V4 Tesla Supercharger looks more user friendly + magic dock connector and display (spotted photos)

[UnsungZero_OldTimeAdMan]

Given the sparseness and unreliability of the CCS fast charging network, the wait times at heavily used locations, and the fact that the various third-party charge point providers have not worked together effectively to create a cohesive network in terms of location or spacing, the Supercharger Network becomes quite a competitive moat. People have been hoping the CCS network improves in reliability, charging speeds and density to avoid having to cue up to charge for a long time now but the changes don't seem to be coming. This impacts which EV people will buy, and how much they are willing to pay for it.

Given the situation, it was very generous of Tesla to let their competitors join the Supercharger Network at zero cost, because eliminating this moat reduces the premium Tesla can charge for their EV's over their competitors. It's like handing a larger share of the EV market to their direct competitors. Charging revenues are but a tiny fraction of Tesla's total revenues, it's almost insignificant. And Tesla is spending considerable money with the necessary longer charge cords and Magic Docks to accommodate a minority of EV's on the road. Tesla is still growing EV sales in N. America faster than all the rest combined! This means non-Tesla will remain in the minority for as far as they eye can see.

There is little question that Tesla would have been more profitable, over any reasonable timeframe, had they maintained the walled garden approach to their crown jewel so they could sell more EV's, and at higher prices, and reduced the cost of their Supercharger buildout. But they did not want to be the only real player in the EV game, their very mission statement is to accelerate the adoption of EV's, not just Tesla. I've seen the anti-Tesla crowd poo-poo Tesla's mission statement but, with this generous move, Tesla has really put their money where their mouth is.

Those who say Tesla did this out of profit motive have serious misunderstandings about the economics of auto manufacturing and profits from running and maintaining fast charging networks. Tesla did this to give a sales boost to their competitors and to put EVs in a better light. The CCS networks are so atrociously bad that they are giving EVs a black eye.

Alright fanboi. We'll just have to agree to disagree. They did some smart and clever things. But this is laying it on a bit thick.

Sponsored

 

[WSea]

Alright fanboi. We'll just have to agree to disagree. They did some smart and clever things. But this is laying it on a bit thick.

This guy never stops

 

[Autolycus]

LOL.. Tesla is generous and we should get on our knees in appreciation of Elon for doing us all a giant favor? Nope. They're a business that's invested tens of millions of dollars on infrastructure for a business model that won't be profitable if they just maintain the status quo. They need more customers for their current supercharger plans to be profitable.

I'm also still skeptical that they're not going to pull some anti-competitive BS at some point, but we'll see. All else being equal, I will support other charging networks because I like competition, and Tesla is clearly the current dominant player.

 

[HyperionMark]

In that very first shot on the first post, it shows the unit skewed to the right. That is the perfect location because the actual origination point of the cable is then in the exact center of the stall. This makes it not confusing to know which stall has which cable and also should be long enough to reach the vast majority of EVs, with the only question mark being the Lightning.

 

[Autolycus]

In that very first shot on the first post, it shows the unit skewed to the right. That is the perfect location because the actual origination point of the cable is then in the exact center of the stall. This makes it not confusing to know which stall has which cable and also should be long enough to reach the vast majority of EVs, with the only question mark being the Lightning.

I think the sign post is dead center, so the cable will still be offset to the right some, but not as far as the charging pedestal makes it look. The cables definitely need to still be longer than the v3 cables. I also still think that the future design of all charging stations needs to be pull-through covered spots like we have with gas stations. Almost all gas stations have settled on that pump layout for a reason.

 

[HyperionMark]

I think the sign post is dead center, so the cable will still be offset to the right some, but not as far as the charging pedestal makes it look. The cables definitely need to still be longer than the v3 cables. I also still think that the future design of all charging stations needs to be pull-through covered spots like we have with gas stations. Almost all gas stations have settled on that pump layout for a reason.

Good points. On second look they do seem still a bit off center. I would guess the V4 cables (only based on pictures I've seen) are probably anywhere from 1-2 feet longer than the V3.
And you make some good points about the current gas station pump layouts. I'm sure part of that also has to do with how the actual pumps can access the in ground tanks. But yes, overall gas stations are obviously way easier to get in and out of. The current setups of EV stations also have something to do with the nature of them being the "alternative" or "different". So probably part of the reason they get put at the end or side of a parking lot. (and of course ease of running electricity to them)

 

[cabbey]

Where is this site located? Wilsonville, Oregon?

Yes, the green wrapped pedestals are here in Wilsonville, OR. The close up of the magic doc and the screen are from Sparks, NV (or maybe Bakersfiled, CA). I can confirm seeing what looked to be the same side with the same shiny screen below the handle and the same lined texture above/below it here in Wilsonville before they covered them up. Quite a bit more detail over at the TMC forum on it: https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/thr...der-construction-aug-2023-8-v4-stalls.309133/ (interesting v4 details start mid to late page 2)

On second look they do seem still a bit off center.

