What Else Are You Considering?

What Else Are You Considering (Among Electric Vehicles)?


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TessP100D

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I think the Ford will appeal to many people and loyal Ford customers. They build a very good product.

however the CT has way more range for less money and of course the best feature is the super charging network.





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TeslaToRivian

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Well, we still have a Tesla Model X (refresh) and logged into today and it again changed from a November 2021 estimated delivery to a January 2022 estimated delivery.

Kind of happy about that since the R1S is larger/nicer looking and less complicated, along with like $20-25K cheaper.

Hoping that the LE R1S still holds true for delivery in Aug-Nov/Dec at latest with some confirmation and it will then be a no brained to cancel the Tesla order :)
Been with Tesla since 2012. Sold Model X to buy a refresh and canceled. Really hope Rivian comes through!
 
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TeslaToRivian

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Thanks for sharing. Good to know.
The story is actually a bit more involved. I doubt anyone here wants to hear it, but in the you are bored, here goes:

I have been a huge Tesla advocate for years. I was with the company from the beginning. In the early years, the customer service was amazing and the overall experience in owning a Tesla was unparalleled. As the company grew, customer service deteriorated significantly. Tesla's are known for having bugs and quarks that need to be repaired or replaced. But, you put up with them because the car is otherwise amazing and they generally fix the bugs for free. These days, getting an appointment is extremely hard. You have to use the app, as no one seems to ever answer the phone. On top of this, the things that made Tesla great started to fade away. Unlimited charging went away. Tesla then made it hard to get XM radio in new vehicles. Instead, offering streaming services. By the way, you no longer have a data plan with your vehicle, but you can buy one... Elon is very wise, and is building a self-sustaining ecosystem that makes the company money. Wise, but it just didn't feel like the company I got behind years ago.

Fast forward to late 2020 and I was having issues connecting my car to my home network. I need that connection to remotely turn on the climate in the cold weather months. It simply failed to connect reliably and I learned it was related to Tesla hardware and software, and that replacing some parts would solve the problem. I begged and pleaded with service to replace the part, but they refused. I then realized that selling my Model X P100D and buying a new one would be a lower monthly payment and would solve my car's computer issues (shortly after buying my Model X, the price plummeted by 20-30k - another kick in the rocks).

Soooo, I test drove a 2020 version, but was inside-tipped by the service advisors, that a "refresh" was around the corner. I called and asked would happen if I ordered one, and the price then went up. In no uncertain terms, I was told I would be grandfathered on the price. I sell my car and order the new one right before the refresh, only to learn that the price I locked in on was no longer offered - I'd have to pay $20k more than what I expected to get back into a comparable vehicle ($30k if you want Full Self Driving). Needless to say, I was unhappy, but I agreed to it, since I no longer had a Tesla in my garage. That was in January. The Model X production was supposed to start around that time. Months passed, zero communication about when the car might be produced. I am now hearing October or even early 2022. Delays are acceptable, but totally lack of communication is not.

While I was waiting for news on Model X production, I hedged and put a deposit on a Rivian. I expected delays on the Model X to be way longer than people were saying. My thought process was that I could wait just a few months longer and get into an awesome electric SUV for a substantially lower price than the Model X I was going to buy. On top of that Rivian feels better. From the CEO down, the company makes you feel like the customer is important. Maybe in ten years, Rivian will have the same growing pains Tesla is going through, but I hope not. For now, they definitely feel better and the R1S checks all my boxes for a lot less money than a Model X.

So, that's my story. Sorry I warned you!
 

Sdvictor

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I think the Ford will appeal to many people and loyal Ford customers. They build a very good product.

however the CT has way more range for less money and of course the best feature is the super charging network.
The cybertruck is still a Unibody construction. Commercial and work truck market will still want BOF.
 

