Cybertruck photo leaked! ?

[rogunenode]

The Lightning and Silverado have more service locations, and both are stable manufacturers. They probably have better storage, and tons of aftermarket support (the Lightning can use all of the standard F150 accessories). The Silverado has 4wheel steering.

Tesla's current battery tech is no longer the best in the business. That would go to Lucid. Rivian actually uses a better battery setup than Tesla with bottom cooling of the batteries instead of side cooling. So assuming the Cybertruck gets the new 4680 cells, they would be as good or slightly better, but not a dramatic improvement.

Does the Cybertruck have an onboard air compressor? How about electrical outlets? Passthrough storage to the rear seats like the Silverado? No gear tunnel like the Rivian. If it has a front truck it will probably have a lot less storage than the Lightning or Silverado.

The Cybertruck may have some advantages over the competition, but it also has a lot of negatives. It's not the game changer that people thought it would be when it was originally introduced. Three new very competitive EV trucks are now hitting the market.

I'm only considering the R1T and CT. The Ford and Chevy offerings don't meet my requirements. Ymmv. Lucid does have great tech, but they don't make a truck, so....

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[Engi_Nerd]

The Lightning and Silverado have more service locations, and both are stable manufacturers. They probably have better storage, and tons of aftermarket support (the Lightning can use all of the standard F150 accessories). The Silverado has 4wheel steering.

Tesla's current battery tech is no longer the best in the business. That would go to Lucid. Rivian actually uses a better battery setup than Tesla with bottom cooling of the batteries instead of side cooling. So assuming the Cybertruck gets the new 4680 cells, they would be as good or slightly better, but not a dramatic improvement.

Does the Cybertruck have an onboard air compressor? How about electrical outlets? Passthrough storage to the rear seats like the Silverado? No gear tunnel like the Rivian. If it has a front truck it will probably have a lot less storage than the Lightning or Silverado.

The Cybertruck may have some advantages over the competition, but it also has a lot of negatives. It's not the game changer that people thought it would be when it was originally introduced. Three new very competitive EV trucks are now hitting the market.

Dude, what are you even talking about? Yes, the CT has an onboard air compressor. And power outlets. And the volume of the Rivian bed and gear tunnel will be markedly lower than that of Tesla's longer bed with sloped tonneau. No one has seen the frunk, so claiming a win there is also very strange. Tesla's battery tech will also be at least a full generation ahead of what anyone else is using.

 

[manitou202]

The CT is probably a more efficient, lighter vehicle while being wider. The heavy weight of the Rivian not only makes it inefficient but also decrease offroad utility. Both the Lightning and probably CT show construction sophistication that Rivian lacks. I assume Hummer is likely also a pig like Rivian.

The inefficiency is not just about operating cost. Charging away from home and away from 100kw+ fast charging is problematic with an inefficent vehicle. A 300 mile range Tesla has more real world charging flexibility than a 300 mile range Rivian.

Much of Tesla software will very likely still be well ahead of Rivian.

Supercharger will likely remain superior to hunting for a couple EA chargers in the Walmart parking lot.

I would prefer a more utilitarian Rivian interior with the high end music system. I'm a truck person at heart, and I like the minimalist interiors. I don't like paying for yellow accents and wood in the steering wheel. Although my interest in the likely CT yoke is also zero.

I do wonder if anyone anywhere is equally interested in Rivian and the Cybertruck. I think Tesla made a good choice with choosing the CT design. I also think Tesla made a good choice with falcon wing doors in the model X. I have no interest in either, but that doesn't mean I feel those choices were a poor business decision.

I think Rivian made very good choices in a great many design tradeoffs. That's why they will get my money. Plus they underpriced the truck.

We don't know the weight of the Cybertruck. Drag has a bigger impact on highway efficiency not weight. Not sure how you know the Cybertruck construction is more sophisticated than Rivian.

We don't know how fast it will charge. Tesla isn't the fastest charging EV anymore (Hyundai, Porsche, Lucid, Audi are faster). The updated Rivian curve is probably on par with what Tesla's curve will look like. The latest reports show holding over 200kW at 43%. Based on Inside EV results the Rivian didn't drop below 150kW until 60% and then 100kW at 65%. The current Model S holds above 200kW until about 40% then drops below 150kW at 48% and 100kW at 65%.

Tesla's EPA range is always overly optimistic. The Inside EV tests show the Rivian goes just as far as a Model S Plaid at 70mph. A 400mile EPA rated Cybertruck might only go about 300 miles at 70mph based on their history. Not really an advantage over Rivian or Ford.

Tesla's Superchargers have better coverage for the moment, but CCS chargers are expanding very rapidly. I've had non-Tesla EVs for several years and today the coverage is plenty for most people. This will dramatically change in the next couple of years.

 

[NY_Rob]

Watch the out of spec reviews and you'll see how they repeatedly talk about the Rivian UI being better than Teslas. More responsive in particular.

