Speed Limiting Through OTA Updates? What's Next?

[CommodoreAmiga]

The two fastest cars I’ve owned (Jaguar XJ SuperV8 and Corvette) were both unmodified from their factory config. I promise you that tire noise was not the first thing you heard from either of them outside the car anywhere near wide open throttle at speed. The Jaguar had much less exhaust noise but the supercharger whine was noticeable.

And Jaguar XJ SuperV8 and Corvette are among the most popular, best-selling vehicles on the road. Every other vehicle I see is a Jaguar XJ SuperV8 or Corvette, so clearly I am mistaken.

On the other hand, maybe the top-10 best selling vehicles are actually:

1. Ford F-Series
2. Ram Pickup
3. Chevrolet Silverado
4. Toyota Rav4
5. Honda CR-V
6. Toyota Camry
7. Nissan Rogue
8. Jeep Grand Cherokee
9. Toyota Highlander
10. Honda Civic

All of those, save for a couple limited-production trims, are quiet-as-F going down the road. They aren't belching testosterone and excess. The RAV-4 and CR-V -- the best-selling non-pickup-trucks -- are especially quiet. In fact, in residential settings, most of those vehicles are quieter than the R1T, thanks to the PWS.

Sponsored

 

[Dark-Fx]

And Jaguar XJ SuperV8 and Corvette are among the most popular, best-selling vehicles on the road. Every other vehicle I see is a Jaguar XJ SuperV8 or Corvette, so clearly I am mistaken.

On the other hand, maybe the top-10 best selling vehicles are actually:

1. Ford F-Series
2. Ram Pickup
3. Chevrolet Silverado
4. Toyota Rav4
5. Honda CR-V
6. Toyota Camry
7. Nissan Rogue
8. Jeep Grand Cherokee
9. Toyota Highlander
10. Honda Civic

All of those, save for a couple limited-production trims, are quiet-as-F going down the road. They aren't belching testosterone and excess. The RAV-4 and CR-V -- the best-selling non-pickup-trucks -- are especially quiet. In fact, in residential settings, most of those vehicles are quieter than the R1T, thanks to the PWS.

Problem is you have to get to road speed somehow. That's when cars make noise.

The Hummer EV is pretty loud going in the other direction because of the aggressive tire tread.

 

[_evtrk]

I think they should add a track mode and put back the 130mph people were getting at the normal event, my thought on this is the following:

I have a buddy of mine with a TRX, he's running smaller wheels with way smaller tire than come stock on the vehicle, he's using some drag radials for his track setup and this combo has made his truck way quicker in the quarter mile. just the tire change is over a full second faster in the quarter mile.

If anyone with a rivian is a recreational racer, they can make their trucks quicker and even more fun at the track with just a wheel/tire change, things like this aren't possible with the speed limited this low. while on this topic i think maybe they should allow a way to change the registered tire size on the vehicle for stuff like this.

so in conclusion i say add a track mode, raise the speed, give us a little bit of customization with wheel/tire size, and let us do whatever we think is adventurous with these trucks, both off-road or on road, even when on-road might mean the race track.

 

[SoCal Rob]

And Jaguar XJ SuperV8 and Corvette are among the most popular, best-selling vehicles on the road. Every other vehicle I see is a Jaguar XJ SuperV8 or Corvette, so clearly I am mistaken.

On the other hand, maybe the top-10 best selling vehicles are actually:

1. Ford F-Series
2. Ram Pickup
3. Chevrolet Silverado
4. Toyota Rav4
5. Honda CR-V
6. Toyota Camry
7. Nissan Rogue
8. Jeep Grand Cherokee
9. Toyota Highlander
10. Honda Civic

All of those, save for a couple limited-production trims, are quiet-as-F going down the road. They aren't belching testosterone and excess. The RAV-4 and CR-V -- the best-selling non-pickup-trucks -- are especially quiet. In fact, in residential settings, most of those vehicles are quieter than the R1T, thanks to the PWS.

I didn't say you were wrong; I was just sharing my experiences.

Beyond that, I think you're comparing apples and oranges here: high performance to top-10. Most high performance ICE cars on the market today still make a lot of noise when accelerating briskly or under load as with triple-digit speeds. Compare a Rivian R1T to a Ford Raptor and Ram TRX or an R1S to a Grand Cherokee Trackhawk and tell me how similar they sound. Limited production? Sure, most trucks capable of sub 4-second 0-60 times would probably be considered limited production.