TessP100D

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The story is actually a bit more involved. I doubt anyone here wants to hear it, but in the you are bored, here goes:

I have been a huge Tesla advocate for years. I was with the company from the beginning. In the early years, the customer service was amazing and the overall experience in owning a Tesla was unparalleled. As the company grew, customer service deteriorated significantly. Tesla's are known for having bugs and quarks that need to be repaired or replaced. But, you put up with them because the car is otherwise amazing and they generally fix the bugs for free. These days, getting an appointment is extremely hard. You have to use the app, as no one seems to ever answer the phone. On top of this, the things that made Tesla great started to fade away. Unlimited charging went away. Tesla then made it hard to get XM radio in new vehicles. Instead, offering streaming services. By the way, you no longer have a data plan with your vehicle, but you can buy one... Elon is very wise, and is building a self-sustaining ecosystem that makes the company money. Wise, but it just didn't feel like the company I got behind years ago.

Fast forward to late 2020 and I was having issues connecting my car to my home network. I need that connection to remotely turn on the climate in the cold weather months. It simply failed to connect reliably and I learned it was related to Tesla hardware and software, and that replacing some parts would solve the problem. I begged and pleaded with service to replace the part, but they refused. I then realized that selling my Model X P100D and buying a new one would be a lower monthly payment and would solve my car's computer issues (shortly after buying my Model X, the price plummeted by 20-30k - another kick in the rocks).

Soooo, I test drove a 2020 version, but was inside-tipped by the service advisors, that a "refresh" was around the corner. I called and asked would happen if I ordered one, and the price then went up. In no uncertain terms, I was told I would be grandfathered on the price. I sell my car and order the new one right before the refresh, only to learn that the price I locked in on was no longer offered - I'd have to pay $20k more than what I expected to get back into a comparable vehicle ($30k if you want Full Self Driving). Needless to say, I was unhappy, but I agreed to it, since I no longer had a Tesla in my garage. That was in January. The Model X production was supposed to start around that time. Months passed, zero communication about when the car might be produced. I am now hearing October or even early 2022. Delays are acceptable, but totally lack of communication is not.

While I was waiting for news on Model X production, I hedged and put a deposit on a Rivian. I expected delays on the Model X to be way longer than people were saying. My thought process was that I could wait just a few months longer and get into an awesome electric SUV for a substantially lower price than the Model X I was going to buy. On top of that Rivian feels better. From the CEO down, the company makes you feel like the customer is important. Maybe in ten years, Rivian will have the same growing pains Tesla is going through, but I hope not. For now, they definitely feel better and the R1S checks all my boxes for a lot less money than a Model X.

So, that's my story. Sorry I warned you!
That was interesting and I respect your service to Tesla and your experiences. I too have grown tired of the Tesla service issues. I purchased the fasted and best car they made. However 4 years later, it’s not the same car. The Over Air Updates destroyed my car. Yes some things are better and the car does things it didn’t do, but it became undriveable with all the MCU issues. I lost faith. Tesla did complete The recall replacement chip, and it’s works better, but it’s not the same. Still, it’s a better car overall than anything on the road, and still the quickest, but I’m looking to replace it. It really makes me upset that a Tesla will not answer the phone and I have no problem with Mercedes, Porsche and Ferrari when I call. When you purchase an expens9ve car, you deserve top quality service. They don’t provide it. It’s that simple.

I love Ford trucks, and I would buy a Rivian after they prove to me that they are stable , relatable and the range increases. And of course, the charging network of Tesla is the best, so all manufactures have a long way to go to catch up.

thanks Again for your post. Very informative.
 

TessP100D

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The cybertruck is still a Unibody construction. Commercial and work truck market will still want BOF.
Not sure what you are trying to say here. I personally think the CT and the Rivian are similar in what they provide to the customer. I don’t believe either of them will be successful work Trucks, and I have driven big Ford work trucks all my life. As I’ve grown older, I want something big and tall, and able to carry people and throw some things in the back from time to time. I don’t need to haul construction materials anymore. The Ct offers the most range, and I’m telling you that range is the absolutely most important thing In an electric vehicle. Range is King. Period.
 

EVSport7

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The cybertruck is still a Unibody construction. Commercial and work truck market will still want BOF.
Coming in under the price of a single motor CT, the Ford will have the commercial sector on lockdown unless GM comes to play. Range will be a basic tie since Tesla fudges their numbers and Ford has sandbagged their numbers with the EV thus far. Ford has them beat in power, AWD, usable (not dumpster fire) interior and they have all the same outlet stuff. Being able to move all the accessories right over to the new truck (roof racks, tool boxes, etc), slap on your logo and get back to work, this time saving tons of money along the way, going to be irresistible for hundreds of thousands of fleet vehicles. People also don't realize how big having that service department is for businesses, being able to get a loaner truck while they work on yours, they are not going to tolerate Tesla service.
 