Tesla has started delivering (Model 3) vehicles with the new, much faster AMD Ryzen processor. It will be as snappy or possibly even quicker than Rivian's CPU.

 

[Inkedsphynx]

Tesla has started delivering (Model 3) vehicles with the new, much faster AMD Ryzen processor. It will be as snappy or possibly even quicker than Rivian's CPU.

I'll take what is over what might be any day of the week and twice on Sunday. Doesn't really matter to me anyway, I'll never buy a Tesla solely due to EM.

Do we know which chips Rivian used? I'd be surprised if they're not relatively new also.

 

[NY_Rob]

Real question - what's the day-to-day benefit I'm getting with the CT skin vs any other car on the road?

Rust free, super durable/dent & ding resistant skin that will never need a paint job. Also great for people using the CT near salt water (trailering boats/ramp launching) where rust is a huge problem.
Also, instead of conventional sheet metal attached to body structural members, the CT skin is the structural member. Benefits include much tighter overall body, lighter and faster production, etc..

 

[Inkedsphynx]

Rust free, super durable/dent & ding resistant skin that will never need a paint job. Also great for people using the CT near salt water (trailering boats/ramp launching) where rust is a huge problem.
Also, instead of conventional sheet metal attached to body structural members, the CT skin is the structural member. Benefits include much tighter overall body, lighter and faster production, etc..

Got to admit I'm not sure any of that moves the needle for me. Maybe because the skin would hold up better to scratches from offroading and overlanding, but then I'd be forced to offroad and overland in the CT. I'll take the R1T+scratches, please

 

[NY_Rob]

All other kidding aside, it's a fact that Tesla's battery tech has a 10yr lead over everyone else. That plus the fact that their new "tabless" cells that will go in to the CT have huge advantages over conventional cylindrical cells used in Rivian and other vehicles. I fully expect insane charging rates for those cells due to the tabless design.

 

[zipzag]

We don't know the weight of the Cybertruck. Drag has a bigger impact on highway efficiency not weight. Not sure how you know the Cybertruck construction is more sophisticated than Rivian.

We don't know how fast it will charge. Tesla isn't the fastest charging EV anymore (Hyundai, Porsche, Lucid, Audi are faster). The updated Rivian curve is probably on par with what Tesla's curve will look like. The latest reports show holding over 200kW at 43%. Based on Inside EV results the Rivian didn't drop below 150kW until 60% and then 100kW at 65%. The current Model S holds above 200kW until about 40% then drops below 150kW at 48% and 100kW at 65%.

Tesla's EPA range is always overly optimistic. The Inside EV tests show the Rivian goes just as far as a Model S Plaid at 70mph. A 400mile EPA rated Cybertruck might only go about 300 miles at 70mph based on their history. Not really an advantage over Rivian or Ford.

Tesla's Superchargers have better coverage for the moment, but CCS chargers are expanding very rapidly. I've had non-Tesla EVs for several years and today the coverage is plenty for most people. This will dramatically change in the next couple of years.

Rivians charging curve above 50% is terrible considering the capacity of the large pack. The cells are at less than half the C rate of Tesla's newer cars.

What we don't know is the reason, and if Rivian has the temperature control hardware in the vehicle to do much better than the current implementation.

Musk stated that the CT weight would be similar to the gas F150.

 

[zipzag]

All other kidding aside, it's a fact that Tesla's battery tech has a 10yr lead over everyone else. That plus the fact that their new "tabless" cells that will go in to the CT have huge advantages over conventional cylindrical cells used in Rivian and other vehicles. I fully expect insane charging rates for those cells due to the tabless design.

I don't think Tesla's battery advatage is in end user feature. I think it's a company feature. Tesla can make lots of money while Rivian is selling 50K vehicles at a probable loss per unit.

 

[Dark-Fx]

I agree. Big deal, they made a stressed skin, stainless steel, electric pickup with ALON transparencies, hands-free facial recognition access, 4-wheel steering, and almost certainly class leading storage AND efficiency. Anybody could do that, really.

Have you even seen it and been in it in person though? Most of the things you commented on require a very significant trust that they are going to do those things well when they haven't shown they are capable of doing them before. Especially given the snafu with the "bulletproof" glass.

 

[Dark-Fx]

I assume Hummer is likely also a pig like Rivian.

No. Rivian is way more efficient. Could it be better? Absolutely, but it's practically not in the same class as the Hummer as far as efficiency is concerned.

 

[Dark-Fx]

All other kidding aside, it's a fact that Tesla's battery tech has a 10yr lead over everyone else.

This might have been true 6 years ago.

 

[manitou202]

Musk stated that the CT weight would be similar to the gas F150.

And start at $39k right?

 

[Max]

Guys, CT is just not real enough to get sucked into a discussion over. Elon already said new vehicles are not a priority.

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