 

[CommodoreAmiga]

I didn't say you were wrong; I was just sharing my experiences.

Beyond that, I think you're comparing apples and oranges here: high performance to top-10. Most high performance ICE cars on the market today still make a lot of noise when accelerating briskly or under load as with triple-digit speeds. Compare a Rivian R1T to a Ford Raptor and Ram TRX or an R1S to a Grand Cherokee Trackhawk and tell me how similar they sound. Limited production? Sure, most trucks capable of sub 4-second 0-60 times would probably be considered limited production.

I think you're moving the goal posts.

 

[SoCal Rob]

I think you're moving the goal posts.

That wasn't my intention. I have a serious and sincere question: How is comparing ICE vehicles in a similar performance class to Rivians moving the goal posts? I was comparing ICE cars at or below 4-second 0-60 times which I have experience with to an EV platform that can do 0-60 in the 3.0 to 3.5 second range depending upon tires and testing.

From my perspective you're using a straw man by changing from a discussion about noise from ICE vehicles with comparable performance to the current Rivians into an argument about regular performance (but popular, no question) ICE vehicles compared to high performance Rivians. I never wrote about popularity of Jaguar SuperV8s and Corvettes but you did.

Most importantly, if you review the conversation you'll see that I didn't say you were wrong, but was adding my experience to show that there are exceptions. I don't understand why this escalated as it did. Can you consider the possibility that we're both right? Rivians may be no quieter at 110 to 130 mph than any of today's top ten ICE vehicles while also being noticeably quieter than ICE vehicles with similar performance which are more likely to be driven at those speeds.

 

[COdogman]

Honestly I can’t believe there are so many people acting as if they have some birthright to drive 100+mph on public roads. Regardless of the vehicle or the amount of experience/ training you think you have - it’s not safe. Not here. This isn’t Germany and American roads are not the Autobahn. The other drivers on our roads do not follow even the most basic safety rules like staying out of the left lane in their jalopies. Even the condition of the roads themselves is far different.

Last time I was there I was in a MB CLS350 CDI going 110mph in the left lane to pass some traffic and a Porsche came up on me from behind like I was standing still. It was nowhere in the mirrors before I changed lanes. And at that point it's sketchy to just jump back into the next lane over again. Things change very quickly at those speeds.

A 'track mode' that people will just choose to use 'in town' in America with our roads and our fellow drivers is even more dangerous IMHO.

 

[CommodoreAmiga]

That wasn't my intention. I have a serious and sincere question: How is comparing ICE vehicles in a similar performance class to Rivians moving the goal posts? I was comparing ICE cars at or below 4-second 0-60 times which I have experience with to an EV platform that can do 0-60 in the 3.0 to 3.5 second range depending upon tires and testing.

0-60 time has nothing to do with it. The issue is top speed. It isn't a matter of acceleration. At highway speeds, exhaust is only louder than tire noise (measured from the ears of other drivers) on a minority of vehicles.

From my perspective you're using a straw man by changing from a discussion about noise from ICE vehicles with comparable performance to the current Rivians into an argument about regular performance (but popular, no question) ICE vehicles compared to high performance Rivians. I never wrote about popularity of Jaguar SuperV8s and Corvettes but you did.

Actually, your argument was the straw-man. I said: "Tire noise is what you hear from most vehicles at speed. Not the engine, unless they changed the muffler." That is accurate. I said most vehicles. You instead decided to go nuh huh what about these two niche super-not-common vehicles????

Most importantly, if you review the conversation you'll see that I didn't say you were wrong, but was adding my experience to show that there are exceptions. I don't understand why this escalated as it did. Can you consider the possibility that we're both right? Rivians may be no quieter at 110 to 130 mph than any of today's top ten ICE vehicles while also being noticeably quieter than ICE vehicles with similar performance which are more likely to be driven at those speeds.

This is anecdotal... I don't have numbers to back it up... But in my personal experience, I think I'm much more likely to find a Camry/Prius/Civic/random-econo-box weaving between traffic and tailgating me than I am to see a Lambo/Porsche doing it. This may simply be because there are so many more of those vehicles on the road... But my point is that the majority of vehicles, anyway.

