Rivian doesn't cost less to drive on long trips

[JamuJoe]

Public charging prices with EA have already gone up and will continue to skyrocket as more EVs hit the road because the grid can't support it all. The integration from Rivian is awful and requires multiple apps to plot a long trip because you don't know the availability of chargers from the interface. "Free" charging from manufacturers causes public chargers to be full from people who will never invest in a home charger and don't want to pay thousands to upgrade their old panels.

I guess it depends upon your area, housing, and experience (or lack of). This is not the reality I’ve experienced on this long winter trip towing a 7500 trailer. 23 DCFC charging stops along I-10 thru MS, LA, TX, (some of the least infrastructure in the nation) NM, AZ using the Rivian nav system. Only one failed stop due to charging equipment being off line. Not one single wait for a charger. Adding a NEMA 14-50 garage outlet cost me less than $500 (my electric coop rebates half of the cost of charger plus installation) and I charge from my rooftop solar which I had installed 8 yrs ago. There is a lot of negativity in certain media outlets promoted by certain fossil fuel interests and automotive industry groups. I offer facts.

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[Arky]

Unlike your other vehicles, the Rivian doesn't need oil changes, service sessions in the hundreds of dollars, smog checks, regular brake jobs, a laundry list of mechanical repairs - and nobody is going to steal your catalytic converter. (My last Audi was my biggest money pit.)

I think if we're really going to compare total costs like that we'd have to see how reliable these really are out of warranty. I've had a couple minor issues with the R1, but knock on wood mine has generally been good so far.

My Subaru required 0 out of warranty services for the 7 years I owned it. My Honda needed one, also over 7 years, (a CV boot/axle). All the regular maintenance items (oil, brakes, filters) through the entire time I owned those cars don't add up to the cost of a single windshield on this truck. That's what I worry about more than anything, the parts/service costs.

 

[hgpayne]

Now that I've observed the vehicle on longer trips I'm realizing that there isn't much difference in cost per mile vs our V8 powered 2007 Lexus GX470 here in CA.

GX: $5 per gal / 20mpg= .25 per mile
R1S: $.50 per kw dcfc / 2 mi per kwh = .25 per mile

What's everyone else seeing? Home charging costs about half as much so it's like a 40mpg SUV in that case. Although it's classified as 75mpge, you have to fill it with $8-$16 per gal "gas."

The thing is you need to not look at single case comparisons. Look at the whole trip. You start from home full on cheaper electricity. Mid trip you pay these DCFC prices. Maybe you have a hotel with free charging overnight. At your destination there is cheap charging too. You have to add it all up to see your real costs. With the gas or diesel rig you are stuck always pumping from a local station at their rates. I figure overall it is cheaper to go EV.

I make regular long trips -- about 400 miles one way, 800 mile round trip. There are some charges that are $0.48/kWh down to starting from home for "free" (had solar since 2013 that has long since paid for itself). Other chargers I use are 36 cents/kWh, 42 cents/kWh, and at my destination, 15 cents/kWh. I looked at the whole cost of a trip using our R1T pulling the trailer. Let's compare that to using our old GMC Acadia pulling that same trailer. My actual costs for one way is about $125 or $250 round trip. Towing is expensive. With the Acadia I could buy gas in California at about $4.50 and Arizona at $3.50. Let's use the average $4. The Acadia got almost 20 MPG on the freeway and 13 MPG around town. My trip is a mix of climbing mountains, desert, windy roads, and yes, about 150 miles of freeway. Towing is going to kill range just like in an EV. Let's assume I could get as high as 10 MPG while towing. Big assumption. Anway, 400 miles / 10 MPG is 40 gallons. 40 times $4 is $160. The return trip is another 400 miles so another $160 or $320 total. That's higher than $250 in the R1T but maybe not as much as I'd like. Given all the hills I'm sure I'd be burning a lot more brakes on the Acadia. I use mostly regen in the R1T putting juice back in the battery as a plus.

