Rivian confirms POWERED tailgate has now been KILLED

[dmc94]

It may be a deal breaker for me -- especially when competitors all have the feature for tens of thousands of dollars less.

I need to look at the "value" when the vehicle comes out. The more features they remove, the harder it will be for them to justify the price, to me.

This shouldn't be a deal breaker. When you compare real apples-to-apples features, other truck cost $65-75k. That doesn't include a $7,500 tax credit or the gas you'll save over those years. Even if a truck was $60k, over five years, they'll come out to the same cost to own and operate. Still a great bargain.

Advertisement

 

[dmc94]

The price was actually lower, Originally Starting at 70k now 67,500 same thing with the R1S, originally starting at 72k now 70k.

I get your point for sure. The roof will only let about 2% of light in although it sucks it's not adjustable. The max pack is there but not on launch editions. Hasn't Rivian said Level 3 will be coming? Just like Tesla has said FSD will be coming (for nearly a decade now). I thought Driver+ would be hands-free while monitoring the driver in the future. Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[CommodoreAmiga]

This shouldn't be a deal breaker. When you compare real apples-to-apples features, other truck cost $65-75k. That doesn't include a $7,500 tax credit or the gas you'll save over those years. Even if a truck was $60k, over five years, they'll come out to the same cost to own and operate. Still a great bargain.

For $65k I can get an ICE truck with considerably more features, it seems. I'm willing to pay a little premium for BEV -- but not $30k.

 

[dmc94]

For $65k I can get an ICE truck with considerably more features, it seems. I'm willing to pay a little premium for BEV -- but not $30k.

If you build out an F-150 supercrew Lariat with similar specs and features, that's a $64,290 (roughly) MSRP vehicle. I'm not talking King Ranch or Platinum but the same bells and whistles as the R1T. The R1T would cost $67,500 (again for similar wheel size, Explore package, and not including the kitchen). Subtract your tax credit and you're already $4k lower. Then subtract your fuel savings over 5 years and it's a no brainer.

 

[cohall]

If you build out an F-150 supercrew Lariat with similar specs and features, that's a $64,290 (roughly) MSRP vehicle. I'm not talking King Ranch or Platinum but the same bells and whistles as the R1T. The R1T would cost $67,500 (again for similar wheel size, Explore package, and not including the kitchen). Subtract your tax credit and you're already $4k lower. Then subtract your fuel savings over 5 years and it's a no brainer.

This assumes people pay MSRP for an F-150, and not the typically ~15-18% discount that are frequently and easily obtainable on full-size trucks.

One can get a relatively loaded Ram Rebel Crew Cab for ~$50K with very little effort. $50K vs $67K is a pretty big pill to swallow.

I guess my point is that whether or not the R1T makes financial sense is a very individual determination.

 

[ElectricDan]

Maybe not on the website, but of the 3 events I went to prior to the COVID, ALL the engineers working on autonomy or in the know, said that it would be Level 2 until...

So their website portrays one thing to the general public, but unpublished conversations reveal something completely different?

Perhaps this feature isn't as important to you, but what if they did this with something else? What if when anyone asks at an event or in private they say yea 300 miles of range will be the epa estimate, but real world will be less than 200, yet online they continue to advertise 300+?

My issue is this is poor communication culture, and when it starts with one issue you dont know where it ends.

 

[Eager2own]

This assumes people pay MSRP for an F-150, and not the typically ~15-18% discount that are frequently and easily obtainable on full-size trucks. It also assumes that one has not already owned an EV and received the tax credit.

One can get a relatively loaded Ram Rebel Crew Cab for ~$50K with very little effort. Assuming you already used the EV rebate, $50K vs $75K is a pretty big pill to swallow.

I guess my point is that whether or not the R1T makes financial sense is a very individual determination.

Hey now!! What is this talk of “already used your EV rebate”?
It’s not a once and done deal.

 

[LoneStar]

How frequently can individual claim an electric vehicle fed tax credit? Is there a mandatory period between? Or is it limited to a one-time deal per individual tax filer?

 

[azbill]

How frequently can individual claim an electric vehicle fed tax credit? Is there a mandatory period between? Or is it limited to a one-time deal per individual tax filer?

