Ford Increasing F150 Lightning Prices Again

[DuoRivians]

They sold 9,800 last quarter with an average sale price well over $100k. That's more than the Escalade, the R1T, and a little less than the X7. The data does not support your assertion that no one wants a Model X.

Graph how many MX are sold quarterly. It’s not looking good.

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[DuoRivians]

They sold 9,800 last quarter with an average sale price well over $100k. That's more than the Escalade, the R1T, and a little less than the X7. The data does not support your assertion that no one wants a Model X.

And look at inventory. It’s not selling:

https://www.tesla.com/inventory/new/mx?arrangeby=relevance&zip=94306&range=200

 

[Guy]

Small increases on the Ford are starting to add up. Base version is up $20k, 50% of its initially announced price.
https://www.theverge.com/2023/3/30/23663618/ford-f-150-lightning-price-hike-original-price

Agreed but most of that increase was last year. This increase is pretty small 1.5 out of the 20k you mention.

 

[Guy]

Prices are locked until the reservations that started sometime in late May 2022. March-Early May pricing is higher but it's still locked.

Yes it locks when you make a configuration selection. Either in that March to May period or whenever you get the notification.

 

[Donald Stanfield]

And look at inventory. It’s not selling:

https://www.tesla.com/inventory/new/mx?arrangeby=relevance&zip=94306&range=200

Not surprisingly most of them have the yoke steering.

 

[sacramentoelectric]

Graph how many MX are sold quarterly. It’s not looking good.

Here's where I got my data for the X. The low sales in Q2 and Q3 was because there was no production as they switched to the refreshed model. 2022 was the best year for Model X sales despite the five-month shutdown and ridiculous yoke wheel while maintaining far and away the highest average sale price. Q4 2022 was the fourth best out of the 28 quarters the vehicle has been on sale. I understand the narrative you want to tell but the facts don't match. Just because there is Model X inventory available, it doesn't tell us anything about how many have been sold. For example, there are plenty of R1Ts in the shop. That doesn't mean nobody wants one anymore. It only means supply has met demand. It's just strange to say nobody wants a vehicle that is one of the top sellers in its class. As far as I can tell, it was the second best selling high end SUV in Q4. Heck, it even outsold the Ford Lightning in Q4 by 50%! While I agree that the Tesla brand has taken a beating from Elon's shenanigans, Tesla is on track to have the best quarter in their history with a 40% increase in sales year over year.

 

[DuoRivians]

Here's where I got my data for the X. The low sales in Q2 and Q3 was because there was no production as they switched to the refreshed model. 2022 was the best year for Model X sales despite the five-month shutdown and ridiculous yoke wheel while maintaining far and away the highest average sale price. Q4 2022 was the fourth best out of the 28 quarters the vehicle has been on sale. I understand the narrative you want to tell but the facts don't match. Just because there is Model X inventory available, it doesn't tell us anything about how many have been sold. For example, there are plenty of R1Ts in the shop. That doesn't mean nobody wants one anymore. It only means supply has met demand. It's just strange to say nobody wants a vehicle that is one of the top sellers in its class. As far as I can tell, it was the second best selling high end SUV in Q4. Heck, it even outsold the Ford Lightning in Q4 by 50%! While I agree that the Tesla brand has taken a beating from Elon's shenanigans, Tesla is on track to have the best quarter in their history with a 40% increase in sales year over year.

YoY sales % is often meaningless. Rivian is going to have. 600% YoY sales increase.

The appeal of Tesla or the MX has significantly diminished. Having to lower prices to compensate for more supply is the only lever Tesla has at this point.

 

[popoga]

YoY sales % is often meaningless. Rivian is going to have. 600% YoY sales increase.

The appeal of Tesla or the MX has significantly diminished. Having to lower prices to compensate for more supply is the only lever Tesla has at this point.

BUT it's a lever with a lot of room for movement. Their margins are head and shoulders above the competition.

 

[Dark-Fx]

YoY sales % is often meaningless. Rivian is going to have. 600% YoY sales increase.

The appeal of Tesla or the MX has significantly diminished. Having to lower prices to compensate for more supply is the only lever Tesla has at this point.

Turns out part of what makes the Camry boring is there are so damn many of them. Tesla is their own worst enemy IMO.

 

[DuoRivians]

BUT it's a lever with a lot of room for movement. Their margins are head and shoulders above the competition.

In a perfectly competitive market, where brand value is meaningless, margins matter yes. If a generic water bottle company can operate with better margins than the competition, it can use margins to lower prices to its advantage.

Cars aren’t a perfectly competitive market by any means. Brand appeal, social stance, ego, signaling all matter. In this environment, margins aren’t as important. Premium brands can charge more for the sake of their cache.

 

[DuoRivians]

Turns out part of what makes the Camry boring is there are so damn many of them. Tesla is their own worst enemy IMO.

And arguably no longer an inspiration or brand to stand behind because of Elon

 

[kizamybute']

I agree, a good thing for Rivian. Rivian can't afford to reduce prices. So the fact that EV truck prices are going up elsewhere is bring pricing more in line. Tesla has the profit margins to reduce pricing of the Cybertruck, but considering it won't be available for sale for at least another year, makes no difference at this point.

My only hope is that Rivian's top execs don't try to do something stupid and say "hey look, they raised their prices, so that means we can too". That would be a very bad thing for Rivian and its investors. There finally seems to be just a little momentum in the stock price. I keep walking on pins and needles praying that the executives don't do something stupid AGAIN to screw it all up, which sadly they've done all too much over the past year. Fingers crossed that they just keep their mouth's shut and focus on delivering vehicles.

 

[Madsen203]

If model X was 79,999 I’d buy one today and trade in Model Y. However, I LOVE the model Y. I drove 725 miles yesterday going to Utah. The navigation perfectly timed and routed to super chargers which 100% worked. Charging was 10-20 minutes depending on location which was barely enough time to take Ashley stretch and pee break - both of which timing synced perfectly. I was able to cruise at 85 mph
With autopilot engaged. Steering weight kept the nanny from speaking up too much and was able to enjoy a few activities on the way that made the time pass by quickly. I loathe the idea trying to do that in a non Tesla. I saw Audi’s parked at Baker charging station and they were there before I got there and there after I left. My 725 mile trip cost me $96 in super charging. When I arrived at Airbnb, I plugged in mobile charger and got 5mph charging rate all night in near freezing temperatures. That charging and traveling success is a huge convenience worth a pretty penny over what a ford lightning would be able to do.

 

[DuoRivians]

I agree, a good thing for Rivian. Rivian can't afford to reduce prices. So the fact that EV truck prices are going up elsewhere is bring pricing more in line. Tesla has the profit margins to reduce pricing of the Cybertruck, but considering it won't be available for sale for at least another year, makes no difference at this point.

My only hope is that Rivian's top execs don't try to do something stupid and say "hey look, they raised their prices, so that means we can too". That would be a very bad thing for Rivian and its investors. There finally seems to be just a little momentum in the stock price. I keep walking on pins and needles praying that the executives don't do something stupid AGAIN to screw it all up, which sadly they've done all too much over the past year. Fingers crossed that they just keep their mouth's shut and focus on delivering vehicles.

Rivian may be raising prices in April

 

[kizamybute']

Rivian may be raising prices in April

I hope not. Will be one of the worst things they can do. At $90,000+, they're already too pricey. A small 1% raise of $1,000 would do far more harm than good.

I truly wish Rivian would hire someone with public company experience to guide them on their decisions and how each of those decisions impact their stock value. It's not just about one person, they need to see the big picture and anticipate what each decision and/or public announcement will have on its investors.

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