BTW, I made that same trip the other day without the trailer. Total real costs were $83.42, which includes my electricity rates at home (as did the $250 above). If I consider my home rates really free the costs drop to $66.55 and $239.29 for the R1T not towing and towing respectively. The Acadia getting that great 20 MPG -- well not over the mountains -- let's be kind and say 17 MPG overall? 800 / 17 * $4 = $188.24. That's just about 3 times as much.

 

[Rudylake]

Going to get expensive to repair if Rivian goes bankrupt.

 

[Choqni]

We've driven through 36 States over 25k miles in the last 2 and a half years. When we started it was significantly cheaper on average with an EV. But the price of gas has fallen and average cost of fast charging has risen n that short time. Prices in Texas at L3s are ridiculous. We saw one charger was 85 cents per kw, 10X the residential price of electricity. There's an infrastructure and a public policy dynamic that's imminently in favor of EVs, but who knows how long that's going to take. Still super happy to ditch ICE vehicles for all the other reasons too.

 

[MoreTrout]

…and it takes longer. Significantly.

I refute that and discuss it with anyone that gives me the chance. I raise eyebrows all the time when I open with it takes me 10 to 20 seconds to charge. 5-10 sec to plug it in, and 5-10 to unplug. The rest of the time I'm not in or around the vehicle and doing other things I would be doing anyway. Case in point: Last summer we did our annual trip to my SIL's. I had my wife's parents with us. We stopped at our usual halfway point to eat. By the time my in-laws made it out of the restroom and we started to order food, I had enough range to complete the trip and way more than I needed by the time we finished eating. It was a busy rest stop, and cars were lined up at every gas pump. I spent significantly less time plugging and unplugging then they did pumping gas. We all spent relatively the same amount of time using the restroom and eating.

At home or a motel it's the same. I don't care how "long" the truck takes to charge while I'm sleeping or doing whatever else I would normally be doing. Nothing beats not having to waste MY time driving down the street to stand at a gas pump that is "faster".

Almost without exception, during my dozens of 200-400 mile road trips over the last 1.5 years I spent way less of MY time charging than I ever did pumping gas.

 

[elektrode]

Welp, I’ve been triggered by the internet…

The wait time for a charge is pretty situational. It obviously and objectively takes longer for the charging process than pumping.

Combining charging with other activities can equalize the two methods. However, if you stop somewhere for a charge and NOTHING is around to eat or you even have to walk to use the bathroom, you’ve lost your “equalizers”. Example, Kodak, TN EA station. Do you like taffy? Do you like Harleys? Lucky you. Okay, walk 15min to Bass Pro shop to take a piss. There’s only ONE sit down restaurant.

Another example, ready to leave Asheville, NC? Okay, drive all the way across town to charge at Sam’s Club. Leave the family at the hotel cause being stuck with them in the car for 30+min DOING NOTHING isn’t going to help the trip. NOWHERE to eat. NOWHERE to walk. Do this at night when you’re tired so you don’t have to do it in the morning when you just want to get out of there.

So yeah, situational. But NONE of these things are true at any gas pump I’ve ever been to.

Gawd forbid you kid has to pee 25miles before the ONE charger you can fit between you stops. While waiting 10min for him to piss, know that in 25min you’ll be sitting at an EA charger doing NOTHING. I personally like taking a cat nap. I think it’s an advantage! But it takes longer - which is why I can take a nap.

 

[babalegba]

I refute that and discuss it with anyone that gives me the chance. I raise eyebrows all the time when I open with it takes me 10 to 20 seconds to charge. 5-10 sec to plug it in, and 5-10 to unplug. The rest of the time I'm not in or around the vehicle and doing other things I would be doing anyway. Case in point: Last summer we did our annual trip to my SIL's. I had my wife's parents with us. We stopped at our usual halfway point to eat. By the time my in-laws made it out of the restroom and we started to order food, I had enough range to complete the trip and way more than I needed by the time we finished eating. It was a busy rest stop, and cars were lined up at every gas pump. I spent significantly less time plugging and unplugging then they did pumping gas. We all spent relatively the same amount of time using the restroom and eating.

