Rivian insiders should buy stock asap to boost employee morale

[moosehead]

Glad my RIVN stock purchases improve employee morale, cause I'm almost outta blood.

Yea, yea, I'm no insider, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

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[uthatch]

But you have no way of knowing what the ratio is of those who care, and those who do not, among those thousands. Already in this thread you've got more like a 1:2 ratio of those who care and those who do not. This means OP's hypothesis is not disproven.

A fundamental understanding of statistics and data is required to make an accurate assessment. Saying someone cares or does not based on a forum thread is not statistically relevant in any way.

However, there is data that covers this discussion. Can we think it’s different in an effort to conform to our own biases? Certainly. But it does not make our statements statistically accurate. And when dealing with a larger workforce, the accuracy increases due to the amount of data.

All in all, it doesn’t matter much. I do not think a stock buy back would increase employee retention, loyalty, or overall happiness. And there are statistics that back that thought.

 

[jeeden]

Fear not, Rivian won't disappear. There's always someone who'll buy them up on the cheap if everything goes to Sh!t for RJ. Heck, loads of Middle East and Asian money looking for a 'clean' home.

Actually, if things became really bad my money would be on Amazon.

• They already have a large investment in the company
• They seem happy with the van product and will want to continue with more in the future
• They LOVE brining supply chain "inside" the company (Prime Airlines, etc)
• They could start selling the van to competitors like UPS and Fedex (and use the data to better understand their businesses before they buy THEM in 5 years)
• It would be an immediate acquisition answer to Apple when they come out with their Electric Car

I think Rivian will be just fine and is oversold by tons right now. If they ever did get in real trouble I think they will still be fine with something like the above. It really is more of a tech company than an auto company and those are designed to hemorrhage cash and stock for years until they make it big and I think the employees are clear that is what they have signed up for like any other tech company (suffer and then make it big when the business starts making money).

The only people that really care about the depressed stock value are on Wall Street and word has been out for a long time that they have no clue what they are talking about. You could get on an earnings call telling them you found a mine full of pre-polished and dug gold nuggets and they would immediately ask "but how SHINY are they? Would you say VERY shiny? Maybe blinding? or just sort of shiny?" See Disney, Delta, Royal Carribean, Microsoft, Amazon, and any other number of companies that have their stock tank because they made money, record breaking money.... but it could have been MORE record breaking...

 

[SASSquatch]

Generally speaking, stock buy-backs only help with investor value. A buy-back will not help with their operational profitability, which is what employees can genuinely contribute to. A stock buy-back also signals that the company has decided that shareholder value is paramount to the company. At this point I'm of the opinion that shareholder value should be secondary to operational viability.
This isn't Apple where there are so many billions in the bank that management can pretty much control and manipulate shareholder value. Personally I'm always a bit skeptical of stock buybacks.

Pay the man!

Rivian will likely need to do the opposite of a share buy-back - they will need to release new shares to raise capital since, at their current burn rate, they won't make it to 2025.

Rivian needs to focus on three things:

1) Driving down costs which will require better utilizing their capacity at their normal plant and securing better terms with their parts suppliers. Inhouse developed enduro motors will help, but they won't realize those savings for some time.

2) They need to continue to ramp production because they are not seeing the economy of scale yet with the current production rate and every single Rivian they produce is losing them significant money

3) Focus on actually delivering produced vehicles and continuing to refine the customer experience, including building out their service and charging network. This will keep customers happy and keep the reservation backlog full.

The stock is going to be in the tank for a very long time, and as someone who is sitting on $20K in losses as I type this, I am resigned to that being the case. The next two years are going to be critical for the success of the company and if they execute, the stock will recover when they finally get to profitability - even small profitability.

If anything, if you have money to invest, and you are willing to speculate. this is a great time to buy as an individual investor.

 

[yarmatey]

Rivian needs to stop having layoffs every 6 months to improve moral. Employees lose unvested options when they're laid off too.

Imagine startup crunch for 2 years only to have your position arbitrary eliminated and your unvested options evaporated. The ones that survive get even more work.

Hop onto Glassdoor and read the reviews. Leadership is sinking the company. Never forget the human cost of layoffs.

 

[SASSquatch]

Rivian needs to stop having layoffs every 6 months to improve moral. Employees lose unvested options when they're laid off too.

Imagine startup crunch for 2 years only to have your position arbitrary eliminated and your unvested options evaporated. The ones that survive get even more work.

Hop onto Glassdoor and read the reviews. Leadership is sinking the company. Never forget the human cost of layoffs.

The reviews on Glassdoor are not encouraging. There tends to be a lot of negative bias there because the people most inclined to complain are those who have left the company, but the trend is very clear in comments: Management at the senior/middle levels lacks competence, experience, and fails to inspire and lead their workforce.

This is the death knell of any company, especially a startup. I hope RJ is not surrounding himself with yes-people and is bringing in experienced men AND women into leadership positions that can help establish the right culture and drive performance and productivity while creating a work environment where people feel safe, empowered, and setup to succeed.

