Apple CarPlay and Android for R1T / R1S?

[electruck]

They did in fact miss IMO. Apple CarPlay should have been integrated. But this is now an Amazon company and there’s no way Bezos will allow Apple in his vehicles

Depends on how you define "miss". As in something they should have done, yes, I agree this was a "miss". As in an oversight, no, this was a clear business decision because they want to monetize their own software. As in a bad business decision, well, we'll just have to see how that works for them. They have clearly hit a home run with the engineering of the vehicle (obviously still need to execute on mass production) but it remains to be seen if they can also be a software company. Based on what we've seen to date of their limited software, I'm afraid they're finding it more difficult than they had imagined. It's certainly not getting the rave reviews like the rest of the vehicle.

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[SoCal Rob]

Depends on how you define "miss". As in something they should have done, yes, I agree this was a "miss". As in an oversight, no, this was a clear business decision because they want to monetize their own software. As in a bad business decision, well, we'll just have to see how that works for them. They have clearly hit a home run with the engineering of the vehicle (obviously still need to execute on mass production) but it remains to be seen if they can also be a software company. Based on what we've seen to date of their limited software, I'm afraid they're finding it more difficult than they had imagined. It's certainly not getting the rave reviews like the rest of the vehicle.

I think they are finding it more difficult than they imagined because they imagined people would be comparing their infotainment to Tesla’s and not to Android Auto/CarPlay which virtually every other vehicle for sale in the U.S. incorporates. If that is what happened then I agree with @Rivian_Hugh_III that it is a miss.

Even if that isn’t what happened, did Rivian think that reviewers and customers aren’t going to notice that your near-luxury or luxury vehicle lacks a feature which is available on the likes of a Mitsubishi Mirage or a Kia Forte? We noticed and many perceive it is as arrogant (we know what you want better than you do) or a miss (we had no idea you’d want this feature offered as an option on economy cars) regardless of their actual intentions.

 

[lefkonj]

I don't understand the 'lost revenue piece' some are stating. Rivian can try what BMW did and charge for CarPlay, it failed and they rolled back within a year. If they think they are going to make money with their own infotainment/selling stuff I just don't get it. I buy things from my phone/tablet not my car, don't think that will ever change. I get not doing it for launch though, it is a engineering effort to make it work and work well.

 

[electruck]

I don't understand the 'lost revenue piece' some are stating. Rivian can try what BMW did and charge for CarPlay, it failed and they rolled back within a year. If they think they are going to make money with their own infotainment/selling stuff I just don't get it. I buy things from my phone/tablet not my car, don't think that will ever change. I get not doing it for launch though, it is a engineering effort to make it work and work well.

I don't think they're planning to charge for AA/CP, they will charge for their own features and apps. Supporting AA/CP would undermine their ability to do that. From, the Rivian Membership page:

 

[Engi_Nerd]

The more clarity we get on the EV truck race, the more I really respect some of the decisions being made at Ford. Their inverter tech is the best, by far. In my opinion, if you're living with the limitations of current battery tech, you should be able to leverage that battery any way you want, and Ford is somehow the only one offering that. Their infotainment may not be the best, but it's the most customer friendly. Giant AA/ACP will be super easy to use and not try to monetize you, aside from typical Google/Apple. The giant, easy access front trunk is a better execution IMO than the smaller Rivian frunk and gear tunnel. For me, the 5.5 ft bed is also the Goldilocks size. CT is too big and R1T pretty dang small. Still like the styling and overall size of the Rivian, but its looking more and more like I'd get my lightning a year or more before my R1T shows up.

 

[Obioban]

Their reply was not a no!

Hello Ian,

I hope you are having a good day. Thanks for your interest in Rivian and for reaching out to the Rivian team with your question.

Apple CarPlay is being discussed as an over-the-air update soon, but it has not been confirmed.

Have a great rest of your week and weekend!

Your fellow adventurer,
Rodney

 

[mgc0216]

If you haven’t already, please email Rivian [email protected] or call them at
888-RIVIAN1
Weekdays: 7 AM-8 PM (CST)
Weekends: 10:30 AM-7 PM (CST)

Let them know that the lack of CarPlay is preventing you from ordering.

They know that some of us (raising my hand) want CarPlay. A lot.
They also know we are buying a Rivian anyway so it may not carry as much weight as losing a potential customer, like you.

I’ve certainly written enough already about how it would benefit Rivian and customers to offer Android Auto and Apple CarPlay so I won’t repeat myself.

