R1T MAX Pack Preorder - Change of Heart

[1civilengr]

After having a reserved Max Pack preorder for about 2 years, I have come to the very reluctant realization that I really am not willing to pay $82k for a vehicle. I'm mostly retired, and am not willing to forgo all the activities that the $1,000+/month payment and insurance would require. I have a diesel VW Touareg that is a great tow vehicle for our camper (and is paid for).
So . . .
Is there any advantage to hanging on to my reservation at this point, or should I just give it up now?
Any thoughts?

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[theyoungone]

Most will tell you to cancel and leave that spot in line for someone else. And if you’re not willing to flip it (the Max pack) or switch to an R1S (large/dual Motor Max) and then flip I’d agree.

 

[Dark-Fx]

If you had an early reservation, there's a chance you could make money on a flip, but it's still an unknown right now.

 

[COdogman]

You have to do what is best for you. If it’s going to force you to give up that much other stuff in your life, it might not be worth it. In the end it’s still just a truck.

As others said, there is a chance you could flip it depending on how early on in the max pack deliveries you are, but if not you are stuck with it, along with the payment. I would still think you’d easily find a buyer, even if you didn’t make a bunch of profit on it.

 

[Donald Stanfield]

I wouldn't plan on flipping it. I would just cancel your order. Even if you could make 5-10K on it you're taking a risk and with interest rates the way they are and Rivian catching up with orders I think the risk is bigger and not worth it.

I get that 80K is a big ticket item and if it's going to cause you to miss out on things I wouldn't get it either. It's a great vehicle but it's just a vehicle.

 

[bummin]

It is a big expense no matter how you look at it. Being semi retired I agree there are better things in life to spend over 1k/mo on, and as good as a Rivian is, enjoy something better. If you cancel, you help yourself, Rivian, and someone down the line that is accepting of that monthly expense. I get the flip part, we all like making money, but it comes at the expense of Rivian and over charging others.

Most of us enjoyed the purchase experience with a Rivian guide at our local SC, that is something the buyer of a flip vehicle won't experience. Yes the vehicles are good, but there is something bigger to Rivian at least at this moment that makes it more special for those of us who did keep our vehicles. As Donald said, it is just a vehicle. If you aren't in it for the longer experience, spending your money on better memories sounds like a much better time in life for you and the family.

Aloha

 

[Yossarian]

My situation is very similar to yours @1civilengr. I too am mostly retired, and hoped that the Rivian would become our sole and forever car, and the one that woucild take me, my wife and our two Welshies on longer trips with our teardrop camper in tow. We really wanted the R1S, but with the camper, felt that we needed the Max. We've been waiting since May of 2020, and so it was really disappointing to be told by Rivian this past December that they were postponing production the quad R1T Max indefinitely. I'll spare you the details behind the decision, but we ultimately elected to reconfigure to the R1S LR and hope that we can get reasonable range when towing.

At the time we made the decision (Jan), it appeared that there was relatively little financial risk involved. If the R1S needed to be recharged every 100 (or perhaps even fewer) miles when towing - a very real risk - we would just consider it a failed experiment and sell the Rivian. The thought was that a used R1S with a few thousand miles would sell for roughly what the vehicle cost us. That may have once been true, but appears less likely now given the rising interest rates and the almost certain slowing of the economy. The price of a used Rivian has been steadily dropping, and in fact, a 2023 R1T with 300 miles recently went for about $81k on one of the car auction sites. That's not much more than the pre-March price and represents a significant discount to the current MSRP. Perhaps that sale was an outlier, but the trend seems pretty clear.

Bottom line is that we're now at roughly the same decision point as you, though to be frank, I'm not willing to take a chance on the DM R1T Max. I'm strongly leaning toward taking delivery of the R1S (Rivian says this Fall) and going through with our "experiment", but that can, and perhaps will change in the coming months.

 

[SASSquatch]

@1civilengr : Your reasoning is sound. I agree with all the comments in this thread and my only advice is - you lose nothing by holding on to your reservation (except delaying the refund of the $1K) and if your situation, the economy, interest rates, etc. change, would you feel badly if you forfeited your place in line?

If you were planning on purchasing another vehicle to replace your current towing vehicle -that would be one thing. But if you are planning on sticking with what you have, my advice, if you are willing to delay the $1K deposit return, is just wait. Things could change and waiting affords you maximum flexibility.