I have already used two of them, four years apart.

 

[jimcgov3]

So their website portrays one thing to the general public, but unpublished conversations reveal something completely different?

Perhaps this feature isn't as important to you, but what if they did this with something else? What if when anyone asks at an event or in private they say yea 300 miles of range will be the epa estimate, but real world will be less than 200, yet online they continue to advertise 300+?

My issue is this is poor communication culture, and when it starts with one issue you dont know where it ends.

Please do not take what I am saying as not an important feature. I am with you. I want Level 3. Especially once they gather enough data to support the feature. Their COMMS are straight hot garbage. I hope more of us are blowing up Rivian's chat and e-mail today voicing their displeasure. It is all fine and dandy complaining on here but it matters more when they actually hear about it.

 

[cohall]

Hey now!! What is this talk of “already used your EV rebate”?
It’s not a once and done deal.

I literally thought it was a once per person thing. Thank you for the correction, and I've updated my post!

 

[wilderaz]

Totally agreed.

While this may not be a deal-breaker, it is really disappointing.

I'm adding it to my running list of Over-promised and under-delivered.

I'm just venting now and don't actually maintain a list, but here's all the things that they had previously told us would be included or optional:
-Powered tailgate
-Price is actually higher than they told us/Reuters it would be
-No electrochromatic roof (nor any sun-shade for the all glass roof)
-No removable roof at launch
-No 180 drop down tailgate
-No max battery pack at launch
-No level 3 autonomy
-No Lidar
-No spare tire included

Ugh. I'm depressing myself now. The value proposition is far below what it was when I put down my deposit.

Add to that pushing back delivery of the max pack until after the large pack, eliminating any commitment to produce the R1S as a max pack or five seater, offering no LE for the max pack, and providing minimal communication and no apology regarding these actions. So far I'm very unimpressed with Rivian's commitment to customer service.

 

[dmc94]

This assumes people pay MSRP for an F-150, and not the typically ~15-18% discount that are frequently and easily obtainable on full-size trucks.

One can get a relatively loaded Ram Rebel Crew Cab for ~$50K with very little effort. $50K vs $67K is a pretty big pill to swallow.

I guess my point is that whether or not the R1T makes financial sense is a very individual determination.

For sure, but again you gotta take it all into account. Even if the Ram is $50k (which for similar features it’s more than that) after tax credit and fuel savings, you can cut about $12,000 off the Rivian.

 

[CommodoreAmiga]

If you build out an F-150 supercrew Lariat with similar specs and features, that's a $64,290 (roughly) MSRP vehicle. I'm not talking King Ranch or Platinum but the same bells and whistles as the R1T. The R1T would cost $67,500 (again for similar wheel size, Explore package, and not including the kitchen). Subtract your tax credit and you're already $4k lower. Then subtract your fuel savings over 5 years and it's a no brainer.

Rivian will get MSRP. Ford doesn't. If you're paying MSRP on a Ford then you're not too bright, and that isn't my problem.

By the time I spec the Rivian the way I want, I'm in the low $90's. I can walk into a Ford/GMC/RAM dealer and drive out in a loaded truck with more features (except for BEV) for $30k less.

 

[dmc94]

Rivian will get MSRP. Ford doesn't. If you're paying MSRP on a Ford then you're not too bright, and that isn't my problem.

By the time I spec the Rivian the way I want, I'm in the low $90's. I can walk into a Ford/GMC/RAM dealer and drive out in a loaded truck with more features (except for BEV) for $30k less.

Definitely. Trucks are by far the easiest vehicle to get a discount on. I think choosing your Rivian options is key. How often will you actually use a full 400 miles vs. 300 miles? Daily? Weekly? It's worth a couple extra stops on a roadtrip to save $10k. At your comment of $30k less, if you choose the small battery pack, now you're at $20k difference, minu tax credit and now you're at $12,500. If you drive 15k miles per year like I do at an average of $2.79 for gas on a 16 mpg truck, that's $13,000 in savings. Add back in cost for charging at about a quarter of that and you're still paying only $2,700 more than an ICE truck that costs $20k MSRP less and that's not even including maintenance and resell value.