Wassym Bensaid DECODER interview: AI Rivian Assistant, Apple CarPlay, VW Joint Venture

[RomanMF]

Wassym joined The Verge's editor-in-chief, Nilay Patel, on DECODER to discuss the software-defined vehicles, the VW partnership, the R2, and A.I in the car.


RV Tech group is over 1,000 developers
A.I processing via the cloud to be faster on R2 partially due to 5G network
Doubled down on voice>buttons
Doubled down on no CarPlay, but building hooks for it for VW groups using their platform.

Plenty more in the video. DECODER is one of my favorite podcasts.


Moderator addition - video summary / time stamps:

The discussion centers on the future of software-defined vehicles, Rivian’s new AI assistant, their controversial stance against physical buttons and Apple CarPlay, and how their technology is being scaled across the Volkswagen Group.

1. The Rivian-Volkswagen Joint Venture (RVTech)

• A "Clean Sheet" Approach: Bensaid explains that traditional automakers struggle with software because they rely on hundreds of disjointed electronic control units (ECUs) from different suppliers [13:11]. RVTech aims to replace this with a centralized "zonal architecture" powered by a handcoded operating system [11:14].
• Massive Industry Scale: The underlying technology built by Rivian will eventually power everything from mass-market cars like the upcoming sub-$25,000 Volkswagen ID.1 to luxury brands like Audi, Porsche, and Lamborghini [07:19].

2. The AI-Powered Rivian Assistant

• Deep Car Integration: Unlike a simple chatbot overlay, the new Rivian Assistant functions as the "connective tissue" of the vehicle [31:54]. Because it is integrated directly into the car's core computing brain, users can ask it to change drive modes or adjust the air suspension dynamically [32:33].
• Safety Guardrails: Bensaid explains that the assistant is intentionally blocked from controlling certain regulated or safety-critical functions, such as windshield wipers or highway assistance, due to strict regulatory and reliability frameworks [33:11].
• The Power of Local Processing ("Edge AI"): While current vehicles rely heavily on the cloud, the upcoming Rivian R2 will pack massive local computing power (up to 200 tops of compute) [45:54]. Processing voice requests locally inside the car will slash latency, eliminate connectivity issues, and drastically lower long-term cloud inference costs for the company [48:25].

3. The Philosophy on Buttons and Apple CarPlay

• Why Buttons are an Anomaly: Bensaid doubles down on his belief that voice should be the primary interface while driving [37:02]. He argues that previous voice systems were simply "broken," but modern large language models finally make natural human conversation inside a vehicle possible [37:29].
• The Anti-CarPlay Stance: Rivian remains strictly committed to excluding Apple CarPlay and Android Auto. Bensaid states that screen-mirroring solutions "take over every single pixel" and degrade the proprietary user experience [55:12].
• Shifting Customer Demands: According to internal company surveys, when Rivian first launched, over 70% of buyers requested CarPlay; today, that number has dropped below 25% because users prefer the vehicle's deeply integrated native navigation and media tools [56:08].
• An "Agentic" Future: In the future, instead of picking an app icon on a screen, the car will use an "agent-to-agent" framework [01:01:25]. For example, the Rivian Assistant will securely communicate with your phone's personal assistant (like Google Gemini) to stream niche third-party apps or coordinate calendar events seamlessly [59:21].

4. Vehicle Roadmaps: R2 vs. R3X

• Prioritizing the R2: When asked why the highly anticipated, smaller R3X crossover isn't coming first, Bensaid notes that launching the larger, family-friendly R2 SUV is the right strategic trade-off to build high-volume scale in the US market [01:04:40]. Success with the R2 will ultimately "earn the right" for Rivian to build more emotional cars like the R3X [01:04:58].

Watch the full interview on YouTube: Rivian's software chief thinks you don't need CarPlay or buttons | Decoder

Sponsored

 

[CharonPDX]

Voice is *TERRIBLE* when driving. Sure, in some situations it may be "fine." But if you're in a car full of noisy kids, there isn't a quiet moment for the voice recognition to isolate you properly. If you just want to turn on the defroster, or adjust the volume up and down, having to interrupt the music or audiobook you're listening to to do it is annoying.

The "take over every single pixel" claim for CarPlay/Android Auto is just patently false - in my Mach-E, CarPlay only uses about 2/3 of *ONE* display. I still have my climate controls at the bottom of the display (and my physical volume wheel.)

The "AI agents will do everything" is horribly overoptimistic. And "niche third-party apps" work in CarPlay/Android Auto just fine - where I may want to see albums displayed, not just have Bluetooth audio coming through. And they won't work with Disney+ or HBOMax or Netflix while parked charging.

Just admit you want full control over the user experience, and are unwilling to give the user even the option to choose something else already. And that you want to charge them $$ for Connect+.

 

[SwampNut]

Bensaid states that screen-mirroring solutions "take over every single pixel"

A lie that is easily proven. Very disappointed to see the Rivian guys follow the Musk path into gaslighting.

