Ride quality R1S vs R1T? Should I be worried about reviews?

[Zybane]

This is Munro ranting about Tesla margins and what not - has nothing to do with what I said.
What I said was Tesla days of dominance are over. It's not 15 years ago where there are no competition. Consumers now have many choices, great many choices to choose from. Last I looked, just about close to 40 EV companies around the world have one or more models in their line up. While Tesla has delayed production of the Cybertruck year after year, we get Rivian R1T/R1S, and Lightning orders got filled within days. If Tesla can absolutely dominate, they wouldn't have a glut of inventory and wouldn't have to cut prices 20% while consumers line up for other options.

Munro was ranting about some guys knowing more than him and his company on Tesla margins, more than the 3 books he produced. LOL. I could care less. I said Tesla days of dominance are over. And a whole lot of people with a lot more pedigree than I agree. Like Lucid and Rivian, KIA and Hyundai, BMW and Mercedes, Audi and Porsche, VW and Volvo, GM and Ford, RAM and whatever... you get the gist.

I completely disagree. Tesla's price cuts were a dominance power-play. Also, because their margins were so high, they could do it. Other/Legacy auto makers are now sweating in their offices, BAD.

Tesla has 2/3rds of US EV market share now. I expect that to go UP, not down, after their price cuts.

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[DB-EV]

This is Munro ranting about Tesla margins and what not - has nothing to do with what I said.
What I said was Tesla days of dominance are over. It's not 15 years ago where there are no competition. Consumers now have many choices, great many choices to choose from. Last I looked, just about close to 40 EV companies around the world have one or more models in their line up. While Tesla has delayed production of the Cybertruck year after year, we get Rivian R1T/R1S, and Lightning orders got filled within days. If Tesla can absolutely dominate, they wouldn't have a glut of inventory and wouldn't have to cut prices 20% while consumers line up for other options.

Munro was ranting about some guys knowing more than him and his company on Tesla margins, more than the 3 books he produced. LOL. I could care less. I said Tesla days of dominance are over. And a whole lot of people with a lot more pedigree than I agree. Like Lucid and Rivian, KIA and Hyundai, BMW and Mercedes, Audi and Porsche, VW and Volvo, GM and Ford, RAM and whatever... you get the gist.

How about, Tesla dominance will be over in 2-4 years? The other folks including Rivian are not producing enough to dent their dominance based on current data.

 

[Zybane]

How about, Tesla dominance will be over in 2-4 years? The other folks including Rivian are not producing enough to dent their dominance based on current data.

Exactly. Other manufacturers are producing in very small quantities compared to Tesla. Also, 2023/24 recession is going to GREATLY limit the amount of people looking for a $100K SUV/Mid-sized pickup that Rivian offers.

 

[DB-EV]

Exactly. Other manufacturers are producing in very small quantities compared to Tesla. Also, 2023/24 recession is going to GREATLY limit the amount of people looking for a $100K SUV/Mid-sized pickup that Rivian offers.

PS we are massively drifted. I actually came to look at the notes on different tuning as my R1s is coming s00n and I just ended up walking into this 'fight'. : )

 

[windblowlc]

I will let Tesla fight the fight. When there are better alternatives, smart buyers will know. I have no interest in Tesla. Getting back to the thread, I wouldn't be so concerned with the ride quality of the R1S. I expect Rivian is going to make suspension tuning adjustments with software updates just like they have done previously. If they can do it to the R1T, there's no reason the cannot do it to the R1S.

 

[DB-EV]

I will let Tesla fight the fight. When there are better alternatives, smart buyers will know. I have no interest in Tesla. Getting back to the thread, I wouldn't be so concerned with the ride quality of the R1S. I expect Rivian is going to make suspension tuning adjustments with software updates just like they have done previously. If they can do it to the R1T, there's no reason the cannot do it to the R1S.

Agree 100 pc. I tested both and the r1s was till pretty sweet.

 

[Autolycus]

So... is this thread about the ride quality of the R1S or about Tesla's marketshare and future? I'm pretty sure I clicked on a thread about the former, but I'm seeing an awful lot of discussion about the latter.

I'll admit to contributing to pulling some other threads off track myself, but this one feels a little too far.

 

[Monkey]

Just like me. Apparently 6 footers are fine in the third row for an hour or so.

If it wasn't shortened it would be longer as an SUV than any SUV you could imagine. It is like a few inches shorter than a Yukon.

Yes, it's a long SUV as it is. But if they kept the same rear overhang profile of the R1S on the 135.8" wheelbase of the R1T, that would give an overall length of 215.5". So yes, a total increase of 14.7" in length. Probably best to offer that as a longer edition option and at 215.5" it would still be 6" shorter than the Expedition MAX and 9" shorter than the Yukon XL. So no, not longer than any SUV I could imagine. Not as long two that have been on the market for years, one of which I've owned every generation of (Expedition).

Normal sized adults can sit comfortably in an Expedition or Yukon, even a bit more so in the MAX/XL in the third row. And I mean comfortably for a road trip.

 

[R.I.P.]

I completely disagree. Tesla's price cuts were a dominance power-play. Also, because their margins were so high, they could do it. Other/Legacy auto makers are now sweating in their offices, BAD.

Tesla has 2/3rds of US EV market share now. I expect that to go UP, not down, after their price cuts.

Yup. You get the bigger picture that a lot of people seem to miss.

