R1T & R1S Updated Pricing, Configuration, Specs. Dual Motor Now Available

[EVMatthew22]

My config went up 13k...but this loss is actually 20k since I won't qualify for $7,500 tax credit.....DUDE

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[bd5400]

Do I think this is right way to treat preorder holders? No. Especially not Launch Edition preorder holders.

I don't want to distract from your overall point, but being a Launch Edition preorder holder is not a special status that should entitle anyone to a lower price. There are tons of preorder holders who reserved well before many Launch Edition holders because they wanted the max pack.

 

[Redline]

Somebody knew this was in the works, the stock traded poorly all day today.

Nope.

There has been months of bullish option inflows into Rivian. The move today was tied to Lucid.

 

[Vaejoviscarolinanus]

I had a feeling that when Soros got involved with Rivan he was going to have a negative effect. The guy is Satan. I really wanted to get a pair of these and I have a feeling that it is just going to be a good idea but it will probably never be a real thing.

 

[kanundrum]

Okay so there is a price hike, cool.

How about a got damn article dedicated to the R1S ?!?! How do I even know what im paying 20% more when I haven't seen proper colors/pics/videos of the interior.... LOL.

 

[ex0de]

Curious, since Tesla's inception in production mode, how long did it take them to offer lease options (asking sincerely as I do not know)?

This is what I could find out: Tesla started rolling out leasing options shortly after the debut of its Model S sedan in 2012.

 

[CarterGee]

I don't want to distract from your overall point, but being a Launch Edition preorder holder is not a special status that should entitle anyone to a lower price. There are tons of preorder holders who reserved well before many Launch Edition holders because they wanted the max pack.

Eh, yes and no. I think all LEs (which are being built first) would have been a logical place to draw a line in the sand.

 

[MacO512]

So disappointed! I really liked the thought of having a Rivian. WIth price increases; I thought it would be more like Tesla, where they honor the price at reservation. Or if there was an increase, just a few thousand. But mine today just went from close to $72k to well over $90k for an R1S. It just doesn't make financial sense any longer. I could pick up a new Highlander for ~$35k. Or just drive my current X5 into the dirt. It was a stretch to pay double of the Highlander; but I thought with fuel savings, resale value, and having a much more fun vehicle its worth double the price. But its not worth triple the price. It feels like Rivian pulled a bait and switch. The reservation fee should have been $100 if it didn't mean much of anything. $1000 and years following the company has me feeling like I was played so they could have their IPO, employees could get a bunch of cheap vehicles first, and now they want to exploit early adopters for all they can.

 

[Skigh]

When I was at the road show in Seattle in 2019 their slogan was under promise and over deliver. That's a vast departure from what they are doing to us right now. Seriously disappointed in this news. I get a price increase, but taking the loss on this wouldn’t have made a dent in their big picture and I highly doubt honoring their price would take them into the red on a sale to us at the original price. I’ve never written a negative post on here but this was handled poorly, full stop. I will wait for the dust to settle but I won’t wait long.

 

[AxelR]

I guess we should have thought we were being played when a no name company asked for a thousand dollar deposit more than any other company asked before for such a vehicle - roadster set aside).
Anybody remembers those scam emails from some prince wanting to give us millions of dollars in exchange for our bank account number????

 

[godfodder0901]

My config went up 13k...but this loss is actually 20k since I won't qualify for $7,500 tax credit.....DUDE

Why would you lose the tax credit?

 

[cardad]

This seemed pretty inevitable. If you knew anything about Rivian pre 2021 you knew they were at best walking a thin line between being the next Tesla and being the next Fisker. This was fairly predictable given the basic economics for EVs and the raw cost calculations that you could have easily done on the R1T/S. The thing has a huge battery pack that’s around 30% larger than a Model S/X and priced 20% less?? ADD ON up to 50%+ raw inputs inflation etc and you have what, only a 15% price jump?

They obviously could not have anticipated raw material costs skyrocketing like they have in 2020-2022 and this seems like a difficult decision that was probably in the works for many months. I’ve been saying all along they had negative margins with their supposed pricing and this was just proof. So if they’re acknowledging reality then they’re not stupid and are doing their best to turn things around. If they can repair their brand and scale then they might survive.

