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Partnerships, Autonomous Driving, & Lidar

skyote

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Alright, here's what I think could be an interesting thread to start the week.

Each of Rivian's major 2019 investors have a stake in autonomous driving, lidar, or both.

Amazon - Aurora (AD)-->Blackmore (lidar)

https://singularityhub.com/2019/02/28/where-is-amazon-headed-with-its-self-driving-car-initiatives/

https://www.wired.com/story/self-driving-startup-aurora-buys-speed-sensing-lidar/

https://www.forbes.com/sites/alanoh...ra-backed-by-amazon-buys-a-laser-lidar-maker/

Ford - Argo AI (AD)-->Princeton Lightwave (lidar)

https://www.forbes.com/sites/samabu...le-down-on-lidar-acquire-princeton-lightwave/

https://www.theverge.com/2017/8/16/16155254/argo-ai-ford-self-driving-car-autonomous

Cox Automotive - Ouster (lidar)
https://ouster.com/

https://www.coxenterprises.com/news...-wheel-with-driverless-te?feed=CoxEnterprises

A couple of questions for the masses here:
- Which AD tech will Rivian use?
- Which lidar company or approach/tech would be best? Do we know what Rivian uses today?
- Do you think these partnerships could lead to catching up with Tesla on the AD front?
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electruck

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Magna's MAX4 system appears to provide the level of integration shown in the concept R1T/S vehicles and Magna would seem to be in line with Rivian choosing to partner with established automotive players for tech outside of their core competencies.

I'm a bit torn over AD and FSD. My wife is visually impaired and unable to drive herself so a FSD vehicle would really be a game changer for her. Personally, I enjoy driving and am unlikely to ever turn that over to a computer - at least not until I am no longer competent to drive. For now, I would prefer the option to skip the AD feature and pocket the $5-10k in hardware savings. However, I also realize that the data gathered from currently available systems could speed the delivery of FSD - although I do believe that level 5 is still much further away than most realize.
 

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As I previously have posted before, but I have seen these autonomous vehicles at the factory doing some testing and believe they might have some hand in the research and development in the vehicles.

Driving past the Rivian factory today I noticed 2 Lexus RX SUVs and a white Chrysler van with lots of cameras and roof racks on them, so I took photos of them as I drove past. From closer inspection all three of them had "automotivestuff - Hexagon" written on them. I had no idea what that was but they looked very similar to google or Uber autonomous vehicles with sensors and extra parts stuck on them. I googled autonomous stuff quickly, taking me to their website where it says the following: "AutonomouStuff provides the best R&D platforms, products, software, engineering services and data intelligence to aid in the advancement of robotics and autonomy. The company provides solutions for automated driving to thousands of customers worldwide, enabling the future of autonomy"
From what I could see on them as they drove by (slightly blurry in the images below) it does say on them, they are automated research development vehicles with a Lidar camera I believe on top and multiple sensors and camera attached to the front and rear bumpers.

Seems like Rivian might be taking help from Autonomous Stuff for autonomous vehicle development or use them as a supplier for their technology.

I also saw and was able to take a video of all the internals that they removed from the Mitsubishi era and looked like they were cleaning house to put back new machines and internals.

Rivian R1T R1S Partnerships, Autonomous Driving, & Lidar img_1969-


Rivian R1T R1S Partnerships, Autonomous Driving, & Lidar img_1970-


Rivian R1T R1S Partnerships, Autonomous Driving, & Lidar img_1971-


Rivian R1T R1S Partnerships, Autonomous Driving, & Lidar img_1976-


Rivian R1T R1S Partnerships, Autonomous Driving, & Lidar img_1977-
 
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skyote

skyote

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I just did a little research on AutonomouStuff & Hexagon as well. I was surprised to learn that Hexagon is a 20K employee company, and it makes me wonder how employee count & funding compare to Argo & Aurora, and whether there are different potential roles/specialties.

Rivian appears to be very smart on the engineering side of things, and I genuinely hope their software for sensors & controls are being done in a very modular and "open" way. If so, they could leverage HW/SW components from multiple, or even changing providers, and futureproof the vehicles as much as possible.
 

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Based on Rivian’s more legacy business model. I expect them to lock in the design and equipment for awhile.
 

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Cactusone

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Tesla is 5 years ahead at least. They have a billion x miles in the cloud for analysis and are anti lidar (they have deduced it’s not needed). Rivian I believe is going to do both. The future is not based on which tech but which tech is certified by the DOT. Rivian has both bases covered.
 
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skyote

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Tesla is 5 years ahead at least. They have a billion x miles in the cloud for analysis and are anti lidar (they have deduced it’s not needed). Rivian I believe is going to do both. The future is not based on which tech but which tech is certified by the DOT. Rivian has both bases covered.
All the major players except Tesla are using lidar, and it has definite advantages over cameras in many situations. The drawback has been cost, but that has already come down significantly, even without being part of mass vehicle production.

My personal feeling is that Elon is being too arrogant & will be bypassed from a safety perspective, which may become more critical than AD "features".
 

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Joel

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They are planning hardware upgrades as part of FSD. So maybe that’s another reason for the increased fee for it.
 
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They are planning hardware upgrades as part of FSD. So maybe that’s another reason for the increased fee for it.
I don't see Elon changing his tune, but who knows.

FSD HW had a significant upgrade earlier this year, but that was the FSD computer (HW3).
 
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Cactusone

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I agree that Elon’s ego may be clouding his acceptance of the new economical lidar. If the DOT requires lidar censor suite for Level 3+ then Elon May have to rethink. Time will tell. On another note Elon is sitting on a gold mine of data that he could sell to laggard companies that want to get in the game quickly.
 
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