Please note that the parking lines on the ground in these shots are from the prior striping before the construction was started. They're not even parallel with what the permitted parking lines for this super charger show as being the final layout. (see construction diagrams on the first post in the above TMC thread. That shows 90 degree parking with the side of the pedestal where the cable originates being at about the 60% mark of the width on stalls 1A-2C. If you think about the parking spot from a back in parking perspective (aka the Norminal Tesla Super Charger User Perspective) then the charger cord starts about 10% off center on the passenger side, and several feet in the air, I'd say probably 6' up. For a Tesla backed in the cord will drape across the space in front of the pedestal then around the corner to the charge port. For a Rivian nosed into the spot, it will just swoop directly to the charge port on the corner. I'd guess it's going to be CLOSER to the Rivian charge ports than the Tesla one. It is also going to be a more direct path into the Rivian... these cords will pull sideways a bit on a Tesla. (Not uncommon on SCs, lots of v3 are placed in a way that does the same thing.) I think they're also going to have SLIGHTLY more "reach" on that side, so F150 Lightnings will be much better able to access these than they can the current V3 magic docs.

The 8th stall, 2D, is shown as a van accessible handicap spot which is 2' wider and the pedestal is slid farther to the corner so it's accessible from the access aisle... I don't think a Rivian will be able to use this location unless they park on the access aisle.

I would guess the V4 cables (only based on pictures I've seen) are probably anywhere from 1-2 feet longer than the V3.

Those pedestals are deceptively tall, none of our photos really convey just how tall they feel in person, even when the closest I can get is a handfull of feet with a chain link fence in the way. The European v4 super chargers are said to be "a good bit over 1m longer" than v3 were... so 3-4 feet more.

 

[HyperionMark]

Yes, the green wrapped pedestals are here in Wilsonville, OR. The close up of the magic doc and the screen are from Sparks, NV (or maybe Bakersfiled, CA). I can confirm seeing what looked to be the same side with the same shiny screen below the handle and the same lined texture above/below it here in Wilsonville before they covered them up. Quite a bit more detail over at the TMC forum on it: https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/thr...der-construction-aug-2023-8-v4-stalls.309133/ (interesting v4 details start mid to late page 2)



Please note that the parking lines on the ground in these shots are from the prior striping before the construction was started. They're not even parallel with what the permitted parking lines for this super charger show as being the final layout. (see construction diagrams on the first post in the above TMC thread. That shows 90 degree parking with the side of the pedestal where the cable originates being at about the 60% mark of the width on stalls 1A-2C. If you think about the parking spot from a back in parking perspective (aka the Norminal Tesla Super Charger User Perspective) then the charger cord starts about 10% off center on the passenger side, and several feet in the air, I'd say probably 6' up. For a Tesla backed in the cord will drape across the space in front of the pedestal then around the corner to the charge port. For a Rivian nosed into the spot, it will just swoop directly to the charge port on the corner. I'd guess it's going to be CLOSER to the Rivian charge ports than the Tesla one. It is also going to be a more direct path into the Rivian... these cords will pull sideways a bit on a Tesla. (Not uncommon on SCs, lots of v3 are placed in a way that does the same thing.) I think they're also going to have SLIGHTLY more "reach" on that side, so F150 Lightnings will be much better able to access these than they can the current V3 magic docs.

The 8th stall, 2D, is shown as a van accessible handicap spot which is 2' wider and the pedestal is slid farther to the corner so it's accessible from the access aisle... I don't think a Rivian will be able to use this location unless they park on the access aisle.



Those pedestals are deceptively tall, none of our photos really convey just how tall they feel in person, even when the closest I can get is a handfull of feet with a chain link fence in the way. The European v4 super chargers are said to be "a good bit over 1m longer" than v3 were... so 3-4 feet more.

Thanks for the updates and info! So excited for these!

 

[defcon888]

Is it my imagination or does the Tesla Charger look like the Monopoly Man?

 

[azbill]

Good points. On second look they do seem still a bit off center. I would guess the V4 cables (only based on pictures I've seen) are probably anywhere from 1-2 feet longer than the V3.
And you make some good points about the current gas station pump layouts. I'm sure part of that also has to do with how the actual pumps can access the in ground tanks. But yes, overall gas stations are obviously way easier to get in and out of. The current setups of EV stations also have something to do with the nature of them being the "alternative" or "different". So probably part of the reason they get put at the end or side of a parking lot. (and of course ease of running electricity to them)

The cables are 3 feet longer.

 

[RivianRunner]

Is it my imagination or does the Tesla Charger look like the Monopoly Man?

Is it my imagination, or does the CCS1 charger look like an abomination?

 

[SolartoEV]

Is it my imagination, or does the CCS1 charger look like an abomination?

Looks like what Tesla uses in Europe. Can't be that bad huh

 

[RivianRunner]

Looks like what Tesla uses in Europe. Can't be that bad huh

CCS2 is mandated by the government in Europe, it would be illegal for Tesla to use NACS in Europe.

 

[corywright]

Where are you seeing that? I have not found a map I can filter on supercharger version.

supercharge.info doesn't have a filter for Supercharger version, but you can use other filters to achieve similar results. There is a filter for power level:

And another filter to only display Superchargers that are open to non-Teslas:

Applying "> 250 kW" with "Teslas + Other EVs" will display V3/V4 Supercharger locations that are open to Rivians with CCS:

Currently there are no known Supercharger locations advertising higher than 250 kW, but once higher power levels are available then supercharge.info will add a "> 350 kW" filter option.

 

[SolartoEV]

CCS2 is mandated by the government in Europe, it would be illegal for Tesla to use NACS in Europe.

So why can't Tesla use that in America?

Sponsored