BYD construction site in Brazil shut over ‘slavery-like’ conditions

[Zoidz]

The Guardian

This is what the US auto industry is faced with - apparently BYD will do anything to be the lowest overhead manufacturer while circumventing import regulations by manufacturing abroad? How could anyone even consider buying a BYD knowing this is how the company operates? Yes, it is a construction contractor working for BYD, but BYD certainly knows about this.

"Brazilian authorities have halted the construction of a factory for the Chinese electric vehicle company BYD, after they found more than 160 Chinese nationals living in “slavery-like” conditions.

The workers, based in a construction site in the north-eastern Brazilian state Bahia, were found to be labouring for excessive hours – sometimes for seven days straight – and living in “degrading” accommodation.

The workers, who were hired by a contractor called Jinjiang Construction Brazil, were said to be unable to leave without permission, and more than 100 had their passports withheld. The workers were hired in China and brought to Brazil.

The investigation found that workers were forced to sleep on beds without any mattresses, and more than 600 workers had been sharing eight portable toilets which were in a “deplorable state”, lacking toilet paper and water.

A lack of kitchen space also meant food was being stored near bathrooms and in unsanitary conditions, and prepared meals were found left open on the floor, exposed to dirt and without being refrigerated. Most workers were forced to eat their meals in their beds.

“The conditions found in the lodgings revealed an alarming picture of precariousness and degradation,” the prosecutors said."

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[Erik+]

That popped up for me this morning on the news as well. I do not think it is surprising.

 

[jeeden]

The Guardian

How could anyone even consider buying a BYD knowing this is how the company operates? Yes, it is a construction contractor working for BYD, but BYD certainly knows about this.

Well, I mean, tons of people buy iPhones and it is pretty well documented how the workers are treated there even though Apple has a standard they want their manufacturers to adhere to. A relative of mine was in the plastics manufacturing industry for years and traveled to China and Thailand several times to look at companies they were considering purchasing parts from and he was shocked every time by what he saw (people sitting inside of steel stamping machines while the presses came down around them so they could remove parts faster when it opened, open burning piles of coal on the floor of a warehouse that a rotational molding machine would rotate over for plastic molding, etc)

I am not trying to get political here, but we just had an election where in surveys a majority of people said they prioritized the price of a gallon of gas and the cost of staples like eggs over a LOT of other issues and those are only a couple of dollars per purchase/couple of hundred dollars a year

So many people say that cost isn't their only priority on purchases, but then act differently. Think of all the complaints there are about no android auto and apple carplay (I think it is funny BTW that the complaints have turned into no carplay only... if you ask most iPhone users what phone they think is used most in the world, they will tell you iPhone... what a bubble), if the R1S and R1T were half the price they are now, you would still have complaints, but I think less of them. It's because most are focused on no AA/carplay at this price point

Anyway, I'm with you, I like the competition of BYD because it will force the US and European manufacturers to play in the EV space and competition is always good, but yea... there are a lot of people in this world that really suffer and it isn't right.

 

[COdogman]

Very sad, but not surprising. Too many want us to join this race to the bottom....

 

[NY_Rob]

Sad, but not surprising if you watch the excellent documentary "American Factory" which contrasts the differences in work culture where the billionaire Chinese owner of the company who makes the windshield for Rivian sets up a glass factory in the USA. It's an eye opener for sure!

 

[Donald Stanfield]

This is what tariffs are for. We cannot force the Chinese government to treat their workers like humans but we can add a premium to all of their products to keep countries that do treat their workers like human beings competitive with China.

 

[NY_Rob]

^ Well said Donald!

 

[Riviot]

How could anyone even consider buying a BYD knowing this is how the company operates?

Because they're cheaper, even after 100% tariff. See: any Walmart on Black Friday #America

Anyone who has served in the Middle East, Africa, or WESTPAC and knows what a TCN is won't be surprised by this. Plenty of other "host" countries do the same thing. The surprise is they got called out for it.

 

[jeeden]

This is what tariffs are for. We cannot force the Chinese government to treat their workers like humans but we can add a premium to all of their products to keep countries that do treat their workers like human beings competitive with China.

Assuming it was focused on vehicles sure, but it doesn't work like that for most things. The only way to be competitive in most industries is through innovation, not through restrictions on competitors. For a country like China, they have the resources to wait you out until your own industries fall behind or fail. Tariffs won't keep the countries competitive for a number of reasons, but these are the main ones...

1. Some of these products are made so cheaply that even a 100% tariff added to the price of the product passed on to consumers still allows that product to be vastly cheaper than the competitor product. Example: If BYD sells a car for 10k and you make it 20k, it is still cheaper than nearly every car made in America. If it does kill their sales, you are still hindering the benefits the US would get from those cars like reduced emissions, the workforce doesn't learn how to modify, improve, repair, and operate that new tech that might be better than ours, and secondary industries don't rise, prosper, or improve like charging companies, infrastructure, better/different tires, etc.

2. Some of those products can only be purchased from those countries so the choice is either to pay a fortune for them as the tariff is passed on to the consumer or to go without. Example: The perfect example of this right now is solar cells. They are making fences out of them in Europe they are so cheap worldwide, but in this country they are expensive or don't get them at all.

3. Some of the products you put the tariffs on serve not only the "bad" countries but the "good" countries. For example, a window switch that is made in China is sold to both BYD and Rivian so Rivian suffers as well. Even if you said forget the components and worry about the end product only, by putting a tariff on a BYD car, you then make the demand for the window switch drop which makes the window switch company raise their price to Rivian or go out of business and kill supply.

