SANZC02

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Nice find, Thanks for sharing.

I have to say, there is a lot of information in there, as I was reading through here I could not help but think we seem to know a lot more than we realize about these Rivians....
 

SeaGeo

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I was doing a similar comparison of the R1S the other day, and was surprised that after the tax rebate it sits at basically the same prices as the Model Y performance. I don't really understand why you would buy the performance variant of the Y if the R1S is available.
 

Billyk24

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Tesla admitted to "including" miles of range past "empty on the dash" in their stated vehicle range numbers. This is adds like 13-20 plus miles of range that no driver should use.
 

jjwolf120

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Tesla admitted to "including" miles of range past "empty on the dash" in their stated vehicle range numbers. This is adds like 13-20 plus miles of range that no driver should use.
My understanding is that the EPA Test is run until the vehicle stops, not when it says it is out of juice or gas for ICE vehicles.
 

Billyk24

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My understanding is that the EPA Test is run until the vehicle stops, not when it says it is out of juice or gas for ICE vehicles.
Tesla has a different understanding and "games" the system for PR purposes. Edmunds tested range in EV and found out some interesting stuff with Tesla: Testing Tesla's Range Anxiety: Tesla Model Y, Model 3, VW ID.4, Ford Mach-E | Edmunds


  • In February 2021, we reported that every Tesla failed to hit its EPA range estimate in Edmunds' real-world EV range testing.---- Edmunds Tested: Electric Car Range and Consumption | Edmunds
  • Tesla disputed our test results, stating that the full range of its vehicles' batteries was not being accounted for.
  • Tesla argued that we hadn't accounted for the safety buffer: additional miles after an indicated zero that would see its vehicles match EPA figures.
  • We assembled a group of five new electric vehicles from Tesla, Ford and Volkswagen to test Tesla's claim.
  • Our tests showed that there is no fixed safety buffer. Even allowing for the additional miles recorded after an indicated zero, only two of the six Teslas we tested would hit their EPA figures in our real-world conditions.
  • Needless to say, Tesla was not happy with our test results, and we received a phone call. Tesla's engineers disputed our figures. They argued that we'd underestimated their cars' true range because our test ran to an indicated zero miles rather than to a stop
    • Some Teslas (2021 Tesla Model 3 Long Range, 2020 Tesla Model S Performance) do meet their EPA range estimates on the Edmunds EV range loop but with the caveats that they:
      • are charged to 100% battery capacity, which Tesla does not recommend for daily use;
      • are driven conservatively and without too many ancillary power draws, such as strong climate settings;
      • are driven in a temperate climate; and
      • are driven beyond the point where indicated range drops to zero.
    • Other Edmunds-tested Teslas (2020 Model 3 Standard Range Plus, 2020 Model Y Performance, 2018 Tesla Model 3 Performance) won't hit their EPA range estimates even following all of the above conditions.
    • Tesla is gaming the system for PR and should be penalized for such.
 
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Lobstahz

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1) Thanks Mods for making the thread title better
2) I was happy to see this comparison list the EPA as well as the "real world" as Telsa has a very large discrepancy with all of their cars between their EPA numbers and their real-world highway numbers. It's really quite frustrating because Tesla-fans will use the EPA range stats to bludgeon anything critical of Tesla, but it's not reflective of what most folks experience in the real world. It's also equally frustrating when this range is used to show how much better Tesla is at charging due to their "better range" and therefore "greater efficiency". Which isn't to say that you can't hit the targets and their EPA numbers but its really _really_ ideal conditions to do it. I prefer a more conservative range estimate that I'll hit or occasionally beat
 

manitou202

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Correction: The Model X does not support roof racks.

Having owned a Model X, the R1S is going to feel like quite the upgrade while costing $12k less (not including the tax credit).

The Model Y is still a good bargain all things considered, but no where near the level of luxury, performance, and functionality of the R1S.
 

Bumble1978

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Holy Sheeeeeeeet! 🤔 :clap:🤔
 

sevengroove

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The Model Y is still a good bargain all things considered, but no where near the level of luxury, performance, and functionality of the R1S.
This has been the back-and-forth in my mind all along. Model Y Long Range is great value for what it does, but there are all these little sacrifices that somehow make the ~$20k extra on the R1S seem worth it.
 

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You have to define what an adult is :) I am 5'11 @ 175lbs, and I could not last more than 15 minutes in the 3rd row of a model X, unless the 2nd row is moved forward a lot making the 2nd row passenger turn around and flick me off.
 

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A minor correction to that chart: Tesla is AWD, but Rivian is 4WD :p To some that makes a difference too.
 

Rivuylkill

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I was doing a similar comparison of the R1S the other day, and was surprised that after the tax rebate it sits at basically the same prices as the Model Y performance. I don't really understand why you would buy the performance variant of the Y if the R1S is available.
The MY uses about half the energy, has a totally different look & feel, some people like smaller cars, different software/ui, is a "known" quantity since as much as we are hopeful Rivian is still new, has a better supercharging user experience for likely the next few years at least, etc. There's tons of reasons but no right answer for everyone.
 
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