Possible Major Security issue with Alarm system

kurtlikevonnegut

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This seems like it should be an easy fix. If truck is locked, no key is present, and no occupancy sensors are tripped the alarm sounds and screen is locked if a door is opened until an unlock command is sent via key or phone.

Thats a pretty simple logic chain to follow for programming

In general there does seem to be an issue with the "alarm" system outside of Gear Guard. Thankfully there doesn't seem to be any shortage of the sensors required to dial in the alarm system but it should be a priority before Rivians start becoming seen as low hanging fruit for opportunists.

 

timesinks

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I wasn't willing to damage the truck to test this out, but based on the video from last month it seems the alarm never went off on that truck when the window was smashed.

Granted, there are other inconsistencies about that video so who knows.
Yeah, smashing the window is harder to test. Somebody has to have a slim jim lying around though...

I'm definitely not convinced any truck has a functioning alarm. That's also perhaps not quite as bad as having complete and unfettered access to all the "locked" spaces just because you managed to get into the cab.
 

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This was my concern with the garage door opener too. If someone smashes my windows then they have access to be able to get into my garage.
 
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Khaneric

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Thats a pretty simple logic chain to follow for programming
As someone in IT I couldn't agree more, and I actually told the guy on the Reddit AMA the exact same thing, if door = locked keep screen off.

I think more of use need to voice our concern if this is more widespread.
 
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Khaneric

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This was my concern with the garage door opener too. If someone smashes my windows then they have access to be able to get into my garage.
I haven't tested this specifically but I'm sure it will let you open garage doors if you park outside.
 


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Khaneric

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I'm definitely not convinced any truck has a functioning alarm. That's also perhaps not quite as bad as having complete and unfettered access to all the "locked" spaces just because you managed to get into the cab.
And that's the key, I've had plenty of cars where the car didn't have a motion alarm or whatever. But once a door or hood or truck was opened it would go off.

If you leave a laptop in the passenger seat and someone smashes a windows and steals it without opening the door, that's on you.

But if you lock the laptop in your frunk and someone smashes the window, screen turns on, and they can open the frunk, that's on Rivian 100%.
 

kanundrum

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This was my concern with the garage door opener too. If someone smashes my windows then they have access to be able to get into my garage.

This could be a thing
 

atebit

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In the late-model cars I’ve owned, opening the door from the inside once the alarm delay timer elapsed would result in an alarm. Was the same in my Teslas. But with the R1T maybe it is the “key being present” in the guise of the phone. @Khaneric, did you have your phone on you during you tests?

Also: “Ha Ha! iPhone!” :)
 

Donald Stanfield

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Yeah I would like to know if there is a secondary sensor that detects a window being smashed whether or not the alarm goes off. This doesn't seem right I will grant that much for sure. Seems a little worrisome.
 


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Khaneric

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did you have your phone on you during you tests?
I was recording on my phone but the app was force closed, permissions removed, and Bluetooth was off. While I can't tell 100% if my phone wasn't talking to the truck, the fact that i tired to start it and it asked for the key makes me believe it wasn't.
 

dleewla

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Whoops! Definitely missed that 2nd spoiler :) and understandable that you wouldn't want to smash your own window. I do remember seeing a video making the rounds of a smash and grab and was shocked that fully breaking the glass does not trigger the alarm system. Extra bad if you can then access all locked compartments!
saw that video as well. dont understand how the glass breaking didnt trigger the alarm. does the Rivian even have an audible alarm? does the app notify you when the GG is on and triggered?
 

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Didn't see it in this thread - do you check Gear Guard videos afterward to at least see if Gary caught a video of you doing any of this? This is indeed, bad.

Editing verbiage, no I'm not an idiot: "did you check..."
 
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Khaneric

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Didn't see it in this thread - do you check Gear Guard videos afterward to at least see if Gary caught a video of you doing any of this? This is indeed, bad.
Normal gear guard was off so no videos there. Gear guard alarm was on but nothing recorded when the door or frunk were opened. I've never seen any videos under the "alarm" section of gear guard
 

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As someone in IT I couldn't agree more, and I actually told the guy on the Reddit AMA the exact same thing, if door = locked keep screen off.

I think more of use need to voice our concern if this is more widespread.
This presents an interesting use case priority thought experiment. I know you probably didn't mean to turn the screen off completely, just restrict access to certain functions, but it got me thinking.

Use cases where they may want to keep the screen on while the car is locked:
  1. Pet Mode (screen could stay on to just display the pet message, doesn't allow access to menus while locked)
  2. Lock the car while "on" while the driver runs into the score quickly but leaves his/her family in the AC/Heated car. If/when they enable on screen entertainment, or even today with just listening to music, it would be desirable to leave the screen on
I'm sure there are many others, but point is I wouldn't be surprised someone told me this was the result of not having fully defined use cases or the interactions between between use cases that use the same resources.
 

 
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