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PSA: some service centers are booking four months out again

R1Tom

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It takes me a month to book out an oil change at the local Audi dealer. All the nice car dealers have similar backlogs. Whether it be Mercedes Porsche or BMW.

You can’t compare it to Toyota or Subaru. Of course those dealers are going to have way more service available because there are way more of those cars. So more cars mean more dealers and more dealers mean less service backlog.

Cars that usually only have one or two dealerships in a medium city, luxury car brands, all have similar service times to Rivian. Again, apples to apples.
I am comparing to Acura and Lexus. Both with similar price point vehicles. And both with one dealership, as they control it, in my area. That is part of their business model to ensure higher standards of service and not have dealers all have to push their pricing to the bottom. Allow a reasonable profit to sustain a higher level of service, facilities, etc...

Your nicer vehicle list are the arrogant ones. And honestly 3 brands I have not ever had interest in or owned, because I have heard their service sucks and they overcharge for everything. Not to mention at least BWM and Merc don't exactly have stellar reliability reputations.

So sure...maybe Rivian is thinking be like BMW or Merc....but I was hoping more like Acura and Lexus. And maybe I am overly optimistic they want to perform at that level at least eventually.
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R1Tom

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Can you imagine the markups that those dealerships would be charging us? No thanks.
I agree with this part....and I really wish the manufacturers would catch up again, so the dealers don't have the situation to take advantage of.
 

Donald Stanfield

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I am comparing to Acura and Lexus. Both with similar price point vehicles. And both with one dealership, as they control it, in my area. That is part of their business model to ensure higher standards of service and not have dealers all have to push their pricing to the bottom. Allow a reasonable profit to sustain a higher level of service, facilities, etc...

Your nicer vehicle list are the arrogant ones. And honestly 3 brands I have not ever had interest in or owned, because I have heard their service sucks and they overcharge for everything. Not to mention at least BWM and Merc don't exactly have stellar reliability reputations.

So sure...maybe Rivian is thinking be like BMW or Merc....but I was hoping more like Acura and Lexus. And maybe I am overly optimistic they want to perform at that level at least eventually.

It's pretty dismissive and cherry picked to ignore the fact that all these luxury car dealers I've mentioned have similar service lead times as Rivian. That is a direct contradiction to your assertion that the dealership model is superior. You don't get to cherry pick a couple dealers you personally have had good experiences with or use mass appeal dealers with obvious service advantages to make your point when again it's not about the dealership model being better but simply a more location means more service sort of deal.

The dealership model is NOT superior, and once a car has enough marketshare it will be cost effective for these companies to roll out plenty of service capacity. Toyota sells two million or more cars a year and have for many years now. Tesla is approaching those numbers and many more places are now magically seeing service centers pop up. It's not that Tesla is suddenly becoming nice guys and fixing their service, it's that they are starting sell enough cars to justify that additional service capacity.

As further proof, Lamborghini sold under 10K cars last year. Their best year ever for what it's worth. There are a handful of dealerships in the country and repairs on something like a Lamborghini routinely take 6 months or longer. The more boutique of a vehicle you get the rarer things like parts and service are going to be. It has NOTHING to do with the direct sales vs dealership model which was the argument I was replying to. I have no interest in getting into a which manufacturer is better debate as it doesn't further my point.
 

Donald Stanfield

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Also, it's worth noting that Lexus and Acura are not similar price point vehicles to the R1 series. My truck as it sits is 96K dollars. Lexus has exactly one vehicle in that price point and I don't think it sells in large volume and Acura has none unless you're counting the NSX GT3 which you really shouldn't count because it's not a high volume car and I guarantee that they cannot be serviced at just any Acura dealer anyways.
 

R1Tom

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It's pretty dismissive and cherry picked to ignore the fact that all these luxury car dealers I've mentioned have similar service lead times as Rivian. That is a direct contradiction to your assertion that the dealership model is superior. You don't get to cherry pick a couple dealers you personally have had good experiences with or use mass appeal dealers with obvious service advantages to make your point when again it's not about the dealership model being better but simply a more location means more service sort of deal.

The dealership model is NOT superior, and once a car has enough marketshare it will be cost effective for these companies to roll out plenty of service capacity. Toyota sells two million or more cars a year and have for many years now. Tesla is approaching those numbers and many more places are now magically seeing service centers pop up. It's not that Tesla is suddenly becoming nice guys and fixing their service, it's that they are starting sell enough cars to justify that additional service capacity.

As further proof, Lamborghini sold under 10K cars last year. Their best year ever for what it's worth. There are a handful of dealerships in the country and repairs on something like a Lamborghini routinely take 6 months or longer. The more boutique of a vehicle you get the rarer things like parts and service are going to be. It has NOTHING to do with the direct sales vs dealership model which was the argument I was replying to. I have no interest in getting into a which manufacturer is better debate as it doesn't further my point.
I agree Don. I likely was comparing my experience at local Acura and Lexus(and Jeep...but I have bought 3 Wranglers in 2 years, so they have been good to me...really good) dealers to my experience at Rivian service. My Lexus and Acura experience spans several decades now covering I think 7 new vehicles between them. The distribution model probably isn't the direct cause of the difference I have experienced, so you make a valid point. Rivian should be capable of performing at the same level as the dealers I have experienced, but can't or won't justify the expansion and level of service, till additional sales support it.

