Need more range for skiing

[Sethsak]

Took my large pack R1S quad from NE Portland to Mt Hood Meadows and back yesterday for a family ski adventure. We left with 94% charge for the 190 mile round trip, temps in the high 30’s, dropping to mid 20’s up on the mountain. I have a low profile Inno Wedge rooftop box on the rear two roof mounts on the car. I have the factory 20” AT tires.

We used 60% of the battery just getting to the parking lot, and had to stop and charge at an EA on the way home. Drove in AP or snow mode, no conserve.

I never expected we’d get the full 300 mile range driving to the mountain and back, but I was really surprised the car couldn’t make the <200 mile round trip without needing to stop for a charge.

Has anyone experimented with a fairing mounted on the forward roof attachment point, with a rooftop box on the rear two? Any thoughts or insights here on how to avoid the need for a charge on the way home?

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[ndmiller]

You sort of answered your own concern. Didn't use conserve, Cold weather, and a rooftop box all impact range considerably.

 

[webfootdawg]

Where did you stop to charge and how low were you?

What was your state of charge around Welches or so?

Gear guard one while you were skiing?

 

[runwithscissors]

I feel the same and chalk it up to new battery tech and too small of battery for the truck. It's frustrating to do all the calculations with different apps and show up at charge stations that are unreliable as of now. I will never use my R1S for long distances and will stick to my other ICE vehicles because it will be years before the infrastructure is reliable. I've been burned too many times going to an EA station with 2 out of 4 working and Ioniq's sitting there for free juice. Then I have to wait 40+ minutes because the R1S is slow to charge. Around town and charging at home is great but long trips are just a hassle at this point. Driving below 70 with the heat off and all the other workarounds because of inefficiency is just not a fun experience and it's why the average person should not get an EV until it gets better.

 

[chrismc]

Besides using Conserve Mode, driving slower is the most effective tool to improve range (especially with a roof box). Above 60-70, the energy consumed to overcome wind resistance increases exponentially.

 

[sub]

Any thoughts or insights here on how to avoid the need for a charge on the way home?

Here are changes you can make ordered by the magnitude of impact

• Get rid of the roof box
• drive slower
• switch to 21" wheels (or at least road tires on your 20s)
• install the upcoming software update that allows you to heat your battery before you unplug.
• use conserve mode,

Here is the equation for aerodynamic drag:

speed * speed * vehicle height * vehicle width * drag coefficient (how streamlined the shape is)​

• Speed hits you twice, so slow down.
• The roof box also hits you twice (height and drag coefficient), so get rid of it.

Notice that length is NOT a factor, if you need more storage space a hitch mounted carrier will have much less impact since it doesn't increase your height and only has a small impact on the drag coefficient

 

[wallyman424]

Dont forget the significant elevation gain on the trip TO the mountain. Trip home should've been a lot more efficient. Shouldve just sent it.

 

[Sethsak]

Here are changes you can make ordered by the magnitude of impact

• Get rid of the roof box
• drive slower
• switch to 21" wheels (or at least road tires on your 20s)
• install the upcoming software update that allows you to heat your battery before you unplug.
• use conserve mode,

Here is the equation for aerodynamic drag:

speed * speed * vehicle height * vehicle width * drag coefficient (how streamlined the shape is)​

• Speed hits you twice, so slow down.
• The roof box also hits you twice (height and drag coefficient), so get rid of it.

Notice that length is NOT a factor, if you need more storage space a hitch mounted carrier will have much less impact since it doesn't increase your height and only has a small impact on the drag coefficient

Thanks for the reply. Need the box to fit the gear, but am curious about if I put a fairing in front of it how much that would improve the range. Slowing down will prob be the biggest factor, I was going ~75 on the way there through the gorge and that sucked a ton of range up before we even started climbing the mountain.

 

[Sethsak]

Dont forget the significant elevation gain on the trip TO the mountain. Trip home should've been a lot more efficient. Shouldve just sent it.

I was tempted! “Ski fast, take chances” is the family motto…

we put 20% charge in at the EA in hood river and I got home with exactly 20% left. Prob would have made it, but the family would have never let me hear the end of it if we didn’t.

 

[wallyman424]

Charge it to 100 next time and youre good to go!

 

[jjswan33]

I was tempted! “Ski fast, take chances” is the family motto…

we put 20% charge in at the EA in hood river and I got home with exactly 20% left. Prob would have made it, but the family would have never let me hear the end of it if we didn’t.

Having to drive through Hood River adds a lot of miles. Snowy roads, winds and cold didn’t help today.

Having made the drive like 100 times I can tell you it takes me about 40% to get from Sandy to MHM (or Timberline) and back to Sandy. I know driving through Sandy can suck on the weekends if your timing is bad it can take a long time.

 

[sub]

Do you find conserve really makes much of an impact? Iv

Yes. In addition to removing a bit of drivetrain friction, conserve mode lowers the air suspension. And since vehicle height directly impacts drag (see the formula for drag) that will have a significant impact.

Thanks for the reply. Need the box to fit the gear, but am curious about if I put a fairing in front of it how much that would improve the range. Slowing down will prob be the biggest factor, I was going ~75 on the way there through the gorge and that sucked a ton of range up before we even started climbing the mountain.

A fairing might help mitigate the impact it has on your drag coefficient a bit, but it does nothing about the fact that it made you taller. Moving the box to a hitch mount will have a much bigger impact because it reduces 2 terms in the equation instead of just one. Reducing your height by 10% will increase your range by nearly 10% since fighting drag is the primary thing using up your battery.

 

[Jblaze121]

It boggles the mind the mountains don't put in like 50 L2 Chargers.
Charge $50/day for this premium parking and they pay themselves off ~ 10 days.
I bet most weekends they would be sold out.

 

[webfootdawg]

It boggles the mind the mountains don't put in like 50 L2 Chargers.
Charge $50/day for this premium parking and they pay themselves off ~ 10 days.
I bet most weekends they would be sold out.

 

[NineElectrics]

I’m in the same situation as you: 20” winter tires plus roof mounted cargo carrier. I get 209 miles per 100% charge on average. It’s probably less for highway trips. I’d love to change to a 21” snow tire, but none exist.

Snow mode seemed to prevent my ride height from dropping to low at highway speeds the last time I used it. I don’t know if that’s by design, or a fluke. Unfortunately, snow mode is a necessity due to the dangerous lack of an on-chip anti-lock control loop in regen. This can lock up the wheels on snow and ice, especially when doing downhill. They need to fix that into new hardware, ASAP.

I would try moving the carrier forward. You want to give the air time to settle down in the back without creating turbulence and therefore drag. The most aerodynamic shape is the teardrop. If you can stomach the additional cost, you could try an even flatter box, like the Thule Motion XT Alpine.

What irks me is that I store a ton of potential energy driving up the mountain, but I can’t recover all of it going back down, as the car will be cold after a long day sitting outside, and regen is at a mere fraction of its capacity. By the time regen is back to full capacity, I’m already down most of the mountain my potential energy has been wasted.

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