Please let them know this is an absolute requirement for some shoppers and maybe they will change their course on this.

Thanks!

Rivian Sr. Product Manager: "Hey, I think you better see this. There are a few dozen people on an Internet forum saying that CarPlay is really important. So important they may not follow through on their preorders that they have had for 3 years. And, I know that we've been telling them we wont' support CarPlay or Android Auto during that time, but gosh they seem serious"

Rivian VP of Product Management "Geez I know we have done a bunch of cost benefit analysis here - looked at build vs. buy decisions and how that affects purchase intent. Heck we even held those focus groups and did those surveys. Oh and don't forget we checked out what our competition was doing in this space. The other thing was considering how us controlling the underlying platform completely allows us to do partnerships and integrations we might not be able to otherwise. I mean this decision has been thoroughly studied including RJ weighing in on it several times.

But, you're right, we never considered a couple dozen internet users not wanting to buy the truck, better change it"

BTW: I would love it if they had CarPlay, but the lack of CarPlay is about item 164 on key decision criteria for me. My larger point here is I'm sure they have reasons why they didn't do it, and I'm sure they know it irks some folks and some folks won't buy the vehicle because of it. I mean y'all do y 'all, but to me it's pissing in the wind at this point.

 

[sub]

Apple's Car Play and Google's Android Auto are a huge step up from the garbage infotainment systems legacy automakers had before Apple/Google came to their rescue, but better than garbage is not much of a compliment. A well designed native interface has the potential to be significantly superior to Android Auto / Carplay. For one thing, I would like it to work even when I don't have my phone on me.

I interpret the lack of Android Auto and Carplay as a statement that Rivian cares about software and plans to build a great native interface which has the potential to be significantly better than Apple Car Play and Android Auto. So I view the lack of Apple Car Play and Android Auto as a significant selling point.

Of course if Rivian designed a great full featured native interface and then added CP/AA as well, that would be even better. But I have never seen anyone do that. In every CP/AA vehicle I have driven, it has felt like the manufacturer was resentful that the world moved on from the days when they could get away with just slapping in a generic din stereo and calling it a day.

 

[Rad]

Seems like some Rivian features and capabilities will require a subscription. Like it or hate it - it seems like Rivian is moving forward with a recurring revenue model. Software companies have had this issue in converting perpetual software licenses into subscriptions - it took a long time, but consumers and businesses are used to it. Maybe it is time for the auto industry? I'm not a fan.

I don't own a Tesla and haven't researched this matter, but I would guess that Tesla has features that are provided on a subscription basis.

 

[SoCal Rob]

Rivian Sr. Product Manager: "Hey, I think you better see this. There are a few dozen people on an Internet forum saying that CarPlay is really important. So important they may not follow through on their preorders that they have had for 3 years. And, I know that we've been telling them we wont' support CarPlay or Android Auto during that time, but gosh they seem serious"

Rivian VP of Product Management "Geez I know we have done a bunch of cost benefit analysis here - looked at build vs. buy decisions and how that affects purchase intent. Heck we even held those focus groups and did those surveys. Oh and don't forget we checked out what our competition was doing in this space. The other thing was considering how us controlling the underlying platform completely allows us to do partnerships and integrations we might not be able to otherwise. I mean this decision has been thoroughly studied including RJ weighing in on it several times.

But, you're right, we never considered a couple dozen internet users not wanting to buy the truck, better change it"

BTW: I would love it if they had CarPlay, but the lack of CarPlay is about item 164 on key decision criteria for me. My larger point here is I'm sure they have reasons why they didn't do it, and I'm sure they know it irks some folks and some folks won't buy the vehicle because of it. I mean y'all do y 'all, but to me it's pissing in the wind at this point.

I agree with you that CP is low on my priority list. I’m hoping they do so well with their infotainment that it isn’t even an issue for me once I get my R1S.

It sounds to me like you’re telling people:
1. Rivian doesn’t have enough official feedback to reconsider their decision.
2. Don’t waste your time officially communicating your request to Rivian.

Just giving up or complaining in places like this but not telling Rivian (#2) ensures #1 will always be true.

I’m not saying that telling them will definitely change anything. That was the ”maybe“ part in my statement, “Please let them know this is an absolute requirement for some shoppers and maybe they will change their course on this.”

If enough people (customers, potential customers, and reviewers) civilly and directly communicate with Rivian via official channels that this is an issue there is a chance they might change course. If everyone ONLY gripes about it in places like this then, yes, their perception will be, “There are a few dozen people on an Internet forum saying that CarPlay is really important.”

