Do I really need the Max Pack?

[DuckTruck]

That was Kafka? Do you remember which story/book?

AJ,

I don't recall the source. It could be The Metamorphosis. His writings can be so dark and I'm not one to read his works from cover to cover. That said, many of his observations strike a chord with me . He has so many quotes that I didn't even know were his, only to find out later. Some of my favorites include "They say ignorance is bliss.... they're wrong", and "It's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves".

I take it you're a fan of the man?

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[CommodoreAmiga]

So your saying, buy a Ford F-150 Hybrid?

No.

 

[Wanderer]

If you are well versed in the dark arts of statistical analysis, you're not using your skills. You don't have enough data to get to 95% confidence interval and you should know it. You don't need thousands of test runs, but you do need at least tens of test runs to draw any real conclusions.

The 95% was a joke, because it doesn’t need to be a statistical exercise. Repeating the test once as they did is enough to give me a very high degree of confidence in this instance that their findings would more or less be true. It’s a machine and when you control for variables you will get the same result just about every time.

These were done at 70mph, and there is a significant difference between that and 80mph. That extra 10mph would suck about 15% off range.

It’s impossible for any anecdotal evidence or even a collection of user provided data to be accurate because you have no idea what the conditions were. Particularly temp and elevation which would cause as much or more effect as speed. Those two variables are accounted for in the inside evs test (100% for elevation as they use the same track, not perfect for temp but they note efforts to control for that).

 

[ajdelange]

I take it you're a fan of the man?

Oh yes. From the day someone handed me a copy of The Metamorphosis and said "Hey, check this out." I missed my next two classes. I've visited his digs in the Golden Lane and even started on my own translation of The Metamorphosis. I remember asking a German colleague what an Ungezeifer was. His answer was that he wasn't sure but that it is what his father used to call him and his brother when he was mad at them.

 

[thrill]

Oh yes. From the day someone handed me a copy of The Metamorphosis and said "Hey, check this out." I missed my next two classes. I've visited his digs in the Golden Lane and even started on my own translation of The Metamorphosis. I remember asking a German colleague what an Ungezeifer was. His answer was that he wasn't sure but that it is what his father used to call him and his brother when he was mad at them.

I think it's an "unclean animal" (not acceptable for sacrifice).

 

[ajdelange]

The 95% was a joke, because it doesn’t need to be a statistical exercise. Repeating the test once as they did is enough to give me a very high degree of confidence in this instance that their findings would more or less be true.

You've already convinced us that you don't understand statistics or testing. No further proof is required.

 

[BigE]

No.

?…I know you didn’t. Just after I read your response, I was thinking the R1T or EV’s maybe are just not ready for “adventure” people like me that want to tow a camper. If I stick with the Max pack, I would think I won’t have one till next summer so hopefully we’ll have some real world videos, maybe TLF and Sandy Munro will have one torn down before then and I’ll be better informed at that point. To date, Rivian has given me Zero information of value in our email exchanges.

 

[ajdelange]

I think it's an "unclean animal" (not acceptable for sacrifice).

It is indeed but let's not tell Rainer that.

 

[Smithery]

I haven't read all 6 pages (so far) of this thread. I hope this has been said already.

If this is your forever truck, then yes you want the max pack.

We're on our 2nd owned EV, 3rd overall. And the takeaway from our progression is simply "battery capacity is king"

You'd resent your forever-truck the first time you need it to go 310 miles and you didn't get the max pack.
You'd resent your forever-truck once you realize that regularly driving at 80 and taking a 20% reduction in range is worth more to you than that $10k-spread-out-over-4-years was.
You'd resent your forever-truck when - 5 years down the line when you really start to see the battery degradation - your occasional 250 mile trips are no longer possible on one charge.
You'd resent your forever-truck when you want to start towing things to a common destination you go to but "can't quite make it anymore" without charging.

Get the max pack.

 

[Ray R]

I haven't read all 6 pages (so far) of this thread. I hope this has been said already.

If this is your forever truck, then yes you want the max pack.

We're on our 2nd owned EV, 3rd overall. And the takeaway from our progression is simply "battery capacity is king"

You'd resent your forever-truck the first time you need it to go 310 miles and you didn't get the max pack.
You'd resent your forever-truck once you realize that regularly driving at 80 and taking a 20% reduction in range is worth more to you than that $10k-spread-out-over-4-years was.
You'd resent your forever-truck when - 5 years down the line when you really start to see the battery degradation - your occasional 250 mile trips are no longer possible on one charge.
You'd resent your forever-truck when you want to start towing things to a common destination you go to but "can't quite make it anymore" without charging.

Get the max pack.

Your comments actually convince me to get the Large pack. I will never use the truck in any of the examples you listed.
Mind-bending acceleration is probably the most important feature to me. I think the lighter weight of the Large pack should help with that.
That said, I asked a CSS today which configuration would offer the best performance for 0-60 and 1/4 mile. She said they should all perform the same. Not sure I believe it, but there it is.
I should also add that the Rivian will not be our only vehicle. We also have a Subaru Outback, and a Bolt that will go to our daughter once the Rivian arrives.

 

[BigE]

Your comments actually convince me to get the Large pack. I will never use the truck in any of the examples you listed.
Mind-bending acceleration is probably the most important feature to me. I think the lighter weight of the Large pack should help with that.
That said, I asked a CSS today which configuration would offer the best performance for 0-60 and 1/4 mile. She said they should all perform the same. Not sure I believe it, but there it is.

Early estimates of 0-60 mph per RJ was 3.0 sec for Large pack, 3.2 sec for Max Pack.

 

[ajdelange]

Should be about the same. A bigger battery weighs more and so extra power is required to accelerate the more massive trucks. At the same time the bigger batteries can supply more peak power. I doubt these two effects offset each other exactly but it should be pretty close.

 

[Ray R]

Should be about the same. A bigger battery weighs more and so extra power is required to accelerate the more massive trucks. At the same time the bigger batteries can supply more peak power. I doubt these two effects offset each other exactly but it should be pretty close.

Isn’t battery power somehow regulated to avoid damage to the motors and controlling components, as well as damage to the batteries themselves?
If so, then I think Rivian would have to use different regulators for the different battery packs to achieve similar performance results.

 

[CommodoreAmiga]

Isn’t battery power somehow regulated to avoid damage to the motors and controlling components, as well as damage to the batteries themselves?
If so, then I think Rivian would have to use different regulators for the different battery packs to achieve similar performance results.

I would think it’s software-controlled. Hardware could be different or it could all be spec’d to handle load of all packs — we don’t know, yet.

 

[azbill]

I lose more than 20% over EPA rating in my Bolt if I'm driving 80 mph, that's typically the speed I drive on the highway here regardless of what vehicle I'm in. If it's a long trip in the Bolt and I have to stop to recharge, I slow down a lot.

Same for me in the Bolt. In AZ speed limits are 75, and at 75 my range is 190 miles (versus EPA 238). One time driving Phoenix to Tucson at 75 and 30 mph wind, my range was down to less than 170.

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