Tesla nefarious behavior?

[ukyank]

For a NASA scientist this guy was shady as hell in his methods if you wish to be completely objective.

He may have been employed by nasa at some point but if you just realize he’s just another online click generator no different than any other ‘influencer’ & should be viewed no differently its more palatable. It’s not like he has any special expertise in this area that should qualify him more than you at whatever clickbait du jour he’s hawking, but unfortunately some people are drawn into the meaningless nasa moniker.

Maybe if he was doing a test on planetary rovers it might be more relevant, but even then, not so much as he’s over a decade removed from that knowledge

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[COdogman]

Exactly. Someone claiming to be an actual rocket surgeon and also a tech engineer then goes and does the test with a massive list of poor choices? So is he stupid and should be ignored, or is he a liar and should be ignored?



No, I did not say either. I did not say anything about Tesla in the posts you keep quoting. YOU made up the idea in your own head that because I didn't say Tesla ADAS was safer than a human, therefore, I must think they are not. I simply didn't talk about it. Reading comprehension here is severely damaged by rabid anti-Tesla bias.

You are the one who threw a hissy fit because you felt you weren't quoted accurately. So let's be really clear about this so you cannot whine about it later: You do agree that Tesla's autonomous driving systems are less safe than a human driver?

Regarding the OTHER manufacturers, you also tried to weasel out of providing any proof of your claim that "pretty well all of them" (other than Tesla according to you) are safer than a human driver. You specifically submitted Waymo as an example. Waymo only operates in 4 cities in the entire country.. No bad weather. No highways So let's see your proof.

Pretty well all of them, but I haven't carefully researched them all. Glad to see you get past the assumptions however. Even Rivian's lame ADAS is probably safer than humans only. Waymo obviously is, as are many others. But you knew that.

 

[JM.]

You are the one who threw a hissy fit

Nope.

You do agree that Tesla's autonomous driving systems are less safe than a human driver?

Also no.

 

[pamalabama]

“Paul tested the right Tesla systems, which is important, but his test also has some flaws. With a much lower budget, his wall isn’t nearly as good as Rober’s. It is noticeably lighter than the real road, sky and terrain, and this changes with the light between his two tests. The wall has several defects where gaps between the photos are obvious. Unfortunately, one thing that computer vision systems, even machine-learning ones, focus on is “edges,” and Paul’s wall is full of clear edges, making it much more likely that CV will detect it.”

rober's wall was worse in terms of perspective and was darker than what was seen outside. Rober's wall had more visible edges too.

The point is that the tesla was easily confused regardless of lighting difference because lighting difference can be attributed to shadows or other external factors

In the test on HW3 he was running a version of FSD from 6 months ago and it is considered one of the worst HW3 FSD releases

 

[pamalabama]

I would say the big difference between Waymo and Cybercab is one exists and functions and the other one does not. Just like FSD, robots, etc. etc. Tesla fans, you really need to stop acting as though the thing Musk promises is actually a thing.

There is no such thing as FSD. There is a supervised level 2 driving aid that still requires human intervention to be safe. Tesla will never get approval (ever - EXCEPT if Trump just makes it happen as a favor to his buddy) to have a self driving taxi that lacks LIDAR. It is a fantasy. I am very sorry that the promise of Tesla is crumbling. Their cars are starting to recede In the market. The Cybertruck is a disaster and a sales failure. The S and X don’t sell at all. The 3 and Y are the only two viable options and Musk is making sure that ceases to be the case. The robots are just the next FSD - coming next year!

I am not sure why the same folks come into this forum and desparately cling to Tesla’s obvious over-promising as if it is reality and argue endlessly. None of what Musk has claimed has proven true - not FSD, not the roadster, not the solar roof, not the Semi, not the revolutionary batteries, not the Cybertruck, not the robots, and this will be the case with the Cybercab.

Existing and functioning is pointless if you are not making money.

Nobody in the robotaxi space has a real technology that works. All you are doing is driving around and losing money while being the first to do so. We are many years from real, sustainable robotaxis.

The other issue is that unsupervised driving is more likely to be possible when performing drives where the car is driving from point to point and not operating as a taxi. Because where the car would get into the most trouble is freely driving around.

 

[COdogman]

Nope.



Also no.

Why is it so hard for you to give a straight answer on this?

In response to my statement that you said Tesla's autonomous driving systems were safer than a human driver, you had a meltdown and repeatedly made the point that you NEVER said that about Tesla.

So I attempt to correct the record and clarify which systems you were referring to that are NOT Tesla, and you refuse to provide any evidence that any of those are safer than a human either?‍

And even more strangely you refuse to confirm that Tesla systems are less safe than a human even though you nearly blew a gasket making the point that you definitely did not include Tesla in the group that IS safer (another claim you won't support).

Last try:

1. Yes or No: Tesla autonomous driving systems are less safe than a human driver.
2. What proof do you have that Waymo or "pretty well all other" systems are safer than a human driver?

 

[JM.]

Why is it so hard for you to give a straight answer on this?

Dude, I've typed out short and long answers both, to see if any would land. I made no claims on this in regard to Tesla. You keep trying to ask me if I did, and I said no. That's it. No.

you had a meltdown

Nope.

 

[COdogman]

Dude, I've typed out short and long answers both, to see if any would land. I made no claims on this in regard to Tesla. You keep trying to ask me if I did, and I said no. That's it. No.




Nope.

Thanks for clearing up #1. I appreciate your willingness to admit that Tesla's systems are less safe than a human driver.

But once again you are struggling to stay focused. It was only 2 questions so I don't know how you missed the other one, but it was super simple too. Just asking for any evidence to support your claim that Waymo and "pretty well all" autonomous driving systems (other than Tesla) are safer than a human driver.

Maybe the color will help.

You can do this... I have faith in you

 

[JM.]

appreciate your willingness to admit that Tesla's systems are less safe than a human driver.

I certainly have not.

 

[COdogman]

I certainly have not.

Ok, so to summarize, you won't say if Tesla's systems are safer or not safer than a human and you cannot provide any proof to support your claim that "pretty well all" other systems, including Waymo ARE safer than a human driver...

It's been real fun, but I have wasted enough time attempting to get you to answer extremely simple questions.

You have a great day

 

[JM.]

Ok, so to summarize, you won't say if Tesla's systems are safer or not safer than a human and you cannot provide any proof to support your claim that "pretty well all" other systems, including Waymo ARE safer than a human driver...

It's been real fun, but I have wasted enough time attempting to get you to answer extremely simple questions.

You have a great day

Good call. Finally.

 

[JM.]

So now everyone including the stock market knows that Rober lied. Except maybe some people here.

 

[pamalabama]

Tested again with a better looking sign during the day and HW4 still detects it

 

[captainjp]

Tested again with a better looking sign during the day and HW4 still detects it

HW3 is still quite prevalent. Is Tesla retrofitting these vehicles with HW4 at no cost?

 

[pamalabama]

HW3 is still quite prevalent. Is Tesla retrofitting these vehicles with HW4 at no cost?

HW3 is prevalent but tesla did not sell full autonomy except in 2018. So the number of HW3 which paid for a full autonomy package is very low. And tesla offered many of these 2018 owners FSD transfer, so they have switched to HW4

The number of people in need of a retrofit is so low that tesla could theoretically give them a brand new car

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