battery pack will be around $18,000 today (industry average $130 kwh ev pack price). The projected cost of the same pack in 2028 is $9,000. Even with markup and labor, a sub $20k replacement cost five years from now is reasonable but it will also be unnecessary since everything will still be under warranty (+/-) in any case.

So about the same price as a fender prang then?!

 

[SANZC02]

We have known for awhile that battery packs can take 1000+ cycles without too much strain or degradation (300,000 miles on a Rivian). We have seen good data that even frequent DCFC charging does not affect that. So EVs for high duty cycle / high mileage applications are very good.

What is less positive is the aging that happens with time. The same recurrent database indicates that vehicles are losing ~8-10% of their capacity in the first six years regardless of mileage. OTOH, it seems to level off after 10% and the decline gets extremely slow. But the only vehicles on the road for ten years at this point are a handful of Model S from Tesla (and some poj Leafs that do not count because of their terrible battery design).

That has been my experience. I have a 7 year old Tesla, free Supercharging so probably 90% of the charging has been DCFC. I’m down about 8% from new and the first 5% was in the first 3 years. Seen very little drop off in last 2 years.

Edit: Thought I would add my usage. Rarely have the car plugged in. Drive it normally to low between 20% and 40% then charge to 80%. Occasionally will charge to 100% just to see what the degradation is but do not let it sit below 30% or above 80%. Has been below 10% several times on trips, do not waste my time going above 95% unless checking degradation.

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