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RJ says communication needs to be better... But what's the plan?

Diddy123

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I disagree with the majority of what you posted, but I also know how successful internet debates usually are at convincing the other that they're wrong. So I'm just going to drop it. Would be fun to have the discussion live at some Rivian meetup in the future!
It sounds like the $1000 dollars is the crux of the issue and not understanding how a technology company functions launching complex products.
Are you calling me both poor and stupid in the same sentence?

I award you 10 internet points ?.
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dleewla

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You're conflating two different concerns into a single retort. The OP was very specific about asking what the plan is following RJ's comments regarding better communication, and presented some ideas for what that could look like.


None of these examples are relevant to the discussion. In order:
-Apple doesn't take $1000 deposits on reservations years in advance of production. But they do provide very detailed specs on their products, and allow hands-on reviews before allowing consumers to preorder.
-I've never pre-ordered pharmaceuticals for delivery, nor paid $80,000 for a pill
-No idea how to respond to the sports team analogy, it just doesn't make any sense to me


I'll give the benefit of the doubt to almost everyone on this forum. The vast majority of us know exactly what we're involved in. That doesn't mean we can't discuss ways for Rivian to improve communication.
Good points OP and nice retort diddy123. Were not demanding faster deliveries (if you are, you need to grow up), everyone knows it must be challenging starting a new company, let alone a car company and having the pandemic impact things up and down the supply chain, hiring, etc.

That being said, I really don't think it unreasonable to ask for more communication and information. I know more about the F-150 Lightning since its intro a couple of months ago than I do about the R1s after years. I think there's a balance between over-promising / under-delivering and under-promising / over-delivering and the latter seems to be their communication and sharing approach. Under-promising seems to mean sharing very carefully.

Its unfortunate because customers who have been waiting a long time would appreciate more details and I think Rivian is being too cautious. Its eating away at the goodwill its built up grass roots. Its also potentially going to backfire. I think the expectations grow more with less communication. Remember, under-promise and over-deliver. Folks now have expectations that need to be exceeded and the less we hear, the more we expect.

Its also probably a reflection of the immaturity of the company, starting with the CEO on down to the comms and PR teams. Comms/pr is as much art as it is science and seems like they need to mature a bit in both.
 
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hola29

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Delivering a best in class vehicle, building a great company, creating a solid financial model, and environmental/ecologically sustainable products are what Rivian should be laser focused on.

Those are important. Those will be important in 6 months delivering launch vehicles, and perhaps moreso in 10 years delivering v7.0 globally.

There seems to be a somewhat myopic view on this forum vs. what really matters. If you did not expect delays, some missteps, and slightly shifting sands ordering a pre-production vehicle from an absolute start-up in a brand new vehicle class then I don't know what to say.

If $1000 getting in line for launch editions is stressful then perhaps a bad decision putting in your credit card info.

Good points OP and nice retort diddy123. Were not demanding faster deliveries (if you are, you need to grow up), everyone knows it must be challenging starting a new company, let alone a car company and having the pandemic impact things up and down the supply chain, hiring, etc.

That being said, I really don't think it unreasonable to ask for more communication and information. I know more about the F-150 Lightning since its intro a couple of months ago than I do about the R1s after years. I think there's a balance between over-promising / under-delivering and under-promising / over-delivering and the latter seems to be their communication and sharing approach. Under-promising seems to mean sharing very carefully.

Its unfortunate because customers who have been waiting a long time would appreciate more details and I think Rivian is being too cautious. Its eating away at the goodwill its built up grass roots. Its also potentially going to backfire. I think the expectations grow more with less communication. Remember, under-promise and over-deliver. Folks now have expectations that need to be exceeded and the less we hear, the more we expect.

Its also probably a reflection of the immaturity of the company, starting with the CEO on down to the comms and PR teams. Comms/pr is as much art as it is science and seems like they need to mature a bit in both.
 

dleewla

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Delivering a best in class vehicle, building a great company, creating a solid financial model, and environmental/ecologically sustainable products are what Rivian should be laser focused on.

Those are important.

There seems to be a somewhat myopic view on this forum vs. what really matters. If you did not expect delays, some missteps, and slightly shifting sands ordering a pre-production vehicle from an absolute start-up in a brand new vehicle class then I don't know what to say.

If $1000 getting in line for launch editions is stressful then perhaps a bad decision putting in your credit card info.
Did you even read what I wrote? I don't disagree with points you made but I'm not talking about delays. Who said its stressful? I'm talking about communication and keeping customers informed not so much about deliveries and production (though that would be great too) but about the actual vehicle itself. There's still a lot we don't know.
 
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hola29

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They have potential customers at this point, and folks that have put a deposit in order to have the option to be customers in the launch edition program.

It appears they are having some production issues - who knows: software, paint, robotics, chips, etc.

I don't follow automotive too closely, but maybe 5-6 launches, and none, not one, gave detailed specs prior to the production reveal. I have followed many many other production launches in on prem software, hardware, and SaaS - and for consumers detailed specs almost always follow after production launch. Enterprise is a little different, and in that vein Amazon may have a lot more insight than consumer folks with a deposit to have a launch edition purchase option.

I also don't recall the issues/frustration potential customers having...again, why I keep harkening back to the $1000 deposit for a place in line as the delta in customer emotional response.

Did you even read what I wrote? I don't disagree with points you made but I'm not talking about delays. Who said its stressful? I'm talking about communication and keeping customers informed.
 
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Gshenderson

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It’s funny to me that the CEO comes out with a statement admitting they are not communicating well, and yet people on here are still defending their communication. ?‍♂
 

hola29

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The CEO probably, and rightly so, could outline improvements in supply chain sourcing, manufacturing process, vendor selection, investor negotiations, on & on...as he should.

This is a startup. Everything needs to be iterated. Most things can and hopefully will be improved.

Again, this is expected. This is 100% normal. If you find Rivian to be some sort of exception then the early stage pre-production start-up you have been the customer of, vendor to, or employee/founding member of is a true unicorn.

My sense is most people here that are upset did not set their expectations properly or have zero experience in this type of start-up scenario.

All that aside, Rivian will likely ship to customers the first true production line truck and SUV in the world. That's not so bad. So they are doing something right.

But the REAL question will be vehicle quality, performance, after sale support, features roadmap, software updates, RAN network, etc. Way important more than some missteps communicating w/ antsy folks who paid a $1000 deposit for the **OPTION** to become a customer of the launch edition rollout...

It’s funny to me that the CEO comes out with a statement admitting they are not communicating well, and yet people on here are still defending their communication. ?‍♂
 
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Kenshaka

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They have the staff, and they appear to be qualified & competent...I'm really starting to believe that they are "handcuffed" for some reason.
I’m at the point where I realize that pre-order holders are not much of a concern of Rivian. Thinking that we are merely a data collection pool and they will get us when they get to us. Their actions haven’t shown me otherwise. Having said that, I still think the R1T is the greatest vehicle dreamt up to date and I believe Rivian will be a great company in the future
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