 

[White Shadow]

I've wondered this about the R1S since the beginning... Why shorten it? Or since they did, why not offer a long version as well? None of the arguments for off-road angles make any real sense as the longer wheelbase of the R1T handles brilliantly off-road. The 2nd row seating in the R1T (and presumably the same in the R1S) is already cramped enough as it is... I'm expecting the third row in the R1S to be yet again another torture chamber for normal sized adults. I have yet to sit in an R1S to know. That's what the third row is in the Model X - a torture chamber. Normal or larger adults can't sit safely in the third row of the X... And definitely not comfortably other than for a quick trip somewhere. In the third row of our X (that we owned for over 4 years) I couldn't sit upright without cocking my head to the side. I'm only 5'8" but have rather short legs/ long torso. Also barrel-chested with broad shoulders. Built like a gorilla, I guess.

I like that they shortened it. No need for a midsize SUV to be extra long unless of course you need a 3rd row that seats adults (not just children) comfortably. That said, you can't just shorten the wheelbase and not dial in the suspension tuning. I may be completely wrong here, but it almost seems like all the suspension tuning for the T was used for the S and it just doesn't work as well on the shorter wheelbase. The good thing is that this is easy for Rivian to fix. Hopefully they do it soon.

 

[R.I.P.]

The good thing is that this is easy for Rivian to fix. Hopefully they do it soon.

People keep repeating this mantra as if it is a given fact, which of course it is not.

A great deal of geometry goes into building a suspension system. It goes well beyond the obviously adjustable airbags and hydraulic valving.

Suspension systems move in an arc that is defined by its mechanical tie points. In a perfect world, those mechanical tie points are well engineered to match the exact vehicle characteristics. If, as I suspect, this is what is causing the issues in the R1S, this absolutely cannot be fixed with an over-the-air update LOL. It will need to be physically re-engineered for the vehicle.

That said, I have absolutely no direct evidence that it is a physical problem. I only point out that just assuming it is a software issue is folly. I for one plan to hang on to my R1T until Rivian has found and fixed this issue; then I will move on my plan to get the R1S.

 

[OverSurge]

I'm a little late to the conversation, but as one of the early recipients of an R1S, I'd have to agree that the ride quality could be improved. I'm hoping a lot of it can be addressed with over the air updates, but I'm not sure if it requires an hardware engineering adjustment or software fix. The only thing I haven't been a fan of is the fact that you've got to focus drive the R1S at all times. It doesn't hold the lane well. I saw that this was also listed as the biggest complaint in Consumer Reports assessment of the vehicle, who praised it overall. It takes work to keep the vehicle evenly between the lines. I have gotten used to it the more I have driven it, but I'd still prefer if that wasn't a characteristic that you have to adapt too. I wish it had tighter (hold the line) steering. I'm assuming this is what everyone is referring to when comparing to the R1T, which has a longer wheel base and thus smaller adjustments in steering wouldn't have as big of an impact. I don't believe they are talking about the bounce/feel of the ride. I have a lot of different comparisons over the years to compare this behavior too. I didn't deal with this with my Ford Explorer at all. It held the lane well. With my wife's old Honda Accord coupe, it also didn't hold the lane as easily, but it did it better than the R1S. It's not even fair to compare our Tesla S steering to the R1S, but it's definitely the other extreme of holding a lane (perfect tight steering).

This "ride" (steering) is my one complaint of my R1S so far and I'm saying this with having it in the shop 3 times with one of them being a catastrophic failure that it went into limp mode and had to be towed to service center.

One of these days, I'll complete my full review after owning one for 4+ months now.

 

[R.I.P.]

I'm a little late to the conversation, but as one of the early recipients of an R1S, I'd have to agree that the ride quality could be improved. I'm hoping a lot of it can be addressed with over the air updates, but I'm not sure if it requires an hardware engineering adjustment or software fix. The only thing I haven't been a fan of is the fact that you've got to focus drive the R1S at all times. It doesn't hold the lane well. I saw that this was also listed as the biggest complaint in Consumer Reports assessment of the vehicle, who praised it overall. It takes work to keep the vehicle evenly between the lines. I have gotten used to it the more I have driven it, but I'd still prefer if that wasn't a characteristic that you have to adapt too. I wish it had tighter (hold the line) steering. I'm assuming this is what everyone is referring to when comparing to the R1T, which has a longer wheel base and thus smaller adjustments in steering wouldn't have as big of an impact. I don't believe they are talking about the bounce/feel of the ride. I have a lot of different comparisons over the years to compare this behavior too. I didn't deal with this with my Ford Explorer at all. It held the lane well. With my wife's old Honda Accord coupe, it also didn't hold the lane as easily, but it did it better than the R1S. It's not even fair to compare our Tesla S steering to the R1S, but it's definitely the other extreme of holding a lane (perfect tight steering).

This "ride" (steering) is my one complaint of my R1S so far and I'm saying this with having it in the shop 3 times with one of them being a catastrophic failure that it went into limp mode and had to be towed to service center.

One of these days, I'll complete my full review after owning one for 4+ months now.

What you and so many others are describing truly does not sound like a software ride setting. It sounds like physical suspension geometry that is not matched for the vehicle. I'm not touching one until they fix this.

 

[madgrey]

The only thing I haven't been a fan of is the fact that you've got to focus drive the R1S at all times. It doesn't hold the lane well.

This sounds like tramlining, could this be a factor?

This is generally caused by things like worn suspension bushings, mismatched alignment specs, mismatched tire pressure and wrong offset wheels. Did you have your alignment checked? What about tire pressure? I assume you didn't yet change your wheels/tires (many options reduce offset by a massive 30mm) and you certainly shouldn't have worn components.

 

[R.I.P.]

This sounds like tramlining, could this be a factor?

This is generally caused by things like worn suspension bushings, mismatched alignment specs, mismatched tire pressure and wrong offset wheels. Did you have your alignment checked? What about tire pressure? I assume you didn't yet change your wheels/tires (many options reduce offset by a massive 30mm) and you certainly shouldn't have worn components.

You are correct, that's exactly what it sounds like. Except, this is pretty universal across the board, so that would lead one to believe it is a design flaw.

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