Rivian Battery Poll - VOTE HERE

What battery will you be going with and why ?

  • 105kWh (230+mile range)

  • 135kWH (300+mile range)

  • 180kWh (400+mile range)


Results are only viewable after voting.

KickRocksRiv

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Don’t worry about it sweetheart
Im on the fence between the 135 & 180kWh packs. Knowing that the majority of EV’s on the road today have a 300 mile range and are navigating that just fine. Is is necessary or worth it to go up to the 400mile range ?

Would love your thoughts and input here. I get the bigger is better argument, but what other then that is swaying your decision?
 
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DucRider

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Leaning heavily towards the 135 kWh, but depends on:
  1. Actual rated range of the 135 ("300+" could be 301 or 340)
  2. Additional cost of the 180 kWh. Probably not worth $10K for the small time savings on the occasional road trip.
 

bajadahl

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180 kWh - as this is my first EV of any type I have severe range anxiety. I am at the tail end of raising kids so the extra seating is not needed (I've done my last car pool).... unlike 95% or maybe it's 99% of you I expect this to be a regular long distance travel vehicle very rarely used for around town driving. I already know I am going to have to change my driving habits because I typically drive until the tank is near empty and then just stop for gas in the next town with almost zero thought about it. Easily going 300 - 350 miles between stops on some of the longest stretches of road. Keeping the 180kWh battery pack between 10%-90% I am guessing I will only get around 300 miles of true range.
 
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KickRocksRiv

KickRocksRiv

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Yeah
180 kWh - as this is my first EV of any type I have severe range anxiety. I am at the tail end of raising kids so the extra seating is not needed (I've done my last car pool).... unlike 95% or maybe it's 99% of you I expect this to be a regular long distance travel vehicle very rarely used for around town driving. I already know I am going to have to change my driving habits because I typically drive until the tank is near empty and then just stop for gas in the next town with almost zero thought about it. Easily going 300 - 350 miles between stops on some of the longest stretches of road. Keeping the 180kWh battery pack between 10%-90% I am guessing I will only get around 300 miles of true range.
I’m Pretty much thinking the same . I usually drive like a machine only stopping for gas and food. I’m thinking the 180 pack will give me at least 300 miles before I need to start looking for a charger. And it will give me about 75-100 miles to find a charge. Thinking about road trips with the smaller battery is what is giving me pause.

300 miles still sounds like a great amount of range tho. It’s really going to come down to the cost Between the 2 packs for me.
 

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180 kWh for me. I'd be more than happy with 300 miles of effective range with my driving habits... but not 300 miles EPA range.

Keep in mind the 410+ (for R1S) is most likely based on EPA cycle. Given that I tend to cruise around 85, climate and geographic factors, etc I'm not going to get anywhere near EPA range. With the 180 kWh pack, with any luck, I'll actually get 285+ miles in the real world on a full charge. If I only use say 80% of the battery capacity between charges, then I'm potentially only looking at about 230 miles of effective range between charges. That would at least get me as far as my usual pit stops on road trips. Same assumptions with 135 kWh pack nets me about 175 mi or I could stretch that to about 220 mi if I used the full battery capacity which I would prefer not do from a battery longevity and safety margin (ie, DCFC out of order) perspective.

Hopefully I'm being overly pessimistic on range but I don't think so. Even Elon Musk is reminding folks of the variety of factors that will reduce range:
“With regard to passenger vehicles, I think the new normal for range is going to be, just in U.S. EPA terms, approximately 300 miles. So I think people will really come to expect that as some number close to 300 miles as normal.

That's a standard expectation because you do need to take into account, like, is it very hot outside or very cold? Or are you driving up into a mountain with a full load? And it's – people don't want to have – get to the destination with like 10 miles range. They want some reasonable margins. So I think 300 is going to be really – or close to 300 is going to be a new normal, call it 500 kilometers, basically, roughly.”
 

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180 kWh - as this is my first EV of any type I have severe range anxiety. I am at the tail end of raising kids so the extra seating is not needed (I've done my last car pool).... unlike 95% or maybe it's 99% of you I expect this to be a regular long distance travel vehicle very rarely used for around town driving. I already know I am going to have to change my driving habits because I typically drive until the tank is near empty and then just stop for gas in the next town with almost zero thought about it. Easily going 300 - 350 miles between stops on some of the longest stretches of road. Keeping the 180kWh battery pack between 10%-90% I am guessing I will only get around 300 miles of true range.
It will be more efficient (faster) to stop more often. Only after we see what the taper is can the best scheme be calculated, but it is very likely that charging above 80% will be slower than charging to a lower level and stopping sooner (assuming a fast CCS is within range).
It is possible that only charging to 60% will yield the fastest overall time if the charge tapers dramatically like we see on Tesla's. If we see a flat curve more like the Audi e-tron, charging to 80% (or even 90%) may be the most efficient. Temperature can also come into play. The Taycan starts it's taper much sooner (50% vs 75%?) in hot weather.
That being said the 180 kWh pack will shorten your travel time.
Your situation is much different than mine. Long trips would be done with my wife, and 2 hours without stopping is over the limit for her.
And the 300 miles between 10% and 90% could be a bit optimistic if you drive over 65 mph. The Rivians are as about as aero friendly as a box on wheels can be (not very), and elevated speeds will almost certainly carry a significant range penalty. Many people do not realize the EPA hwy test has a top speed of 60 mph and an average speed of 48 mph.
 

