New video "Let's Just Drive" & official letter from RJ provides huge update!

[rraj2k81]

Just watched the full Q&A video and one thing stood out for me about the corporate culture and thinking process behind RJ and Rivian.

When asked about the tank turn, RJ said it's not only a complex system to develop but they are also thinking about the social responsibility of such a thing, where they don't want people to just go and rip up the tank turn on the roads.

This made me feel all warm and fuzzy about RJ and Rivian. Now I only hope he retains this level of social responsibility as the company grows !

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[Notaevfan]

Tank turn looks cool, but I really really really want to be able to turn off all traction and stability control, and put it in 2wd. Will be a huge disappointment if I can't, not going to cancel my order.....but still. Is there anything more fun than doing a burnout into donuts? Maybe I'm just a child but it puts a huge smile on my face every time.

 

[DuckTruck]

I agree. I would also assume that when you "request" tank turn mode, Rivian will do two related safeguards in software:
1) monitor applied power, wheel slippage, etc. to prevent damage if you are on a hard surface.
2) Log all of the tank turn data, video, etc. for forensics and warranty determination if there is a warranty claim for unusual damage.

I think that's a safe bet, like it or not. It's similar to the monitoring RJ mentioned to me about possibly unlocking more range for those who exhibit the right charging/usage behaviors that therefore merit such increases. In both cases, Rivian offers warranties on these vehicles and their batteries. Why would they not limit the behaviors that could end up costing them big bucks for the things we do.

 

[thrill]

There's not going to be any damage to the drivetrain system from melting rubber. No matter which direction the tire's are smoking the same load is being applied to the system. If that's not so then the Rivian would have to come with a duty cycle on max performance launches, which of course, maybe it will, though I doubt it with over 800 ft-lb of torque and hp. But until that heat level is reached, it's all the same to the powertrain. The only thought is if I should buy stock in Pirelli.

 

[SeaGeo]

Tank turn looks cool, but I really really really want to be able to turn off all traction and stability control, and put it in 2wd. Will be a huge disappointment if I can't, not going to cancel my order.....but still. Is there anything more fun than doing a burnout into donuts? Maybe I'm just a child but it puts a huge smile on my face every time.

Drift mode didn't seem far off from that.

 

[DuckTruck]

Drift mode didn't seem far off from that.

It didn't to me, either. This thing really got loose. That said, doing donuts in RWD-only is great, great fun!

 

[SeaGeo]

It didn't to me, either. This thing really got loose. That said, doing donuts in RWD-only is great, great fun!

As long as they're intentional. My old rodeo sport was NOT fun in SoDak in the winter without sand bags.

 

[Zoidz]

There's not going to be any damage to the drivetrain system from melting rubber. No matter which direction the tire's are smoking the same load is being applied to the system. If that's not so then the Rivian would have to come with a duty cycle on max performance launches, which of course, maybe it will, though I doubt it with over 800 ft-lb of torque and hp. But until that heat level is reached, it's all the same to the powertrain. The only thought is if I should buy stock in Pirelli.

I disagree. The tank mode stresses on the drivetrain and suspension would be greater on pavement than on dirt/mud. Compared to normal driving, tank mode will apply higher lateral and twisting forces on the tires, wheel bearings, ball joints, and other suspension components, and it would not surprise me if it caused hopping of one of the wheels on pavement.

I've experienced this first hand in my truck more than once when I locked in 4WD in snow, and forgot to revert to 2WD on pavement. When turning on pavement, I've felt and heard the suspension and drive train shudder. Not recommended.

So Rivian has a choice to make - design the suspension for "normal" wear and tear, or design it for "tank mode" wear and tear, which means bigger/heavier/stronger, and that means more expensive and could sacrifice on-road performance due to increased unsprung weight.

Also, let's not overlook the fact that RJ has a PhD in Mechanical Engineering and focused on drive train systems. I suspect he knows a bit more about this than us, and that's why he is very conservative with implementing tank mode.

 

[PastyPilgrim]

I hope the people on this thread that are worried about privacy use VPNs, tape over their webcams and basically don’t allow the majority of the functions on their phones and tablets.

On the insurance topic I am a bit worried about them monitoring all of our activity (speed) and hiking up our premiums and such.

I mean, I brought up privacy and I do all of those things and more (e.g. I use Linux and more tightly control what it's doing on my personal computers, I run a router with custom firmware, I don't connect my smart tvs to the internet, I disable voice assistants and wouldn't own any hub devices, etc.).

