Possible Major Security issue with Alarm system

Khaneric

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So let me start out by saying a few things:

First, I don't know if this affects EVERY truck out there but I can tell you it affects the 3 I've talked to people about and I think the majority are affected.

Second, I submitted a support case with Rivian about this a month ago, also sent it to my guide, and DMed the software engineer on the reddit AMA from last month (no reply). While support has called me back a few times (only after calling them) they haven't acknowledge the issue and having provided a fix. They keep referring to it as an issue with "my truck" and they are still investigating it but I'm pretty sure it's MUCH bigger then that.

Third, I've been sitting on this hoping it would have been fixed in the latest software update but after my testing today it wasn't.

Finally, I'm a little apprehensive about posting this at all as it could leave people vulnerable (myself included), but at the same time if the issue is as big as I think it is, Rivian needs to make it priority one to fix, and the more people report it the faster that will happen.

Here is video of the issue, I'm marking it as a spoiler so hopefully it won't show up on google searches etc.


Some thoughts:

The biggest issue other then the alarm not going off is the screens turning on. This gives you full access to EVERY lockable storage area in the truck. So in theory, with one smashed window, ALL your stuff is gone.

It should also be noted that pushing the panic button on the FOB flashes the lights on the truck and nothing else. It doesn't honk at all, there are no gear guard "alarm" videos, nothing.

Watch the video, test it on your own truck, and if you have the same issue, please report it Rivian support so we can get it fixed for everyone.

 
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s12dxer

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Agree, this is bad. I'll be testing this...
 

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I can see the potential downside here but maybe I'm an idiot for not viewing this as a major security issue? I feel like the solution is to not leave your windows open when you leave your vehicle...fairly simple fix, no? Context - I'm coming from an older ICE where if I left my window open you would have the same type of access and be able to unlock the doors and get at anything in the vehicle. Is it a standard feature in newer cars, particularly EVs, to not allow access to the vehicle through open windows?

*Edited to confirm that I am, in fact, an idiot and didn't read spoiler #2 :)
 
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thrill

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I can see the potential downside here but maybe I'm an idiot for not viewing this as a major security issue? I feel like the solution is to not leave your windows open when you leave your vehicle...fairly simple fix, no? Context - I'm coming from an older ICE where if I left my window open you would have the same type of access and be able to unlock the doors and get at anything in the vehicle. Is it a standard feature in newer cars, particularly EVs, to not allow access to the vehicle through open windows?
Read the second "spolier" above.
 
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Khaneric

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s12dxer

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freshpow

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Whoops! Definitely missed that 2nd spoiler :) and understandable that you wouldn't want to smash your own window. I do remember seeing a video making the rounds of a smash and grab and was shocked that fully breaking the glass does not trigger the alarm system. Extra bad if you can then access all locked compartments!
 
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Khaneric

Khaneric

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Have you tested since today's SW update? Any changes?
Yes, just did the same test, same results with the latest software update. This is the main reason I waited, wanted to give them a chance to update it.
 
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Khaneric

Khaneric

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Whoops! Definitely missed that 2nd spoiler :) and understandable that you wouldn't want to smash your own window. I do remember seeing a video making the rounds of a smash and grab and was shocked that fully breaking the glass does not trigger the alarm system. Extra bad if you can then access all locked compartments!
That video is what made me investigate this.
 

cbuckley

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Not that this is sufficient defense, but I wonder if you would have gotten an alarm alert on your phone if BT was turned on?

Again, not saying that would solve any of these problems, and am only curious if the vehicle is interpreting any sort of an intrusion. A tow truck definitely gets the alarm's panties in a wad - would be pretty sad if this type of event didn't trigger it at all.
 


kanundrum

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Have you tried with the drivers window open just for fun? Wondering if the intern cam picks up motion and turns stuff on, not an excuse just wondering.
 
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Khaneric

Khaneric

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Not that this is sufficient defense, but I wonder if you would have gotten an alarm alert on your phone if BT was turned on?

Again, not saying that would solve any of these problems, and am only curious if the vehicle is interpreting any sort of an intrusion. A tow truck definitely gets the alarm's panties in a wad - would be pretty sad if this type of event didn't trigger it at all.
Honestly i'm not sure as I force close the Rivian app on my phone always because of the battery drain in android. I rarely use the app at all.
I saw the post from @godfodder0901 about the hood alarm and the funny thing is, he tested his own truck with the same method in the video a month ago and the alarm DIDN'T go off.

So it seems the alarm may trigger if you force the frunk open, but not if you open it from the screen that turns on when you get in the truck.

At the end of the day, if the truck is locked, the screen shouldn't turn on, period. The alarm not going off is the secondary issue.
 
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Khaneric

Khaneric

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Have you tried with the drivers window open just for fun? Wondering if the intern cam picks up motion and turns stuff on, not an excuse just wondering.
I tried a similar test with the drivers window and the same thing happened.

I've actually done a few other tests...

I got in the back seat with all windows up and locked the truck. Screens turned off. Moved around, waved, etc., alarm never went off from the internal camera. Opened the locked door from the inside and the screens came on and no alarm. It's possible that the seat sensor "felt" me and didn't set the alarm off but I have my doubts.
 

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I'm curious if this behavior is because the window was left open or if it's just the default situation. Has anyone figured out if the screens turn on:
- If the door is jimmied open?
- If the window is smashed?

Obviously this video implies these would be true, which would be really bad. But if somehow it's just not locking because the window is left open, that's bad but perhaps less bad.
 
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Khaneric

Khaneric

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- If the window is smashed?
I wasn't willing to damage the truck to test this out, but based on the video from last month it seems the alarm never went off on that truck when the window was smashed.

Granted, there are other inconsistencies about that video so who knows.
 

 
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