Q4 2024 Gross Profit of $170M for Rivian

[Mark_AZR1T]

Did they not say they made a profit?

They’re still losing money on every vehicle sold. While they’ve made progress, profitability isn’t happening with the R1 lineup. Their reported profit came from $299M in regulatory credit sales ($613M if you include software and services)—not actual vehicle sales. They’re losing at least $10K per vehicle, and RJ didn’t address this issue.

Edit: There's a key difference between total gross profit and per-vehicle gross profit. I'm fully committed to Rivian—owning two, holding stock, and strategically cost-averaging my investments. R2 is Rivian’s defining moment, and there’s every reason to believe they’ll succeed. But it all comes down to one thing… Service. Support. Service. Support. Service. Support.

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[risingphoenix]

While Rivian has made some missteps, they are WAY ahead of the Tesla curve at this point. Tesla also used the energy credits for YEARS to make their bottom line look good. Tesla didn't have their first profitable quarter until 2013, and that took a decade. There will be many many current Model Y owners that will jump to the R2 as long as it is available in a year. We now know Rivian can survive until then. As long as the R2 launch, reliability and service are on pace or improved., Rivian will likely survive and succeed long term, regardless of the Georgia situation.

 

[good2go]

They’re still losing money on every vehicle sold. While they’ve made progress, profitability isn’t happening with the R1 lineup. Their reported profit came from $299M in regulatory credit sales ($613M if you include software and services)—not actual vehicle sales. They’re losing at least $10K per vehicle, and RJ didn’t address this issue.

Edit: There's a key difference between total gross profit and per-vehicle gross profit. I'm fully committed to Rivian—owning two, holding stock, and strategically cost-averaging my investments. R2 is Rivian’s defining moment, and there’s every reason to believe they’ll succeed. But it all comes down to one thing… Service. Support. Service. Support. Service. Support.

What is included in per vehicle profit? I have never seen it published.

I have seen people take total revenue divided by number of vehicles. Have you seen differently.

 

[Wispitgood]

https://rivian.com/newsroom/article/rivian-releases-fourth-quarter-full-year-2024-financial-results

RJ Scaringe, Founder and CEO, Rivian said:

“This quarter we achieved positive gross profit and removed $31,000 in automotive cost of goods sold per vehicle delivered in Q4 2024 relative to Q4 2023.

If you can, invest in Rivian!

 

[Mark_AZR1T]

What is included in per vehicle profit? I have never seen it published.

I have seen people take total revenue divided by number of vehicles. Have you seen differently.

I'm a physics major not a corporate accountant, but you can’t simply divide total corporate profit by vehicle sales, as other revenue streams—like the $699M mentioned above—skew the numbers.

Profit per vehicle is determined by comparing revenue from vehicle sales to the variable costs of production. This is separate from overall corporate profitability. The real question isn’t if they’re losing money per vehicle, but how much—and few clearly define what "variable costs" actually include.

The biggest surprise? They slashed per-vehicle costs by $31,000! That’s a massive win and a clear sign they either have a solid grasp on what they’re doing or at least a clear path to making it all work.

 

[good2go]

I'm a physics major not a corporate accountant, but you can’t simply divide total corporate profit by vehicle sales, as other revenue streams—like the $699M mentioned above—skew the numbers.

Profit per vehicle is determined by comparing revenue from vehicle sales to the variable costs of production. This is separate from overall corporate profitability. The real question isn’t if they’re losing money per vehicle, but how much—and few clearly define what "variable costs" actually include.

The biggest surprise? They slashed per-vehicle costs by $31,000! That’s a massive win and a clear sign they either have a solid grasp on what they’re doing or at least a clear path to making it all work.

You may be right. I have never seen published cost of goods sold. I have only seen napkin math say they lose x per vehicle.

 

[Oldsmobile_Mike]

"The housing market will never crash"

"Nobody will ever need more than 640k of RAM".

????

Sorry for the OT but I had to. This thread was reminding me of that.

But more on-topic, how are you folks calculating loss-per-vehicle? Granted I didn't watch the presentation yet, but seems like that would be a "big number" that should have been at the top of the report? I would've expected, if it was 39k before, and they reduced it by 31k, to be around 8k?

 

[Oldsmobile_Mike]

If you can, invest in Rivian!

Hey now, some of us are still buying shares to try to get our average down from buying too many at that IPO price, LOL. ?

 

[kurtlikevonnegut]

I'm a physics major not a corporate accountant, but you can’t simply divide total corporate profit by vehicle sales, as other revenue streams—like the $699M mentioned above—skew the numbers.

There are also the costs that aren't directly associated with vehicle production that are significant and skew the numbers. Things like service center buildout, R&D for future models, capital expenditures to improve the Normal facility for R2 etc. For a company in Rivian's situation these costs are significantly higher than an established manufacturer. The longer Rivian is in operation, the more these costs are amortized and the smaller % of the total net profit (or loss) they become.

The fact that software has become a profit center for them, IMO, is a big deal. The only other manufacturer for whom software is a profit and not a cost is likely Tesla and it demonstrates that Rivian is providing value through software to offset some of their other costs. For electric vehicles this is a significant development.

 

[mkg3]

You may be right. I have never seen published cost of goods sold. I have only seen napkin math say they lose x per vehicle.

Need to read the income statement. It's in every shareholder letter as well as 10Q and 10K filings. Its an SEC filing requirement and FAAS.

The cost of goods sold (COGS) is listed as cost of revenue in Rivian's financial performance sheet. For Q4 its $1.564B against $1.734B in total revenues. The difference is the gross profit and gross margin.

In the total revenue includes regulatory credits and SW services. When you subtract that out, you can see how much they lost per vehicle.

When 10K comes out, you should see it for the consolidated year. In the shareholder letter pro forma, you need to add up the cost of revenue broken out in several categories to come up with the annual total.

 

[AARivian48]

how come stock is going down today? it seems like these are good news... I thought good news and new partnerships meant stock should be doing better.

 

[kurtlikevonnegut]

how come stock is going down today? it seems like these are good news... I thought good news and new partnerships meant stock should be doing better.

If you haven't given up trying to understand why $RIVN moves the way it does, I don't know what to tell you.

 

[savethemanual]

If you haven't given up trying to understand why $RIVN moves the way it does, I don't know what to tell you.

Yup, obviously have not been following the ticker that long

 

[Carscott]

In the webcast Clair said more tri motors were manufactured due to a component supply chain restriction of a specific part of the enduro motor. Anyone know what this is? My guess is the inverter chip.

 

[savethemanual]

In the webcast Clair said more tri motors were manufactured due to a component supply chain restriction of a specific part of the enduro motor. Anyone know what this is? My guess is the inverter chip.

https://www.rivianforums.com/forum/...ts-shortage-copper-windings-for-motors.34173/

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