I'd prefer to keep my data and have an understanding of what my technology is doing, but I'm not strictly opposed to data gathering (I work for a FAANG company so it would be very hypocritical if I were). My key concerns with Rivian are:

• Vehicle telemetry is a lot of data, especially with all of the technology in these cars. Some of this data is of "illegal" activities (e.g. speed limits, turn signals, parking, u-turns, etc.) and will influence your insurance rates. Notably, this also seems to contradict the aim of an adventure vehicle too (e.g. will your insurance rates go up because you do a lot of off-roading, or tank turns and drifting in the snow, or driving fast on a track/private property? Will Rivian void your battery warranty early because you did X or Y? Etc.).
• Rivian is a new company with new tech; we don't yet know if they've sufficiently invested in protection/stewardship/etc. of data. There's tons of key, basic software features that Rivian won't have at launch and are promising to add later; are we to assume that proper data protocols were added first, before key features when a lot of companies won't add those things until there's a major incident?
• I'd prefer no integration with Amazon and I haven't seen any indication that they will allow you to disable that. We also don't know what other data Rivian has offered to give Amazon beyond the data needed to use Amazon features (e.g. alexa).

I could talk for days about what Rivian the company and Rivian car owners risk by having unchecked data collection. Mainly I'm looking for them to be transparent about what they're doing, what they're collecting, and how they intend to use that data. At the very least that would allow those of us that care about these things to make an informed decision.

And for those of you that don't care, maybe our high expectations and demands of Rivian will benefit you all the same.

 

[flabyboy]

I mean, I brought up privacy and I do all of those things and more (e.g. I use Linux and more tightly control what it's doing on my personal computers, I run a router with custom firmware, I don't connect my smart tvs to the internet, I disable voice assistants and wouldn't own any hub devices, etc.).

I'd prefer to keep my data and have an understanding of what my technology is doing, but I'm not strictly opposed to data gathering (I work for a FAANG company so it would be very hypocritical if I were). My key concerns with Rivian are:

• Vehicle telemetry is a lot of data, especially with all of the technology in these cars. Some of this data is of "illegal" activities (e.g. speed limits, turn signals, parking, u-turns, etc.) and will influence your insurance rates. Notably, this also seems to contradict the aim of an adventure vehicle too (e.g. will your insurance rates go up because you do a lot of off-roading, or tank turns and drifting in the snow, or driving fast on a track/private property? Will Rivian void your battery warranty early because you did X or Y? Etc.).
• Rivian is a new company with new tech; we don't yet know if they've sufficiently invested in protection/stewardship/etc. of data. There's tons of key, basic software features that Rivian won't have at launch and are promising to add later; are we to assume that proper data protocols were added first, before key features when a lot of companies won't add those things until there's a major incident?
• I'd prefer no integration with Amazon and I haven't seen any indication that they will allow you to disable that. We also don't know what other data Rivian has offered to give Amazon beyond the data needed to use Amazon features (e.g. alexa).

I could talk for days about what Rivian the company and Rivian car owners risk by having unchecked data collection. Mainly I'm looking for them to be transparent about what they're doing, what they're collecting, and how they intend to use that data. At the very least that would allow those of us that care about these things to make an informed decision.

And for those of you that don't care, maybe our high expectations and demands of Rivian will benefit you all the same.

All valid concerns

 

[Pugster]

I’m wondering if the test track had any “washboard” type of terrain. Our gravel (logging) roads are littered with it, and to say that it sucks isn’t even getting started. I’m very curious at how the suspension will perform, my suspicion is really well especially combined with 4 motors and the right mode. Any insights DuckTruck?

 

[skyote]

As long as they're intentional. My old rodeo sport was NOT fun in SoDak in the winter without sand bags.

My old S10 would get sideways in a hurry when it was just a little bit wet. And driving on ice/snow was nearly impossible.

 

[Eager2own]

My old S10 would get sideways in a hurry when it was just a little bit wet. And driving on ice/snow was nearly impossible.

Drift mode was a standard feature on ice and water in my ‘96 Ford Ranger.

 

[DuckTruck]

I’m wondering if the test track had any “washboard” type of terrain. Our gravel (logging) roads are littered with it, and to say that it sucks isn’t even getting started. I’m very curious at how the suspension will perform, my suspicion is really well especially combined with 4 motors and the right mode. Any insights DuckTruck?

Pugster,

The closest we got to hitting your classic washboard was taking the drift area at speed. As we were criss-crossing earlier tracks, it was similar to rolling over washboard, but we weren't hitting them at a 90-degree angle. That said, the R1T was eerily smooth and composed as we shredded through the loose stuff.

Over the classic wave-like surface of a harder washboard, it may have been different. But even in the rougher rock areas, it ate up small and medium sized bumps without any harsh impact or the rattle and thump I'm used to in the F-150s of friends. Just like the oft-heard phrase, "There's an app for that!", it seems like there's a setting for most everything we might encounter. It's nice to have different modes for propulsion, like sport, rally, drift, etc., but also for the suspension. On one setting I couldn't get it to lean or roll when slamming it left and right when driving down the straightway, while in the softer mode for around town, it swayed back-and-forth with body roll like most other vehicles were used to.

I hope that helps!

 

[CommodoreAmiga]

Drift mode was a standard feature on ice and water in my ‘96 Ford Ranger.

Ford Explorer owners of similar vintage also got the "barrel roll" feature.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firestone_and_Ford_tire_controversy

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