Rivian R1T Door Construction Analysis: Sandy Munro Live

[crashmtb]

Screws are much easier to add than redoing tooling for heat staking (typically).
Also screws are more reliable than clips (clips break and tightness can't be adjusted).
Yes I can see why that strap would need to be serviced. Elastic straps break. Also no I don't want a plastic molded clip holding the strap (weaker and can't be removed to install a new strap).

I swear these engineers don't even consider anything other than "we could make it cheaper so this method is bad".

I think the door assembly was designed by someone who is very, very tired of broken “spruce tree” clips etc

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[SANZC02]

I understand what they are trying to do but it is an opinion, kind of like hiring an auditor, if they do not find something they think they did not do their job. Additionally, brand new company, brand new design, there is no way they would be 100% efficient in the 1000s of assembly points out of the gate.

They have some valid points but some places make me laugh.

For instance, man they have 120 screws in this door that is way to many, wait, they glued this section, they really should have used screws to make it serviceable.

 

[NY_Rob]

Those 120 screws X 4 doors (assuming front and rear door have approx the same number of fasteners) have to be screwed in by a person right (obviously with an industrial style screw gun device)? That would take a considerable amount of time vs the heatstaking procedure.

As the Monroe engineer mentioned "stick built" door...

 

[SoCal Rob]

Yes I can see why that strap would need to be serviced. Elastic straps break. Also no I don't want a plastic molded clip holding the strap (weaker and can't be removed to install a new strap).

I thought exactly the same thing about the elastic strap needing to be replaced.

Sandy & Co. tend to focus on lowering costs (materials and assembly) but if that undercuts quality for the price point or serviceability in the long run you may lose customers and future sales as a result.

 

[SASSquatch]

What everyone needs to remember is that this is is literally Rivian's FIRST production vehicle.

Somebody go find Sandy's video of the first Model 3 he tore down where he likened the build quality to a Kia in the 90's.

It is invariable that RIVIAN will have room for improvement. These guys are coming from the perspective of mature manufacturing from OEM's that have been at this for years and decades.

I for one appreciate that RIVIAN erred on the side of caution to make the R1T robust - maybe too robust. But I'd rather it be built like a tank for the first go than the alternative.

 

[thrill]

The thing I'm wondering is does that many screws make something really unlikely to develop squeaks and rattles, or the opposite...

 

[NY_Rob]

^ with all those screws... that panel is as solid as the US dollar

Seriously, that thing is not moving... very sturdy, but a huge wast of time to assemble.

 

[Cactus]

^ with all those screws... that panel is as solid as the US dollar

Seriously, that thing is not moving... very sturdy, but a huge wast of time to assemble.

Yup. Built to last a lifetime, but assembly must take 3x as long as tesla or ford door panels.
Good thing supply chain is slow. Gives them time to make doors.

 

[Riviot]

^ with all those screws... that panel is as solid as the US dollar

Seriously, that thing is not moving... very sturdy, but a huge wast of time to assemble.

Did you just badmouth my 'Murican dollar?! Thems fightin words, Yankee.

 

[R1Tom]

Like I always say.....want a company to come up with new and innovative products and grow....put an engineer/sales in CEO position. Want to shrink and cut costs....put in an accountant as CEO. RIVIAN is in growth mode....time to win forever fans....later can be when accounting (Monroe types) can step in and make them rattle, break 1 mile over warranty is over, etc....

 

[aw113sgte]

I hate the new plastic cars and all the plastic welded pieces that break and never hold together right. I may be odd but I'm glad its all screwed together makes it feel high quality and not junk to me. yes they should look at limiting some of that mainly for weight.

Totally agree. There are some major advantages to screw fasteners. (I just wish my Rivian had all the ones it's supposed to, I've found some missing).

 

[Nermal]

While I’m not anywhere near to being an automotive engineer, two things come out of these videos to me.

1 - As we’d expect, early Rivians are an amalgam of engineering philosophies from the various backgrounds their engineers came from in the not too distant past. One area comes from Ford, one Stellantis, another Tesla, etc. I’d think Rivian will evolve their own engineering dialect over time. We may already be seeing some of that In overbuilt-ness.
2- I’m a firm believer in the notion that sometimes the long path you know will get you to your destination in shorter time than the short path you don’t know. When Munro folks ask “why’d Rivian do that?”, it could be because it was what they knew they could do right away. The corrallary to that is at some point, you need to learn the short path.

 

[NY_Rob]

When Munro folks ask “why’d Rivian do that?”, it could be because it was what they knew they could do right away. The corrallary to that is at some point, you need to learn the short path.

Probably 100% as close to truth as you can get!

Line manager "we need 480 screws put in place for just four door panels?"
Production engineer "yes, it's either that or wait 6 months for a heatstake machine with four different configs to get set up and validated".
Line manager "anyone got a spare screw gun handy?"

 

[pfbz]

The Munro Rivian teardown videos seem a bit myopic to me...

Their focus seems to be predominantly on lowering cost of manufacturing and speeding up production. Very important goals, for sure, but they don't mention the accelerated time-to-market that many of Rivan's decisions enabled nor enhanced serviceability/retrofitting which is crucial in a 1.0 generation vehicle.


Would I rather have an R1T with "120 screws per door" delivered in mid 2022 or one with "heat-staked" doors that cost $20 less to manufacture in 2023? The answer seems obvious...

No doubt Rivian will tweak their design and manufacturing as they progress and volumes increase to lower costs, speed production, and possibly to improve quality, but these videos give absolutely no credit to or discussion of *why* some of these decisions were likely made.

 

[Guy]

The Munro Rivian teardown videos seem a bit myopic to me...

Their focus seems to be predominantly on lowering cost of manufacturing and speeding up production. Very important goals, for sure, but they don't mention the accelerated time-to-market that many of Rivan's decisions enabled nor enhanced serviceability/retrofitting which is crucial in a 1.0 generation vehicle.


Would I rather have an R1T with "120 screws per door" delivered in mid 2022 or one with "heat-staked" doors that cost $20 less to manufacture in 2023? The answer seems obvious...

No doubt Rivian will tweak their design and manufacturing as they progress and volumes increase to lower costs, speed production, and possibly to improve quality, but these videos give absolutely no credit to or discussion of *why* some of these decisions were likely made.

You make some good points but I would not say they accelerated to production given that in November 2018 they showed essentially the finished product with a 2020 production timeline and it has taken to 2022 to get to any meaningful production.

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