For similar money (ie $75k + $10k ADM (if you’re lucky) you can buy a Bronco Raptor that is slower and uses gas, for more money you can get a Defender V8 that is also slower and uses gas, etc. etc. It’s definitely a bait and switch so I get the outrage but at the end of the day it’s still pretty cheap compared to the competition.

$85k for a quad motor spec gets you 0-60 times in the neighborhood of $150k+ supercars and the off road capability of a Defender? There are people who pay $275k+ for G wagens and $150k for Porsche Taycan crossovers. If you’re a launch edition reservation holder you should just sell your reservation rather than cancel it because you probably still have $15k in arbitrage. The first Bronco sold for almost $200k and First Edition Broncos are being purchased by dealers at auction for $80k+ aka $15k over MSRP.

There’s a lot of overreacting here. Some people here don’t understand money at all and basically just threw away a bunch of it by cancelling their very early reservation (because they are (justifiably) pissed off). Even if you couldn’t afford the Rivian at the new price maybe you could still make enough flipping it to give yourself $10k-$15k off another vehicle of your choice. It’s still a winning proposition if you understood the basic numbers…

 

[E.S.]

This is what I could find out: Tesla started rolling out leasing options shortly after the debut of its Model S sedan in 2012.

So, since the company first started producing cars (their first edition Roadster) they haven't leased vehicles. It was only after the Model S got introduced that leasing became an option. That being the case, as Rivian is only 5 months into production mode, why is anyone surprised they too do not have a lease option this early in their production lifespan?

 

[kanundrum]

Okay so there is a price hike, cool.

How about a got damn article dedicated to the R1S ?!?! How do I even know what im paying 20% more when I haven't seen proper colors/pics/videos of the interior.... LOL.

 

[mightypile]

I suspect that's a very optimistic revenue projection from the price increase both from the perspective of cancelations and average transaction price. I think the reason Rivian is burning everyone who preordered is that they have come to terms (as has Lucid) that they can't ramp production nearly as fast as they thought they could and holding onto preorders doesn't really matter if you can only make a thousand vehicles a month. Like Lucid, I expect Rivian will announce that they are cutting their production targets. That's the only way this makes sense. The revenue isn't enough to jeopardize their, "handshake with the world and the first step in building a relationship with our customers. -RJ" At the same time they are cutting production projections, they want to push people away from the early run of low margin quad motor variants that depend on expensive third party Bosch parts to dual motor versions they will build themselves in 2024 when they hope they can finally scale up.

If Rivian knows that they are going to be lucky to build 12k vehicles this year, you might as well torch your preorderers because very few of them are going to get their vehicles anytime s00n anyway. That vehicle you preordered in 2019 is probably getting delivered in 2023 even after all the preorder cancelations. If you order today, say hello to 2H 2024. With such low production numbers, these vehicles will be beyond niche so you might as well raise the prices a ton since there will still be a thousand people a month who don't care. I do worry that by 2025 when Rivian might finally be opening a new factory and producing these extremely expensive SUVs and trucks in volume, there will be plenty of competitors to choose from who aren't selling designs and tech from 2018. In that case, maybe they just drop the consumer side and concentrate on van sales. If Rivian is having this much trouble after all this time building just these two very similar vehicles, I can't say I'm optimistic they will get to their Jeep competitor in time to matter.

If I'm wrong and they aren't cutting production, I'm stumped. To give no consideration at all to even Lauch Edition preorders is terrible for their brand. As long as people who preordered got some discount, a lot of this would blow over but to treat people who ordered years ago like this is rotten. I'd like to see the company succeed but this looks really bad.

You make good points. So long as they're selling everything they can make, all's well in the short term. And you're right, some people cancelling their reservations today may forgive and come back next year.

For myself, I've gone from enthusiastic (wearing my Rivian hat around town and telling people how cool the R1T will be) to undecided. But the bigger thing is that yesterday I would have happily signed up for any membership package without looking hard at the price and value. Now I still want that truck, but I'm no fan boy. My decisions will be more rational and Rivian will have to earn my money.

I think the harm to Rivian's reputation today (imperfectly reflected in stock price tomorrow?) is greater than what it would have cost them to honor reservation pricing. But I'm wrong a lot trying to predict the future, so we'll see.

I really hope they can earn back that goodwill somehow and build trucks so good we can't ignore them.

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