 

[RomanMF]

I strongly disagree with Wass about voice and it being the next frontier. If the R2 didn't have the Halo Wheels, I wouldn't be interested in buying one. I think this shift towards touch screen only cockpits is the most braindead design pivot in the automotive industry. It's almost as bad as our collective decision to allow trucks to get so monstrously large. Touch screen-dominant, and voice-first, UX are not better experiences. I'd argue design's like Tesla's are outright dangerous in their current implementation. This design philosophy is my least favorite thing about Rivian and I'm practically holding my nose and moving forward despite my reservations.

I'm actually with them on the CarPlay front, ideologically, but I worry they're fighting a losing battle. I didn't realize phone projection implementation wasn't an all or nothing situation, which weakens their position and makes Wass look disingenuous here. I saw people calling him out in the YouTube and Verge article comments. I like Rivian's software setup, it needs to get tighter and less buggy, but I think it's cool that they care about having their own identity. The agent to agent handshake Wass described seems prone to fail.

 

[CharonPDX]

A lie that is easily proven. Very disappointed to see the Rivian guys follow the Musk path into gaslighting.

I don't even mind the "no CarPlay". Sure, I'd rather have the choice, but whatever, it's their decision, and Rivian's system is "good enough."

But to so bald-face lie about the reason is ridiculous. Just admit they are unwilling to give up *ANY* control combined with Connect+ money as the real reasons and be done with it. Stop trying to make up excuses that are complete BS, and provide complete BS "surveys."

Of *COURSE* Rivian buyers don't insist on CarPlay/Android Auto. The people who require it aren't even considering a Rivian.

 

[kanundrum]

Genuinely I don't know what all the gripe is about, maybe my set of requirements are low but infotainment and current set of features have been kind of all i need really and it keeps on getting better. I don't know a scenario where I would need more, surviving adult with 2 kids under 3.5 years old lol

 

[narmstrong79]

Wassym is wrong.

I'll happily pay for connect+ when it reaches near parity to what android auto offers for FREE. All my music apps native, text integration read and reply with all text apps (messenger, messages, chat, Whatsapp ) and an AI assistant (Gemini) otherwise, it's a few gimmicks at best.

Not offering carplay/ Android Auto is about collecting your data and selling you subscriptions. And your missing out on a large portion of buyers who have gotten accustomed to these features.

 

[mkennedy009]

you know, original star trek still had buttons and it was in the future. Talking to the computer is great until the Klingon are attacking, the alarm is blaring and people are dying in pain all around.

 

[Nixapatfan]

Wassym thanks for reaffirming my thoughts on moving on from Rivian. Just keeps going deeper down the path of touch, voice control and Ai none are great. Just give us access to a curated Android play store and most of the complaints go away no need to reinvent every app to pad that revenue stream especially since your team isn't able to keep up with the pace anyways.

 

[Obioban]

Lack of CarPlay is why I didn't buy a Rivian. Lack of CarPlay is why I won't buy any Rivian's the the future.

What a weird, bold face lie (CarPlay does not need to take over every pixel and often runs within a window).

 

[SoCal Rob]

The "take over every single pixel" claim for CarPlay/Android Auto is just patently false - in my Mach-E, CarPlay only uses about 2/3 of *ONE* display. I still have my climate controls at the bottom of the display (and my physical volume wheel.)

Even if he knows nothing about competitors’ products, he knows that "take over every single pixel" claim is not true because of their work with VW. To me, if you have to lie to try to win an argument then you’ve lost the argument.

I wrote before that if Tesla really implements screen projection that GM will follow, leaving Rivian alone in this regard. Then they’ll change course, too. This "take over every single pixel" claim strikes me as the last gasp of a tantrum.

 

[Count Orlok]

still waiting for the snow plow

 

[Rivian_Hugh_III]

Voice is *TERRIBLE* when driving. Sure, in some situations it may be "fine." But if you're in a car full of noisy kids, there isn't a quiet moment for the voice recognition to isolate you properly. If you just want to turn on the defroster, or adjust the volume up and down, having to interrupt the music or audiobook you're listening to to do it is annoying.

The "take over every single pixel" claim for CarPlay/Android Auto is just patently false - in my Mach-E, CarPlay only uses about 2/3 of *ONE* display. I still have my climate controls at the bottom of the display (and my physical volume wheel.)

Um…

Rivian has physical buttons for volume up and down. The defrost button on the screen is always available. He obviously is not going to remove those. Also everything voice currently does can be accessed on screen without voice. So I don’t understand your disagreement.

Those of you not buying because of lack of CarPlay, have you driven in a Rivian? It’s not even close to a dealbreaker.

 

[ronbauer]

Lack of CarPlay is why I didn't buy a Rivian. Lack of CarPlay is why I won't buy any Rivian's the the future.

What a weird, bold face lie (CarPlay does not need to take over every pixel and often runs within a window).

I'm always confused when I see posts like this. If you haven't bought a Rivian because of this and won't buy one in the future, why are you on a Rivian only forum?

 

[Obioban]

I'm always confused when I see posts like this. If you haven't bought a Rivian because of this and won't buy one in the future, why are you on a Rivian only forum?

I otherwise like the truck. If they added CarPlay, I'd get one. So, I monitor the forum for CarPlay threads, in the hope they change their minds.

It does happen:

Sponsored