Sdvictor

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Not sure what you are trying to say here. I personally think the CT and the Rivian are similar in what they provide to the customer. I don’t believe either of them will be successful work Trucks, and I have driven big Ford work trucks all my life. As I’ve grown older, I want something big and tall, and able to carry people and throw some things in the back from time to time. I don’t need to haul construction materials anymore. The Ct offers the most range, and I’m telling you that range is the absolutely most important thing In an electric vehicle. Range is King. Period.
I’m not comparing the CT to Rivian, but rather the F150, because that’s what you were comparing. The CT will never be a work truck. It’s not even close. At least not with its Honda Ridgeline ass unibody construction.

If you’ve driven Fords all your life, you know the truck body market (like what https://www.diamondtruckbody.com requires a frame. The commercial version (40k one) I bet will fit those truck bodies.

Service contracts? Self Repairability for government and municipalities? Parts SLAs? Commercial service centers? Things Ford excels at for large fleet customers. Commercial customers will gobble that shit up once they run the numbers. They’ll turn to Ford because Ford has the govt and fleet service network. It’s that easy.
 

TessP100D

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I’m not comparing the CT to Rivian, but rather the F150, because that’s what you were comparing. The CT will never be a work truck. It’s not even close. At least not with its Honda Ridgeline ass unibody construction.

If you’ve driven Fords all your life, you know the truck body market (like what https://www.diamondtruckbody.com requires a frame. The commercial version (40k one) I bet will fit those truck bodies.

Service contracts? Self Repairability for government and municipalities? Parts SLAs? Commercial service centers? Things Ford excels at for large fleet customers. Commercial customers will gobble that shit up once they run the numbers. They’ll turn to Ford because Ford has the govt and fleet service network. It’s that easy.
I wasn’t comparing the CT to the Ford either. I said the CT and the Rivian both will not be work trucks. I think The Ford will be a good work truck but Range is King. Having driven a Tesla for 4 years now, I completely understand how a range works, and how weight, weather, incline and speed effect range loss big time. Oh, and if you want to tow.... for get about it.

People will buy the Ford for work and also because they like Ford and have purchased Ford before. but, with limited range, it won’t be a great work truck expect ‘just around town’’
 

2021R1T

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Range is not an issue for the vast majority of users. Overnight level 2 charging at the office or home is all that is needed. I have owned 4 plug-ins over the last 12+ years and only charged my Model 3 other than home or office once when staying the weekend in Steamboat Springs. The entire Amazon Rivian electric fleet will charge overnight.
 

Gshenderson

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I’m telling you that range is the absolutely most important thing In an electric vehicle. Range is King. Period.
6 year Tesla owner and I respectfully disagree. Charging infrastructure is king as far as I’m concerned.
 

TessP100D

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6 year Tesla owner and I respectfully disagree. Charging infrastructure is king as far as I’m concerned.
If your the type who likes to to stop for gas....urrr I mean a charge, then fine... get a lower range battery. The point here is most people who haven’t had any experience with EV’s, and it’s just not like a gas car where there is a gas station on every corner. You have to plan things out. I much prefer if I travel say 125 miles to a destination, that I be able to return WITHOUT charging. I want to just plug in when I get home. Since EV’s don’t get anywhere close to actual miles as They are rated, it’s always best to buy the biggest battery pack you can afford. Look, I get free lifetime super charging, but I do t use them unless I have to. And let’s not forget that your range will degrees over time and that sucks. Anybody who thinks they are going to go out in the wilderness with their new EV, has a big surprise coming to them. Maybe in 10-15 years when gas stations are replaced with EV charger stations, maybe that will be different, and assuming battery tech improves for overall faster charging too. Have a great day.
 

jcook01

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I've already pre-ordered a R1S, thinking about doing the same fora Cadillac Lyriq as well. We've already driven the Audi Etrons and VW ID.4.

The Ford Lightning looks like a great vehicle but a truck bed wouldn't get used as often as the rear end of a large SUV.
 

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