ajdelange

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There's an old saying that one cannot be too rich or too thin. I think that's extendable to range in an motor vehicle. While you may absolutely need it seldom, if ever, it is comforting to know that it is lying there under the floorboards. For example, you are planning to arrive at a fast charger with 10% reserve - pushing it a bit but you've had a great tailwind all along so far so why not just keep going instead of making an extra stop. Plus the bathrooms at that next Walmart are cleaner. Whatever. Now suddenly and unexpectedly the wind veers and a huge thunderstorm rolls in with torrential rain. All of a sudden your 10% margin is a 10% shortfall. Whatever size the battery one can envision himself in that position but with 400 mile range it is less likely than with 300.

Now Elon Musk has proclaimed that 300 miles is enough and he's right in some ways. My ICE SUV's have ranges like that. But there are two differences with 300 mi range in a BEV as opposed to with ICE. First, with ICE you try to avoid the bottom 5% of the gas tank whereas with a BEV you try to avoid the bottom 20% and the top 20% of the SoC in ordinary driving and the top and bottom 10% when on a road trip (which is where this whole thing about range becomes significant). Thus your 300 mile rated vehicle is, on a road trip, really a 240 mile vehicle but your 400 mile rated one is a 320 mile vehicle. That extra 80 miles is a comfort. The second factor is that things that increase drag (speed, road surface, rain, wind) have a more profound effect on a BEV than an ICE vehicle because the inertial and gravitational loads in a BEV are partly recoverable and thus effectively smaller making drag relatively larger.

If I test against the trip I make most often the 300 mi range would add an hour and an extra charge stop.

FInally, and I think this is going to be a very important factor for many, is where one is in life. I'm at the point where these trucks are bucket list items. There are, as they say, no pockets in the shroud so why not go first cabin? I realize, because I have been there, that someone in an earlier phase of his life won't have such a cavalier attitude WRT $10K.
 
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Leaning heavily towards the 135 kWh, but depends on:
  1. Actual rated range of the 135 ("300+" could be 301 or 340)
  2. Additional cost of the 180 kWh. Probably not worth $10K for the small time savings on the occasional road trip.
Yeah I’m assuming the “+” is going to depend on your driving style (same as it does with a gas vehicle). Oh and of course how often you show friends your 0-60 in 3 seconds trick
 

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180 for me. I live in small town Alaska. I'm about 306 miles from Anchorage and about 350 miles from Fairbanks. With no reliable year round charging in place yet on the road system.
 

ajdelange

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Given that I tend to cruise around 85, climate and geographic factors, etc I'm not going to get anywhere near EPA range.
You will have to take this as representative rather than a prediction as to what you will actually experience but I predict range reduction to 64.5% of EPA range at 85 mph with the 90% confidence band ranging from 51.6% to 84.0% based on my driving history in a Tesla X. And yes indeed the confidence band width depends on how, where and when I drove while collecting the data on which this prediction was made.
 

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180 for me. I live in small town Alaska. I'm about 306 miles from Anchorage and about 350 miles from Fairbanks. With no reliable year round charging in place yet on the road system.
Both of those trips are unlikely to be practical most of the year in an EV rated 400 miles. Even the Cybertruck with 500 miles would be questionable. Cold temps will drastically reduce range. Even "cool" temperatures will reduce range.
 

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You will have to take this as representative rather than a prediction as to what you will actually experience but I predict range reduction to 64.5% of EPA range at 85 mph with the 90% confidence band ranging from 51.6% to 84.0% based on my driving history in a Tesla X. And yes indeed the confidence band width depends on how, where and when I drove while collecting the data on which this prediction was made.
Sounds about right. I was assuming 70% in my post above (with zero actual data of any sort to base it on so with your data it appears my guess wasn't unrealistic).
 

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Both of those trips are unlikely to be practical most of the year in an EV rated 400 miles. Even the Cybertruck with 500 miles would be questionable. Cold temps will drastically reduce range. Even "cool" temperatures will reduce range.
I know, until the charging network is set up I'm keeping my ICE truck also.
 

ajdelange

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No, cool temperatures do not reduce range appreciably, at least not in my experience with two Teslas. Even cold temperatures will not have a major effect on the newer Teslas as they use the heat pump to warm the battery so not much energy will be required to keep it comfy. Until, of course, the temperature drops low enough that the heat pump COP gets close to 1. I expect that kind of weather will be encountered in Alaska during some parts of the year.

That said I would be very nervous undertaking a 350 mile trip, or for that matter, a 300 mile one, in cold (or even warm) weather in a vehicle with an EPA rating of 400. Even with a 500 mi rated CT I would want to have a backup plan (i.e. some place I could charge if things didn't go as hoped).
 

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