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Why RIVIAN is far worse than Tesla... and I hate Tesla!

Has Rivian met your exceptions in regards to communication?


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Classics2Exotics

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As someone that has been driving EVs for a decade, I can truly tell you Tesla has changed from the best to worse. Tesla in 2013 WAS an amazing car company ran by people who cared about their customers and really knew what customer service should be. Tesla's customer retention was something only comparable to Lexus in the 90s. Fast forward to 2018 & the Model 3. Sales & Service have been a nightmare since. Why? Lack of Communication & Customer Care/Attention. Yes, I am a #formerTeslaFanBoy.

Which brings me sadly to Rivian.

I am a July 2019 reservation holder for an R1S since I could make a choice. I, like most of you, have received little to no clear & HONEST communication from anyone at Rivian. I have emailed them several times to find they have no information but that I should receive a communication from a guide in a couple of weeks. At that time, my R1S was due in June/July 2022. Then it moved to Sept/Dec and now I'm April-June 2023???? For a 7/2019 Reservation holder?!? No guide contact still as well.

Which brings me to this: SAME EXACT SPEC that I have ordered. EXACT! To a 2020 Reservation holder, who didn't even want it of course.
LINK TO AUCTION:
https://carsandbids.com/auctions/3O7DBGYz/2022-rivian-r1s-launch-edition

This is one of many examples that Rivian is not a customer first company when it comes to prioritizing the selling of its vehicles when reservation placers that are 6 months after mine are receiving vehicles. How many more people ahead of me also got skipped so this guy could flip his?

Now I'm sure you are saying, well, it must be your location to a service center? I live in the Denver metro, so no.

When I asked Rivian what's the reason for the change from June/July 22 to April/June 23 and how customers with reservations that were in 2020 get vehicles ahead of ones made in 2019, I get no straight answers. Instead, I get responses like "that we’re still experiencing supply chain constraints, not just with the vehicle but also with trucking and the rail system." Which really doesn't answer my question and honestly comes across as if they don't have a clue and/or do not care. I have done the R1T & R1S test drives. The representative from Rivian said that she would reach out to Rivian and get some answers. I never heard anything back from anyone... Right out of Tesla's playbook. At least when Tesla gives me a delivery range, they make it happen, even back 10 years ago.

RIVIAN... buddy, pal, friend, please get your stuff together. You are failing us (and all that stock I bought is too) #RivianSadBoy
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kizamybute'

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They have somewhere around 100,000 open orders. Are a new company starting up and learning as they go. Tesla, despite having experience with the Model S, was quite slow at ramping up Model 3 production because it's not easy. Add that in to the fact that we've had a parts shortage over the past couple of years and it's amazing they've produced as many as they have. Yes, the wait absolutely sucks. But, they've delivered what, 18,000 trucks so far? That means 82,000 are right there with you waiting too. Again, it sucks. Nobody expected COVID to change the world, but it did. Now the world is figuring out how to be normal again. Shortages are declining, demand is declining and companies are catching up. Even Tesla, which I agree, was wonderful for the first couple of years and horrible for the the past 5+ years, had a 1 year wait list for a while there. They're now caught up and have a lot of inventory cars. Rivian is working through starting a company from the ground up. Being one of the first all brand new car manufacturers to actually make it to production. Tesla was the last. Best I can tell, Rivian is next on the list with most cars produced by a brand new US company. The wait sucks, but do have to be patient. In a couple of years, manufacturers will be offering incentives again to sell their cars. Everything that happened over the past 2 1/2 years is now correcting itself.
 

bd5400

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This is nothing new. Ask early R1T reservation holders who were having the same thoughts earlier this year. Rivian has not been strictly going by reservation date when fulfilling orders and while proximity to service center matters, so does general location.

