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Growing efficiency Gap: R2 w/ 21" vs. 20" tire sets

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ksurfier

ksurfier

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7% rejected? 😆

your AI must have a short context window
If an R2 user is 2.75 MPK, does that match with the vehicles long term average? More example my R1S is essentially 2.3 MPK, if I was hooked up to Roamer, would my value match the vehicle average or is there some other computation to land at 2.75?
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stewmander

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Ok, but no R2 has a full size spare tire regardless of wheel choice. (I personally couldn't care less I won't even get the compact spare tire)
Yes, all the more reason to get the more available tire size. Round and round we go.
 

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Yes, all the more reason to get the more available tire size. Round and round we go.
How is it more available exactly? There's only 1 choice for for 20" or 21" since you're not going to replace a single busted 20" tire with something other than what Rivian puts on and have 1 tire different than the other 3.
 

stewmander

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How is it more available exactly? There's only 1 choice for for 20" or 21" since you're not going to replace a single busted 20" tire with something other than what Rivian puts on and have 1 tire different than the other 3.
13 > 1, pretty simple. As a temporary, emergency solution, it's ok, I've done it to get home.

Tire Rack R2.webp
 

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As a temporary, emergency solution you can use any size rim and any size tire that matches the dimensions of the busted tire/wheel combo so I don't get how it's such a big deal. But whatever.
 

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As a temporary, emergency solution you can use any size rim and any size tire that matches the dimensions of the busted tire/wheel combo so I don't get how it's such a big deal. But whatever.
finding a wheel that fits the bolt pattern and a tire that goes with it to get to the correct outside diameter is not exactly an easy emergency solution.

Finding a tire that fits your wheel in a pinch is a good thing. Take it from someone who had a car once that only had two tire options available (2009 Honda Fit) and got a flat. Tire shops didn't carry it because the Fit Sport with the 16 inch wheel was the only car that exact size was used on. Had to wait 2 days for them to get it in.
 

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Please post publicly when there has been a fair efficiency/range comparison between the 20"s and 21"s. This is important for me. My order window is Sept/Oct. I make two 1000 mile trips a year and have opted, at this point, for the 21"s entirely for the range. I like the looks of the 20"s better.

I live on a dirt road and there may be times when I will take the R2 on a road that is rocky and rugged, but not often and only to get to an obscure hiking area. I am not an "off-roader." The 20" might.be preferable in this case.

If there is truly no decent range difference between the two, I want to change my current configuration immediately.
 

SarahsDad

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Please post publicly when there has been a fair efficiency/range comparison between the 20"s and 21"s. This is important for me. My order window is Sept/Oct. I make two 1000 mile trips a year and have opted, at this point, for the 21"s entirely for the range. I like the looks of the 20"s better.

I live on a dirt road and there may be times when I will take the R2 on a road that is rocky and rugged, but not often and only to get to an obscure hiking area. I am not an "off-roader." The 20" might.be preferable in this case.

If there is truly no decent range difference between the two, I want to change my current configuration immediately.
How about Rivian Roamer's own comments about HIS data, which closely match the EPA rated differences. For road trips the 21's are clearly more efficient.

Thes numbers normalize for speed. At 70 MPH the difference is about 7% benefit for 21s. But, again I'm not comfortable sharing more data because many of the vehicles are still under the 2,500 mile break in period for the tires.
 
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ksurfier

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How about Rivian Roamer's own comments about HIS data, which closely match the EPA rated differences. For road trips the 21's are clearly more efficient.
Data don’t support that notion, unfortunately:

IMG_8363.webp
 

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r2fb

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finding a wheel that fits the bolt pattern and a tire that goes with it to get to the correct outside diameter is not exactly an easy emergency solution.

Finding a tire that fits your wheel in a pinch is a good thing. Take it from someone who had a car once that only had two tire options available (2009 Honda Fit) and got a flat. Tire shops didn't carry it because the Fit Sport with the 16 inch wheel was the only car that exact size was used on. Had to wait 2 days for them to get it in.
I get it but just 2 days is no big deal in my book, the worst case I can rent a car for that time. I think it's just overblown.
 

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Please post publicly when there has been a fair efficiency/range comparison between the 20"s and 21"s. This is important for me.
What you want are multiple side by side tests.

This is the only valid thing we can pull from the Rivian Roamer data so far:

These numbers normalize for speed. At 70 MPH the difference is about 7% benefit for 21s. But, again I'm not comfortable sharing more data because many of the vehicles are still under the 2,500 mile break in period for the tires.
I've filtered out segments in the 50, 60 an 70 mph range and the 21s come out ahead.
 
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ksurfier

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This is your own graph. You think this shows a "Growing efficiency gap"?
Yes, descriptively it does. Statistically, we don't yet know whether the gap itself is significantly growing. As the dataset has grown, the expected 21" efficiency advantage has not emerged; instead, the observed difference has moved progressively in favor of the 20". If the vehicle-level confidence intervals now exclude zero, then we can graduate from “emerging” to a statistically demonstrated 20" advantage.

Miles20"21"Gap20" advantage
25k2.702.68+0.02+0.7%
30k2.722.70+0.02+0.7%
40k2.782.73+0.05+1.8%
50k2.802.74+0.06+2.2%
 
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ksurfier

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Please post publicly when there has been a fair efficiency/range comparison between the 20"s and 21"s. This is important for me. My order window is Sept/Oct. I make two 1000 mile trips a year and have opted, at this point, for the 21"s entirely for the range. I like the looks of the 20"s better.

I live on a dirt road and there may be times when I will take the R2 on a road that is rocky and rugged, but not often and only to get to an obscure hiking area. I am not an "off-roader." The 20" might.be preferable in this case.

If there is truly no decent range difference between the two, I want to change my current configuration immediately.
At this point we can't identify any efficiency advantage to the 21" tires/wheels, it's rumored to exist but I looked for it using multiple test drives, sifting through the Roamer user data and asking users for their average long-term efficiency. What we know presently is on average there appears to be a slight 20" advantage of 1-2%. Looking at both setups, it's possible that high speed has negative aero effects for the 21s, so it may be once over ~70 mph the negative aero takes over and offsets any potential benefits of the 21s. I also think the sipping may have an effect. Ultimately, the 21s may ek out a slight advantage to 20s, I would underscore 'slight'...Get the tires/wheels that best suit your needs/wants.
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