 

[SoCal Rob]

0-60 time has nothing to do with it. The issue is top speed. It isn't a matter of acceleration. At highway speeds, exhaust is only louder than tire noise (measured from the ears of other drivers) on a minority of vehicles.

I wrote, "One other thing that adds to the danger for others: they aren’t used to a vehicle moving so quickly while making so little noise." when discussing safety issues of Rivians with a top speed ~110 instead of ~130. You responded with, "Tire noise is what you hear from most vehicles at speed. Not the engine, unless they changed the muffler."

The only reason I mentioned the Jaguar was to show that exhaust noise isn't the only noise an ICE vehicle makes. I'm not even going to get into whether supercharger noise is engine noise or not, but it is non-tire noise from a non-EV going fast which is all I wrote about. I did this in a (clearly failed) attempt at non-argumentatively pointing out that I was writing about noise differences between ICE and EV in general, not just engine or exhaust/muffler.

You instead decided to go nuh huh what about these two niche super-not-common vehicles????

I'm sorry that I wrote that in such a way that you got this meaning out of it. I promise that wasn't my intent. Can you please accept that I wasn't trying to pick a fight?

This is anecdotal... I don't have numbers to back it up... But in my personal experience, I think I'm much more likely to find a Camry/Prius/Civic/random-econo-box weaving between traffic and tailgating me than I am to see a Lambo/Porsche doing it. This may simply be because there are so many more of those vehicles on the road... But my point is that the majority of vehicles, anyway.

I completely agree.

Also anecdotal, if I look at the percentage of owners of those types of vehicles I see a different picture. Before I moved from Pennsylvania to Orange County I would've been lucky to see as many exotics (Porsche, Lamborghini, Ferrari, BMW M series, Mercedes AMG series) in a year as I see driving around here in a week. After seeing so many I started to get the sense that the drivers have about the same skill as an average person even though they spend a lot more on what they're driving.

 

[mkg3]

As smart as you may think you are, online forums are always full of super smart people who know better than you do!

I’m excited for the day when a law is passed that electronically limits ALL vehicles on the road to the posted speed LIMIT. And they can limit that reckless acceleration of passenger vehicles to a safer timeframe as well. 0-60 in 3 seconds is much too dangerous. WHP should be limited on every vehicle because anything over what is absolutely necessary for the specific task is also dangerous. Passenger vehicle weight is also a concern so that needs to be limited to prevent heavier vehicles from crushing lighter ones in an accident.

Shame on all of you reckless people for making the choice to drive over the speed limit! That’s not what performance vehicles are for!

Okay, laying on thick here aren't you???

The fast/quick vehicles does not equate to recklessness. Vehicle very slow can be just as reckless in the careless hands.

Countless times, I have avoided accidents because people who are so called safe drivers that put on the vehicle signal and cut people off. Just because one signals, does not equate to change lanes without regard to other vehicles already in that lane. A quick vehicle allows you to get out of the way without having to slam on the brakes unexpectedly and cause a rear-ender.

How about checking one's phone or focused on touch screen to get to multiple layers deep on the screen while driving?

I cannot disagree more to your post. The last thing I need is a vehicle with big brother limiting vehicle speed to the posted speed limit. Everyone's first and foremost priority on the road is to drive defensively and avoid danger. To do so, it may requires you to go faster than the posted speed limit to avoid accidents or to get out of the way.

Just keep in my that if that day comes, and NEW vehicles are speed limited, there are 99% of other vehicles on the road that do not have such a limit so you will definitely be the hazard on the road.

 

[SoCal Rob]

Okay, laying on thick here aren't you???

I took it as satire when I read this:
Shame on all of you reckless people for making the choice to drive over the speed limit! That’s not what performance vehicles are for!

 

[mkg3]

I took it as satire when I read this:
Shame on all of you reckless people for making the choice to drive over the speed limit! That’s not what performance vehicles are for!

Oh! Thanks Rob.... Sorry EVnewb.

This is what I get for reading and replying before morning cup of coffee

 

[lefkonj]

Sorry if someone else said this but maybe it was an adjustment from the speedo. I thought a few testers commented that the speedo was a little faster than reality (about 2 mph). Just a thought.

 

[seajayseven]

Tires are rated to 130. Give us 130.

 

[ironpig]

I'd think the lower speed rating could be for a combination several factors including:

• tires with s safety margin
• engine/driveline stress
• wind resistance
• Etc.

There is no lower speed rating.

Sponsored