Some Quick Math on Electrical Grid CO2 Emissions and Vampire Drain

[manitou202]

For those of you interested in CO2 emissions and how the R1T compares to a gas powered vehicle, here are some quick numbers.

Assumptions:
R1T average range per charge: 275 miles
Charging losses: 10%
Vampire drain: 2% (2.5kWh) per day
Miles per year: 10k

Results:
Using the average US electrical grid emissions:
48mpg equivalent with no vampire drain
40mpg equivalent with vampire drain

Worst case scenario (Wyoming electrical grid)
21mpg equivalent with no vampire drain
17mpg equivalent with vampire drain

Best case scenario (Washington state)
180mpg equivalent with no vampire drain
150mpg equivalent with vampire drain

These are very rough numbers, and there are many variables to consider, but I thought this at least gives a sense of the impact.

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[Marchin_MTB]

Thanks. I believe calculators like that from UoCS don’t consider vampire drain and it’s a significant consideration as you show. How did you come up with 10% for charging losses?

 

[manitou202]

Thanks. I believe calculators like that from UoCS don’t consider vampire drain and it’s a significant consideration as you show. How did you come up with 10% for charging losses?

I've seen articles showing typical charging loss numbers from 5%-15%, so I took the middle. Higher losses are typically expected for DC fast charging versus level 2 charging at home is slightly more efficient.

 

[Harleyjeff2010]

I guess i got Lucky, i don"t get any drain. I checked last week just for grins. I was gone four days came back and state of charge was the same as when i left.

 

[NY_Rob]

Worst part is Rivian has the ability to get the vampire loss down to almost zero based on other modern EV's I've owned and still own (i3 and Model 3) but it seems that's just not a priority.

 

[NY_Rob]

I guess i got Lucky, i don"t get any drain. I checked last week just for grins. I was gone four days came back and state of charge was the same as when i left.

Sorry, but that's technically impossible at this stage of firmware development. Your vehicle is just reporting SOC or range incorrectly or it just hasn't updated it's SOC numbers since you last checked in.

 

[Marchin_MTB]

I guess i got Lucky, i don"t get any drain. I checked last week just for grins. I was gone four days came back and state of charge was the same as when i left.

Did you check from the app or in the truck? I think you may be the first person on this forum to report 0% SOC drop over multiple days. If you can repeat that and document it (photos of dash or app), it would be worth it’s own post.

 

[Franksmartin]

Interesting, however this is just post-production, and does not factor in the CO2 emissions from manufacturing and battery mining.

 

[Marchin_MTB]

I've seen articles showing typical charging loss numbers from 5%-15%, so I took the middle. Higher losses are typically expected for DC fast charging versus level 2 charging at home is slightly more efficient.

I recall reading somewhere that L2 tends to be most efficient but I could never find any solid literature on this topic. Seems like conversion losses in the cars charging electronics can vary from car to car. That efficiency should be a published spec for every EV.

 

[manitou202]

I recall reading somewhere that L2 tends to be most efficient but I could never find any solid literature on this topic. Seems like conversion losses in the cars charging electronics can vary from car to car. That efficiency should be a published spec for every EV.

I think L2 isn’t more efficient directly because of the conversion, but it doesn’t require tons of heating/cooling of the cables and battery. So as a complete system L2 is more efficient.

 

[COdogman]

Interesting, however this is just post-production, and does not factor in the CO2 emissions from manufacturing and battery mining.

That's true, but if the CO2 emissions from fossil fuel development were included in the numbers for ICE vehicles they would be much lower as well. So it's fair to assume it's close to a wash when comparing battery manufacturing. The car battery can also be recycled, so that is another complicating factor.

 

[manitou202]

Interesting, however this is just post-production, and does not factor in the CO2 emissions from manufacturing and battery mining.

Understood. That’s a much more complicated question. I was just trying to quantify the vampire drain in a way that is relatable to ICE vehicles.

 

[manitou202]

Worst part is Rivian has the ability to get the vampire loss down to almost zero based on other modern EV's I've owned and still own (i3 and Model 3) but it seems that's just not a priority.

Agreed. Our other EV loses maybe 1% per week. The contrast is significant.

 

[Harleyjeff2010]

Did you check from the app or in the truck? I think you may be the first person on this forum to report 0% SOC drop over multiple days. If you can repeat that and document it (photos of dash or app), it would be worth it’s own post.

I check the truck. i don"t look at the app much.

 

[Harleyjeff2010]

Did you check from the app or in the truck? I think you may be the first person on this forum to report 0% SOC drop over multiple days. If you can repeat that and document it (photos of dash or app), it would be worth it’s own post.

When I park the truck i turn the climate control off. I also turn off the Gear Guard in the garage. Don't know if those have any affect of it.

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