4. Those "bad" countries will pass retaliatory tariffs on the products of the "good" countries and it will tank those countries other industries. Example: you tariff BYD vehicles, then China might tariff incoming meat, tractors, or something like that


The best way to make them treat their employees better is to innovate and create products that require a well educated, motivated, and happy workforce to make the item that is better than anything they can produce without that type of workforce. Even then, it is tough if they just dont' care.

 

[UnsungZero_OldTimeAdMan]

Reminds me of that American Factory documentary.

 

[Donald Stanfield]

Assuming it was focused on vehicles sure, but it doesn't work like that for most things. The only way to be competitive in most industries is through innovation, not through restrictions on competitors. For a country like China, they have the resources to wait you out until your own industries fall behind or fail. Tariffs won't keep the countries competitive for a number of reasons, but these are the main ones...

1. Some of these products are made so cheaply that even a 100% tariff added to the price of the product passed on to consumers still allows that product to be vastly cheaper than the competitor product. Example: If BYD sells a car for 10k and you make it 20k, it is still cheaper than nearly every car made in America. If it does kill their sales, you are still hindering the benefits the US would get from those cars like reduced emissions, the workforce doesn't learn how to modify, improve, repair, and operate that new tech that might be better than ours, and secondary industries don't rise, prosper, or improve like charging companies, infrastructure, better/different tires, etc.

2. Some of those products can only be purchased from those countries so the choice is either to pay a fortune for them as the tariff is passed on to the consumer or to go without. Example: The perfect example of this right now is solar cells. They are making fences out of them in Europe they are so cheap worldwide, but in this country they are expensive or don't get them at all.

3. Some of the products you put the tariffs on serve not only the "bad" countries but the "good" countries. For example, a window switch that is made in China is sold to both BYD and Rivian so Rivian suffers as well. Even if you said forget the components and worry about the end product only, by putting a tariff on a BYD car, you then make the demand for the window switch drop which makes the window switch company raise their price to Rivian or go out of business and kill supply.

4. Those "bad" countries will pass retaliatory tariffs on the products of the "good" countries and it will tank those countries other industries. Example: you tariff BYD vehicles, then China might tariff incoming meat, tractors, or something like that


The best way to make them treat their employees better is to innovate and create products that require a well educated, motivated, and happy workforce to make the item that is better than anything they can produce without that type of workforce. Even then, it is tough if they just dont' care.

1. Then put a more significant tariff on there. It doesn't have to stop at 100%; it could be 1000% or 10,000% or 1,000,000%. There isn't some arbitrary limit at 100%, so this doesn't matter. Secondly, China doesn't have the resources you think it does, and its economy is in trouble right now.

2. Why can some products only be purchased from these companies? Because we aren't making them. If we made them, we could buy them from our own country. It is basic supply and demand, if the tariff is set high enough that domestic manufacturers become viable then we will make those products here assuming there is enough demand for them.

3. Again, with the fallacy that China is the only company capable of producing certain products. The supply chain can be altered to make this not the case. Also, dropping demand for a product doesn't cause the company to raise the price. Lowered demand reduces prices, not raises them.

4. These "bad," your word, countries ALREADY DO NOT allow our products to be sold there. To sell something in China, you must make it there. That's why companies like Tesla have factories in China; you cannot sell a car without it because of their TARIFFS. That is why we have the trade imbalance we do, and imposing tariffs would only cause a move toward trade equilibrium. Not only this, but China doesn't respect our intellectual property rights. If a company like Apple makes a product in China, the Chinese government allows and encourages their companies to rip off Apple's designs and introduce products that directly compete with Apple using Apple's proprietary technology. Our government has been asleep at the wheel over the outright theft by the Chinese of American innovation.

 

[Zoidz]

Well, I mean, tons of people buy iPhones and it is pretty well documented how the workers are treated there even though Apple has a standard they want their manufacturers to adhere to. A relative of mine was in the plastics manufacturing industry for years and traveled to China and Thailand several times to look at companies they were considering purchasing parts from and he was shocked every time by what he saw (people sitting inside of steel stamping machines while the presses came down around them so they could remove parts faster when it opened, open burning piles of coal on the floor of a warehouse that a rotational molding machine would rotate over for plastic molding, etc)

I am not trying to get political here, but we just had an election where in surveys a majority of people said they prioritized the price of a gallon of gas and the cost of staples like eggs over a LOT of other issues and those are only a couple of dollars per purchase/couple of hundred dollars a year

So many people say that cost isn't their only priority on purchases, but then act differently. Think of all the complaints there are about no android auto and apple carplay (I think it is funny BTW that the complaints have turned into no carplay only... if you ask most iPhone users what phone they think is used most in the world, they will tell you iPhone... what a bubble), if the R1S and R1T were half the price they are now, you would still have complaints, but I think less of them. It's because most are focused on no AA/carplay at this price point

Anyway, I'm with you, I like the competition of BYD because it will force the US and European manufacturers to play in the EV space and competition is always good, but yea... there are a lot of people in this world that really suffer and it isn't right.

C'mon, this goes well beyond the conditions at Apple products factories in China. From what we have seen, those factory workers in China have a bed to sleep in, rest rooms with water and TP, food prepared and stored in a sanitary facility, a place to eat, etc.

 

[kurtlikevonnegut]

A company from Xinjiang "hired" them?

.....right.

 

[DuoRivians]

Shocked

 

[DucRider]

The workers, who were hired by a contractor called Jinjiang Construction Brazil, were said to be unable to leave without permission, and more than 100 had their passports withheld. The workers were hired in China and brought to Brazil.

Lots of finger pointing at both BYD and the Chinese Government. Not sure what the ties are to this contractor.

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