At home or a motel it's the same. I don't care how "long" the truck takes to charge while I'm sleeping or doing whatever else I would normally be doing. Nothing beats not having to waste MY time driving down the street to stand at a gas pump that is "faster".

Almost without exception, during my dozens of 200-400 mile road trips over the last 1.5 years I spent way less of MY time charging than I ever did pumping gas.

Point taken, but this was a relatively short trip. I've been on 5+ charge trips and the time easily adds up. Worse when u have to wait at any charging stations for your turn. I also had a Model S for about 3 years and although the supercharger network is crazy reliable, the combination of terrible estimates and slower charging (had an older battery pack) was no bueno.

That said, despite the inconvenience, I still prefer traveling in the Riv. Charging/gas costs are a wash to me as well on trips and I sometimes don't mind my wife's Q7 which has a much quieter cabin. Charging at home for daily commute is hilariously cheaper (I'm in WA).

 

[nc10]

Now that I've observed the vehicle on longer trips I'm realizing that there isn't much difference in cost per mile vs our V8 powered 2007 Lexus GX470 here in CA.

True. Lots of articles about EV Station pricing. Charging at home is a signicant savings for me, 6 cents/kwhr if I charge at nite. Almost $100/month vs gas on my last car, Subaru outback. Love driving by the lines at the SamsClub station near my house....

 

[HaveBlue]

I agree on situational. Last week charging stations were a mess in Chicago for a few days with the storm. Last year an enormous storm hit big bear CA and there wasn't gas for a week but nobody lost power so a Rivian would have kept going. Hilariously, yesterday I went to fill up my Audi and the gas pumps weren't working. Everyone was standing around wondering what to do. I left and went to another gas station and it took me four tries to get my card to work there.

 

[Webleyaz]

I'm pretty sure the R1T is still the most efficient pickup ever built and, until recently, the quickest. Couldn't put those 2 together any time in history. Take any other truck on that journey and see what a top fuel eliminator is like. I'm so glad mine looks more like a Japanese anime character than something a WM driver might accidentally pull up to.

 

[R1TS]

This is a little misleading; prices for electricity vary more drastically than gasoline. Many of the DCFC are $.36 per kWh , and home charging for many is $.14 or less per kWh.

Home charging here in CA is almost double what you are saying.

 

[godfodder0901]

Home charging here in CA is almost double what you are saying.

Yes. In California. In Georgia, some pay as little as $.01 per kWh. My point was that the prices can vary dramatically from place to place, so blanket statements of costs are not a valid metric.

 

[CharonPDX]

Every time folks from California start talking about their electric rates I thank God I’m in NC. My time of use rate from 10 pm-6am is $.03/kWh. I drive 4,000 miles a month and my electric bill has been on average $30/month higher than it used to be. This is based on 7 months of ownership. This versus the $800/month o was spending on gasoline for my 2021 Silverado.

Yep. What's particularly funny is that my electric utility is PGE, and my off-peak rate is $0.04/kWh. Not PG&E / Pacific Gas & Electric, the Californian utility; but Portland General Electric, the, well, Portland electric utility. And yet Oregon sends a ton of power down to California.

Thank you, Californians, for subsidizing our cheap electricity! :-D

 

[zymolysis]

It's only that way because we depend on importing oil instead of doing it all here. We could easily be energy independent and never depend on OPEC and South America ever again. If gas prices were solely based on the evil oil companies demands, why didn't they just raise prices to $4-5 gal under the previous administration? Burdensome regulations and importation of oil are why gas prices are high, even after depleting our strategic petroleum reserve.

No, gas prices in the US go up when world prices go up - gasoline is sold internationally, so if if an oil company can sell their domestic petroleum somewhere else, and make more money, they will. Domestic prices have to rise to balance the supply/demand.

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