I recall many complaints from people who saw their exact configuration in the hands of someone who ordered after them. One frequent pattern that emerged was that Rivian was sending vehicles to local service centers before buyers had committed to the purchase. If a buyer backed out, instead of sending the vehicle elsewhere in the country for the “next” person on the list, it was offered to a nearby order holder with a matching configuration (and still not always in order of reservation date).

It’s entirely possible that R1S was originally meant for someone with an earlier order date than you, but that buyer didn’t follow through and Rivian found someone with an order who bought it without having to re-ship it elsewhere. In such a case, a random Rivian customer service person wouldn’t have any information to give you because I highly doubt they have access to VIN-specific information like that.
 

Donald Stanfield

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This is nothing new. Ask early R1T reservation holders who were having the same thoughts earlier this year. Rivian has not been strictly going by reservation date when fulfilling orders and while proximity to service center matters, so does general location.

I recall many complaints from people who saw their exact configuration in the hands of someone who ordered after them. One frequent pattern that emerged was that Rivian was sending vehicles to local service centers before buyers had committed to the purchase. If a buyer backed out, instead of sending the vehicle elsewhere in the country for the “next” person on the list, it was offered to a nearby order holder with a matching configuration (and still not always in order of reservation date).

It’s entirely possible that R1S was originally meant for someone with an earlier order date than you, but that buyer didn’t follow through and Rivian found someone with an order who bought it without having to re-ship it elsewhere. In such a case, a random Rivian customer service person wouldn’t have any information to give you because I highly doubt they have access to VIN-specific information like that.
This is most likely what happened. Logistically it doesn’t make sense to spend more money to ship the vehicle somewhere else when you could just sell it to someone locally. Fairness is subjective. Is it fair to Rivian to have to ship the car twice and spend more money and add another layer of complexity to their delivery just so they don’t skip someone in line?

Look, I completely understand how frustrating it is to see something like this as a preorder holder but I also know that the only way the warranty on my truck will be worth a shit is if Rivian stays in business. They only do that by making financially smart decisions. Rivian wants to get you your R1, they really do. They just have to do it in the most cost effective way possible.
 

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COdogman

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I won’t defend Rivian’s communications because they certainly have made a shocking amount of unforced errors. Especially when it comes to the earliest order holders.

With that said, There are many many happy Rivian owners right now who have no complaints about the process from start to finish. I have no explanation for why some had such a great experience and others seem forgotten, but I really feel for those who can’t seem to get any answers.

Tesla wasn’t perfect in the beginning either. They had the struggle of being the first real EV company in the US, while Rivian had the unfortunate timing of starting production during a global pandemic and subsequent supply shortages. There’s no excuse for the lack of communications with their customers, but if you ask the people who have ordered a Lightning or Hummer they aren’t getting many updates along the way either. Honestly I think these companies are just making what they can make, when they can make it, and not necessarily in any order.

I hope you get that guide soon and your S soon after that.
 

tyfly867

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TL;DR

Early reservation, someone got his spec before him. Indignation over the line cutting.

Company not sufficiently providing rationale he feels he’s entitled to, rants on forum. Gives post dramatic title to grab clicks.
 

Donald Stanfield

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This is most likely what happened. Logistically it doesn’t make sense to spend more money to ship the vehicle somewhere else when you could just sell it to someone locally. Fairness is subjective. Is it fair to Rivian to have to ship the car twice and spend more money and add another layer of complexity to their delivery just so they don’t skip someone in line?

Look, I completely understand how frustrating it is to see something like this as a preorder holder but I also know that the only way the warranty on my truck will be worth a shit is if Rivian stays in business. They only do that by making financially smart decisions. Rivian wants to get you your R1, they really do. They just have to do it in the most cost effective way possible.
Also I want to touch on communications and how that all works. For those of you who have never been responsible for the successful functioning of a team let me tell you that keeping everyone on the same page is next to impossible.

I run a MUCH smaller team than Rivian, have weekly meetings, an online communication platform that is separated into different groups of employees but houses the whole company, have tons of user guides and training manuals and have automated as much as possible and we still get wires crossed and have mix ups fairly often.