I decided to intentionally delay my R1T order until the power tonneau cover redesign is back into production. It was a gut wrenching decision because I could have taken delivery in January of this year had I not intentionally delayed, but I am at peace with the decision. In part, because:

1. The power tonneau is too important to me of a feature for what we want to use the truck for as a would be first time truck owner
2. Rivian is continually refining the R1T and R1S. Having lived through several ICE and EV first model year vehicles, I have grown weary of being a "beta tester" which you are guaranteed to be for a new production vehicle. I have said many times on this forum that I am deeply appreciative of everyone with an R1T/R1S who is helping Rivian find and work through all these issues so I don't have to.
3. I have two capable vehicles (1 electric, the other hybrid) that currently meet our needs. I don't NEED the R1T, but like you, I was hoping that it would be our forever vehicle that will serve multiple use cases. That hope still exists, and because I am locked into pricing, and can still claim the $7500 credit since I signed Rivian's binding agreement before August 16th, 2022, I am in a position where I can afford to wait.

Good luck with your decision and let us know how you land either way.

 

[R1Sky Business]

Just go with your gut, no regrets.

 

[DuoRivians]

Not sure if being semi-retired means no income tax offset, but being an early reservation holder with presuming purchase order agreement from Aug 2022 could qualify you for the $7500 tax credit

 

[1civilengr]

Not sure if being semi-retired means no income tax offset, but being an early reservation holder with presuming purchase order agreement from Aug 2022 could qualify you for the $7500 tax credit

I signed the binding agreement and should be eligible for the tax credit. I am only 60, so I'm paying full taxes on what I take out for retirement at this point (plenty of offset!).

 

[1civilengr]

@1civilengr : Your reasoning is sound. I agree with all the comments in this thread and my only advice is - you lose nothing by holding on to your reservation (except delaying the refund of the $1K) and if your situation, the economy, interest rates, etc. change, would you feel badly if you forfeited your place in line?

If you were planning on purchasing another vehicle to replace your current towing vehicle -that would be one thing. But if you are planning on sticking with what you have, my advice, if you are willing to delay the $1K deposit return, is just wait. Things could change and waiting affords you maximum flexibility.

I decided to intentionally delay my R1T order until the power tonneau cover redesign is back into production. It was a gut wrenching decision because I could have taken delivery in January of this year had I not intentionally delayed, but I am at peace with the decision. In part, because:

1. The power tonneau is too important to me of a feature for what we want to use the truck for as a would be first time truck owner
2. Rivian is continually refining the R1T and R1S. Having lived through several ICE and EV first model year vehicles, I have grown weary of being a "beta tester" which you are guaranteed to be for a new production vehicle. I have said many times on this forum that I am deeply appreciative of everyone with an R1T/R1S who is helping Rivian find and work through all these issues so I don't have to.
3. I have two capable vehicles (1 electric, the other hybrid) that currently meet our needs. I don't NEED the R1T, but like you, I was hoping that it would be our forever vehicle that will serve multiple use cases. That hope still exists, and because I am locked into pricing, and can still claim the $7500 credit since I signed Rivian's binding agreement before August 16th, 2022, I am in a position where I can afford to wait.

Good luck with your decision and let us know how you land either way.

It definitely makes sense to just wait for now. I'm in no hurry to get back the deposit, and who knows what the future may hold!

 

[DuoRivians]

I signed the binding agreement and should be eligible for the tax credit. I am only 60, so I'm paying full taxes on what I take out for retirement at this point (plenty of offset!).

Good to hear. If you cancel the pre-order, this would mean losing out on this tax credit, so perhaps wait to make the decision… it’s basically a free option to wait

 

[Blackhatch]

Might know someone looking for one and they are in VA as well.

 

[Yossarian]

Not sure if being semi-retired means no income tax offset, but being an early reservation holder with presuming purchase order agreement from Aug 2022 could qualify you for the $7500 tax credit

Signing a preliminary buyers agreement prior to the IRA coming into effect, may or may not grandfather you into eligibilty for pre-IRA $7,500 tax credit. There have been a lot of posts by CPAs and tax attorneys on this and other Rivian forums that cast considerable doubt the agreement will pass muster with the IRS. We won't know for sure until folks file and the IRS rules on eligibility sometime this year. My guess is that the ruling won't be favorable, but I'd like to be wrong about that.

Moving forward, the IRS is slated to issue more detailed guidelines on the EV tax credit by the end of this month. Many of the pre-March Rivian orders will be under the $80k price threshold, one of the requirements under the IRA. The vehicles are built in the US, satisfying another requirement. That means that Rivian customers taking delivery of sub $80k vehicles should qualify for 50% of the tax credit ($3,750), regardless of when they take delivery. Qualifying for the remaining 50% of the credit depends on how the IRS rules on the new stricter battery guidelines and how they apply to Rivian.
edit: typo

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