My understanding is that BMW customers complained enough to BMW about their policy on CarPlay as a recurring subscription that BMW reversed their decision. Rivian should be more agile than a legacy car maker, and I bet a lot of people would be satisfied if Rivian improved to what others rejected from BMW: make Android Auto and Apple CarPlay subscription add-ons. Then all the people complaining about the lack of the feature would have to put up (subscribe) or shut up (live with the Rivian system). Rivian then gets a revenue stream from the people who value deeper phone integration. That sounds like a win for everyone involved to me.

 

[mgc0216]

Long well reason post snipped.

I am just going Don Quixote on Internet windmills.

The reality is that if enough people complain then maybe they change their mind. What actually triggered (such a loaded term - no pun intended) my post was this idea that there are a significant number of people who won't buy the car because there is no CarPlay / Android Auto (you didn't say significant, but if it's expected that such feedback would have an affect the number would have to be significant - the cost of not doing it because you lose out on sales revenue > the cost of implementing it)

It's endemic on this forum (and the Internet in general) for people to underestimate the thought that goes into these decisions. Rivian is not incompetent, they have data and reasons for the decisions they make. The idea what the board of directors should read an internet forum to learn how to run the company is ludicrous (this was from another post).

ALL that being said: It's an internet forum in a free country.

 

[timesinks]

I have a bunch of content on my phone ready for offline use. Music, podcasts, audio books from the public library. Yes, I can use bluetooth audio. If I don't have CarPlay, my phone will be mounted on a vent or the windshield so that I can switch from a podcast to a book or to my music. I won't be able to take advantage of the built-in charge pad because a mounted phone will be my only way, while driving, to "change the station" so to speak.

Today, Rivian has just Spotify. And I don't use Spotify.

We have a Panasonic smart TV that we bought circa 2011. At the time, it had a Hulu, Netflix, and YouTube app. One by one, each of those native apps got discontinued. Not even the streaming giants found it worthwhile to maintain different apps for each generation of a dozen's manufacturers different platforms.

Instead, we attach an Apple TV to the device (or a Fire stick, or whatever Google calls their thing). Magically, our 10-year-old TV is smart again.

Add support for AA/CP to a vehicle, and all of a sudden you have on-screen support for dozens upon dozens of apps, both mainstream and niche (like the one my public library uses for loaned audio books). In the AA/CP world, each developer adds automotive support in their own app. And Rivian expends only the resources to keep the AA/CP implementation up to date.

I'm not saying they shouldn't have a strong, smart infotainment offering that works completely even when you don't have your phone with you. They absolutely should. But I disagree that such an offering even has the potential to outshine the user experience of AA/CP which allows me to access and seamless witch between the content that's already on my phone using all my apps that are already logged in.

Many reviewers have mentioned that they feel this is one of Rivian's few misses. It's not just a bunch of crazies on a forum. Continue telling CS and your guide. When you get your vehicle (because for almost all of us complainers, it's not an actual dealbreaker) and you're using a phone mount and a USB cable rather than the charging pad, take a photo and tweet them about how annoying it is that you have to resort to such tacky measures in such a nice car because they refused to implement AA/CP. That is probably the single most effective thing you can do to get them to change course.

 

[Dbeglor]

I would offer up that the more likely successful approach is that, instead of beating heads against the wall asking for CP/AA, the more likely outcome is asking for the things about CP/AA you like to be integrated into Rivian's UI/UX. It will be a living thing that will continually change.

Asking for CP/AA will fall on deaf ears. Letting Rivian know how they can create the most loved and well thought out UI will not, because that will be a core differentiator in the future of the vehicle industry. There is little reason Rivian can't create most if not all of what people love about CP/AA. If they are to be successful, their software department will grow to a size that will rival that of Apple or Google's smartphone teams (they already include many people from there). I think some people don't believe that because of the experience with legacy makers who don't have a software department.

 

[yizzung]

https://www.theverge.com/platform/a...pple-carplay-google-android-auto-vs-carmakers

 

[Attesan997]

I guess my overall sentiment is Tesla hasn't had AA/Carplay and is open about not including it in the future. They're also the most valuable "car company" in the world and sell everything that rolls off the line, QA be damned.

Rivian could do it differently, not saying its impossible and I hope they do. In a post Tesla world the blueprint is out there for anyone to follow, one which ends up rewarding investors heftily. Where listening to every whim of the customer isn't so important. Not saying one shouldn't reach out about AA/Carplay, just saying those who are extraordinarily passionate should temper their expectations.

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