 

[Count Orlok]

Glad my RIVN stock purchases improve employee morale, cause I'm almost outta blood.

Yea, yea, I'm no insider, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

I bought another 1,000 today but without much conviction. I have lived long enough to learn, however, that the Motel 12 is not twice as good as the Motel 6.

 

[DuoRivians]

The reviews on Glassdoor are not encouraging. There tends to be a lot of negative bias there because the people most inclined to complain are those who have left the company, but the trend is very clear in comments: Management at the senior/middle levels lacks competence, experience, and fails to inspire and lead their workforce.

This is the death knell of any company, especially a startup. I hope RJ is not surrounding himself with yes-people and is bringing in experienced men AND women into leadership positions that can help establish the right culture and drive performance and productivity while creating a work environment where people feel safe, empowered, and setup to succeed.

It’s been the trend in Silicon Valley lately to cut employees at the middle mgmt layer (eg sr managers to director level).

Agree generally. Hope Rivian continues to lean out mgmt and hire/keep people who know their stuff.

 

[yarmatey]

While negative reviews in general will be posted more, it's important to remember severance and their nda are aggressive enough to scare people from saying anything too. The layoff ax is hanging over everyone's head now, ask your rivian employee friends about their mental health.

I refused to sign the NDA because it contained a fair negotiation acknowledgment. However, they refused to negotiate at all. Many provisions of the NDA I was provided would be unenforceable now too, including their restrictions on discrimination litigation.

If you believe that rivian is "different" than everyone else, I hate to say it, but they tricked me too.

 

[Georgia Lurker]

If anything, if you have money to invest, and you are willing to speculate. this is a great time to buy as an individual investor.

So are you buying more right now? FWIW, I'm also sitting on ~19K in losses (averaged in at ~31)...and debating if I should stand pat or continue to DCA down. I'm super pessimistic by nature, but with the products Rivian has, their roadmap, their backers, and their leadership team, I'm uncharacteristically optimistic for the long haul.

I just don't want to hear anything else about e-bikes and Barbie camping adventure attachments.

 

[SASSquatch]

So are you buying more right now? FWIW, I'm also sitting on ~19K in losses (averaged in at ~31)...and debating if I should stand pat or continue to DCA down. I'm super pessimistic by nature, but with the products Rivian has, their roadmap, their backers, and their leadership team, I'm uncharacteristically optimistic for the long haul.

I just don't want to hear anything else about e-bikes and Barbie camping adventure attachments.

I hear you, brother! I am waiting for the dust to settle from the downward spiral from their earnings call but I am planning to purchase more shares to bring my average per share cost down.

I have been sitting on 1,000 shares of Ford stock, accumulated over half a decade now. I own a few Ford vehicles and used the stock to qualify for their X-plan pricing, which was a great way to reward stock holders for holding a certain number of shares for the long haul (Ford requires you to have at least 100 for 6 months or longer).

Well, since Ford sold it's shares in Rivian - I got a nice quarterly dividend and since Ford pulled the plug on their X-plan pricing for stock holders last year, and their stock has done miserably over the last 6 months, I am selling my Ford shares and buying Rivian.

Rivian has a lot of challenges ahead of them, but I believe in the product and the mission. They need to execute better and they need to hire better mid and senior level management. That is what is holding me back from investing more.

 

[Nix]

Sorry, but a bunch of factory workers are going to think you are out of touch about why their moral is low, if you tell them that top CEO's are going to buy a ton of shares from all the money they are making off their labor in order to increase their moral.

That's like all the executives buying brand new R1T's/R1S's and having them all park in a row in reserved parking at the front of the building. Sure, it supports the company. But the optics are that the top execs are pocketing all the money while the company is burning cash like an incinerator.

There aren't any employees out there thinking to themselves "this job would be the best job I ever had, if the execs would just buy more shares for themselves and really make a big profit for themselves. That would make this job so much better".

 

[DuoRivians]

Sorry, but a bunch of factory workers are going to think you are out of touch about why their moral is low, if you tell them that top CEO's are going to buy a ton of shares from all the money they are making off their labor in order to increase their moral.

That's like all the executives buying brand new R1T's/R1S's and having them all park in a row in reserved parking at the front of the building. Sure, it supports the company. But the optics are that the top execs are pocketing all the money while the company is burning cash like an incinerator.

There aren't any employees out there thinking to themselves "this job would be the best job I ever had, if the execs would just buy more shares for themselves and really make a big profit for themselves. That would make this job so much better".

You realize that every worker, including factory workers, have options or shares via ESPP in the company.

 

[Nix]

You realize that every worker, including factory workers, have options or shares via ESPP in the company.

And there's the disconnect I was talking about right there.

A minor blip in their massively underwater options or double digit share losses isn't going to have the impact on moral you think. Going from underwater to still underwater, or massive double digit losses to still massive double digit losses doesn't do what you think it will do.

 

[Acoustic71]

I bought another 1,000 today but without much conviction. I have lived long enough to learn, however, that the Motel 12 is not twice as good as the Motel 6.

Yeah, the towels only improve from "stiff as a board" to "major Irritation"

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