Rivian's van strategy is flawed says Ford CEO Jim Farley

[Sgt Beavis]

Ford has been doing delivery vans for almost a century. Farley isn't totally off base. The thing here is that Amazon didn't just commit to buying vans but became a major investor. Rivian has recently seen that the 10000 van committment has some downsides so they're looking to renegotiate the deal with Amazon. I haven't heard if there were any changes there.

The size of the vans could be an issue (they're huge) but I think the R2 Platform offers opportunities for smaller sized vans.

Anyways, opinions are like (you know what) everyone has one. That said, Farley does have a cousin that lived in a van down by the river. So maybe he knows a thing or two.

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[Dark-Fx]

The size of the vans could be an issue

I assume you're comparing to the size that Ford has for sale?
https://www.ford.com/commercial-trucks/e-transit/

 

[Marchin_MTB]

Ford has been doing delivery vans for almost a century. Farley isn't totally off base. The thing here is that Amazon didn't just commit to buying vans but became a major investor. Rivian has recently seen that the 10000 van committment has some downsides so they're looking to renegotiate the deal with Amazon. I haven't heard if there were any changes there.

The size of the vans could be an issue (they're huge) but I think the R2 Platform offers opportunities for smaller sized vans.

Anyways, opinions are like (you know what) everyone has one. That said, Farley does have a cousin that lived in a van down by the river. So maybe he knows a thing or two.

Is that Bill Shakespeare over there?

but seriously, what young company in their right mind would have said no to that Amazon deal.

 

[WSea]

i wonder why "everything is confusing to them"... maybe because OEMs are the ones who historically sold them commercial vans? hmmm...

this doesnt fly and its just pure fluff and tactic to try to put Rivian in a negative light because they know if Rivian succeeds with Amazon (which they seem to be doing) they will succeed with smaller businesses.

but Rivian needs to get out of that exclusivity with Amazon ASAP or they will get left behind by having only one customer

Yeah that came across as odd to me too. Most plumbers I know are pretty damn smart. Maybe it's the OEM/Dealership setup that's confusing? Certainly frustrating.

 

[KingTodd]

I don't know how anyone can say it is right or wrong...that implies you know the outcome if RJ went a different route.
With that said, I don't think RJ made a poor choice. He is dealing with a startup company that can focus on just Amazon delivery vans. If he wanted to sell vans to any commercial customer, wouldn't that require a sales force and many different agreements, and God knows how to service them all when they could be anywhere in the country. At least the Amazon ones will be focused around an Amazon distribution center.
Oh, and all that Amazon money too was likely a good choice...not sure Joe's Plumbing would be much of an investor before or after buying a van.

 

[maverick92]

Something tells me the R2 platform is going to cater to these small business customers. Just a hunch

 

[coshesey]

IMHO, companies are waiting for a better option than a ford transit. They aren't bad designs, but the struggle with quality and recalls that take forever to solve - look it up, Gas tanks, Drive shafts...

We are looking to go partially electric where it makes sense and we are NOT looking at a singular solution and NOT only looking at ford.

If Rivian gets the mobile repair service off the ground, The CEO of Ford will have his initial premise all wrong. The plumber with 5 vans will want Rivian because they won't have to deal with fords dealer repair experience.

PK

 

[TexasBob]

The last line is the most telling: "Also, most commercial customers aren’t going electric.” Farley is right to worry (which is what this really says).

The reason customers are not going electric is because their options suck. The Ford e-Transhit is anything but compelling. Rivian is building an incredibly compelling vehicle for Amazon that will crush it once they start selling beyond Amazon.

How do I know? I have been asking actual Amazon drivers in my neighborhood in Houston "How do you like the Rivian" over the past few weeks. Every one of them so far has loved their new truck. They are over the moon about how much better the Rivian is and how much more they like it. And, sadly, I guarantee you that I have now done far more direct customer feedback that Mr. Farley.

 

[Count Orlok]

FWIW I'd buy one of the Rivian vans. It would look great parked down by the river with my laundry drying on a line.

 

[Sgt Beavis]

I assume you're comparing to the size that Ford has for sale?
https://www.ford.com/commercial-trucks/e-transit/

The largest E-Transit has barely more cargo volume than the EDV-500 (and that includes the passenger seat area). You can get the Transit in much smaller sizes. Also, there is the Transit Connect that is MUCH smaller.

I'm not criticizing Rivian here. I'm pretty sure Amazon had a large input into the van design, and rightly so. As someone pointed out, they would have been crazy to say no to Amazon. But Farley is still correct in that it limits their market.

 

[Sgt Beavis]

FWIW I'd buy one of the Rivian vans. It would look great parked down by the river with my laundry drying on a line.

Right there with you. I'd love a Rivian based RV. Espeically if we can get it in AWD with some off road capability.

 

[Adamn]

Since Amazon partnered with Rivian for the EDV I think that's a pretty big incentive for Rivian to start with vans of the size needed for Amazon. .

The shortest RCV is fairly similar in size to a Ford Transit with a 148" wheelbase. 9" longer Wheelbase and 12" longer overall. That said, I would like to see some smaller vans from Rivian too.

 

[COdogman]

FWIW I'd buy one of the Rivian vans. It would look great parked down by the river with my laundry drying on a line.

Or you could live in the parking lot of the body shop while waiting for repairs.

 

[maddave12]

Another benefit of having a large fleet operator as your primary customer: imagine the customer support/service center savings as opposed to having 100,000 vehicles owned by (say) 80,000 individual customers? I'm sure Amazon's a demanding customer, but I bet the support cost to Rivian's a fraction of what it would be if they were 80,000 individual customers.

 

[xyskis]

BrightDrop is an interesting platform but

I had Brightdrop reach out to me last week about my interest in their vans. Rivian reached out about the EDV during the time period when they were stated to be trying to get the exclusivity agreement dropped but nothing since then. As far as capability goes for my own use case, the Brightdrop probably fits better because of the enormous battery and AWD. Rivian isn't making AWD EDVs yet but they supposedly have it on their roadmap.

I've been on the list-serv for BrightDrop but don't own a company/business that requires commercial vans (this would be just to build out for a camper). Did they talk about pricing/lead time? I participated in one of their virtual tours and was disappointed in the fit/finish of the van; definitely more utilitarian with some hokey frame seats that looked more akin to a school bus from the 1990s.

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