But...I extend my point to the fact you are correct...Rivian is in its infancy...and all potential buyers should be fully aware of what that means regarding potential wait times, vehicles sitting untouched at service centers for long periods, cost and/or time to travel to service centers when needed, rentals not being arranged per promise when setting up appointment, etc...

And like you said....until they sell alot more of them, they may not invest in expanding or increasing that capability until it can be further justified. I think it is justified now, as these reports on the forums will serve as deterants to sales, but to others it is ok if the service capability lags for a while yet.

Best and most fun vehicle I have ever owned as a daily driver for sure. Just going the service side makes some improvements pretty soon. No idea how they can possibly address the tonneau replacements with current backlogs being reported at service centers.

But you are correct.....the direct vs dealership model really isn't the cause of these shortcomings.
 

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R1Tom

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Also, it's worth noting that Lexus and Acura are not similar price point vehicles to the R1 series. My truck as it sits is 96K dollars. Lexus has exactly one vehicle in that price point and I don't think it sells in large volume and Acura has none unless you're counting the NSX GT3 which you really shouldn't count because it's not a high volume car and I guarantee that they cannot be serviced at just any Acura dealer anyways.
To this comment, I simply say it is weird that the more you spend the lower expectation for service you should have. I was not aware that vehicles that are more expensive than I purchase have such poor service records. Guess that is why I am happy at the Lexus and Acura dealers. I would say I am thinking LX compared to R1S. Not NSX...however my local dealer typically has one or two in service area, so they are definitely capable. I might actually go that route for next weekend car. Have always admired the NSX for sure.
 

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Well, you will be surprised - to book a service appointment for Honda CR-V in Austin, TX - takes literally 1-2 day's and you got it. Book the same service for BMW - 1 month+ (both dealerships). And this is a constant trend - Lincoln, BMW, Volvo - all of them are booked for at least 1 month. While Toyota, Honda, and Acura - you can get almost immediate service.

I really can not explain that other than it is more difficult for luxury brands to get technicians certified and they are very slow to react to customer demands.
 

dleewla

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what did you expect? its a new company, it takes time to build out all sorts of things including service centers. and its a new vehicle so you cant just take it in to any shop for service, at least not yet. this whole argument and complaint is silly.
 

Donald Stanfield

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To this comment, I simply say it is weird that the more you spend the lower expectation for service you should have. I was not aware that vehicles that are more expensive than I purchase have such poor service records. Guess that is why I am happy at the Lexus and Acura dealers. I would say I am thinking LX compared to R1S. Not NSX...however my local dealer typically has one or two in service area, so they are definitely capable. I might actually go that route for next weekend car. Have always admired the NSX for sure.
I'm glad you are happy with the cars you have. Yes Toyota and by extension Lexus are reliable vehicles. They use tried and true technology and they do it well. It's also boring and uninspired IMO. The NSX GT3 is cool but it probably isn't a great weekend car, because it's a half million dollars and requires your race team to purchase a 100K dollar parts package in addition.

If you can afford almost 700k before taxes for a weekend car then you are in a different price point than I am. For me a BMW M car or a Mercedes are pretty nice and have a little better styling than a Lexus which is geared towards dependability and predictability. BMW, Audi and Mercedes are usually pushing the envelope with technology and features in a way that Lexus does not and as such they will not be as reliable. There is a premium for that styling and tech that is worth the hassle to some people, and not so much to others.

Which is why the Rivian for me isn't anything out of the ordinary because when you want something unique and high tech you need to expect that it's going to break at some point. Just the cost of having something like that and the more rare and high end of a vehicle you get the more expensive it's going to be which is why the NSX requires you to purchase an additional 100K dollars in spare parts with the car.
 

R1Tom

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I'm glad you are happy with the cars you have. Yes Toyota and by extension Lexus are reliable vehicles. They use tried and true technology and they do it well. It's also boring and uninspired IMO. The NSX GT3 is cool but it probably isn't a great weekend car, because it's a half million dollars and requires your race team to purchase a 100K dollar parts package in addition.

If you can afford almost 700k before taxes for a weekend car then you are in a different price point than I am. For me a BMW M car or a Mercedes are pretty nice and have a little better styling than a Lexus which is geared towards dependability and predictability. BMW, Audi and Mercedes are usually pushing the envelope with technology and features in a way that Lexus does not and as such they will not be as reliable. There is a premium for that styling and tech that is worth the hassle to some people, and not so much to others.

Which is why the Rivian for me isn't anything out of the ordinary because when you want something unique and high tech you need to expect that it's going to break at some point. Just the cost of having something like that and the more rare and high end of a vehicle you get the more expensive it's going to be which is why the NSX requires you to purchase an additional 100K dollars in spare parts with the car.
Just a few notes.

I agree..most Lexus and Acura are boring, which is why my wife now has a lifted Rubicon. And I have a Rivian.

NSX wise I was thinking Type S or even possibly a first gen car with a manual....my passion is for a manual.

I just think that Rivian wants and needs to be more than the service level you have come to expect with the vehicles you prefer, like Merc and BMW. But maybe I am wrong.
 

RWerksman

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Im sorry - are we saying that 4 months for a vehicle service appointment is acceptable? I'd think that's pretty damn unacceptable under any circumstances.

So is 3 months.

So is 2 months.

So is a month, frankly, regardless of the manufacturer or dealer. No whataboutism needed.
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