When you have a high quality team where everyone wants to help you’re going to get some miscommunications and some not so great info depending on who you talk to. There is no instruction manual for running a company and every single one is unique. All the stuff that’s taken for granted with other huge companies who have had years to gauge demand, set policy and train employees needs to be invented and implemented for Rivian. That’s what is meant by a ramp up, it’s not just making the vehicles it’s all the internal operations that go along with it.

When I see people getting angry over something they were told I have to take that with a grain of salt because the truth is that person is most likely going to be angry no matter what they are told. They want their truck, or their pair of socks or their cup of coffee and that’s what matters in their view.

Let’s put this in perspective for someone. If you were at Starbucks and the person in front of you decided they didn’t want their coffee and didn’t pick it up in the window. Let’s also suppose that coffee was the exact same one you ordered. You would be pissed off if they gave it to the guy behind you instead of you and then made you wait longer while they worked on yours.

You wouldn’t care if that same coffee was given to someone who ordered chronologically after you if it was at a different store right? You wouldn’t expect them to even run it down the street to your store right?

I’m aware it’s not a perfect comparison but it’s close enough to prove the point. Not to mention let’s think about how these trucks are delivered from a staffing perspective. The list is made, then batched in the factory. Then the vehicles are made and shipped to where they go. This is most likely done chronologically at the central hub.

Once the trucks are sent to the distribution centers they are the problem of a whole different department. The local service centers don’t have the master list of who is next in line with one configuration only the list for who will be assigned next at their center. There would be no need for them to know about the whole US.

Now let’s suppose that for whatever reason the person who’s turn it is cannot accept their vehicle, financing falls through, they change their mind, they die etc. How does that truck get to the next person in line overall? It can’t be shipped back to the central hub, they are designed for a one way workflow. From the factory to the distribution to the local center. The people that handle that are already setting up distribution for the next batch currently on the line.

You wouldn’t want that group of people handling where the truck goes next because that means they aren’t handling the ones coming off the line now. That would cause a traffic jam as trucks sit on the lot longer and it would wind up delaying tens or hundreds of people just so someone doesn’t get skipped in line. Does Rivian hire a whole extra team to handle these wayward cars? Well that’s a lot of expense for very little benefit to the company. So they can’t have the normal workflow people handle it, and they can’t hire another set of staff or it would waste a ton of money so what makes the most sense?

That’s to give the vehicle to the next person with that configuration at the delivery center WHERE THE VEHICLE IS. If you made it through this far congrats, hopefully you have a better understanding of how seemingly small workflow problems are actually incredibly complex. I know I sound like a Rivian fan boy with my defense of their customer service staff but in actuality from the perspective of someone who builds teams of people and gets them functional I’m EXTREMELY impressed with how well Rivian works.
 

mini2nut

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The problem with Tesla right now is Elon Musk. Many BEV shoppers refuse to purchase a Tesla because of the CEO.
 

Donald Stanfield

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The problem with Tesla right now is Elon Musk. Many BEV shoppers refuse to purchase a Tesla because of the CEO.
That’s no where near the problem it’s made to be. The truth is the percentage of the population that is butthurt over Elon for whatever reason is a loud but extremely small minority. It didn’t dip the stock, that was purely financial. Twitter is a shit hole business wise and he overpaid.

Steve Jobs was a much bigger asshole than Musk could ever hope to be, as is Bezos. No one cares at the end of the day because the products were good. Tesla is still selling every single vehicle they make in short order.
 

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johstacy

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That’s no where near the problem it’s made to be. The truth is the percentage of the population that is butthurt over Elon for whatever reason is a loud but extremely small minority. It didn’t dip the stock, that was purely financial. Twitter is a shit hole business wise and he overpaid.

Steve Jobs was a much bigger asshole than Musk could ever hope to be, as is Bezos. No one cares at the end of the day because the products were good. Tesla is still selling every single vehicle they make in short order.
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