Officially Unofficial R1T Aftermarket Accessories Discussion + Reviews

Smithery

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What's an insurance card? I don't have that or registration papers.....Glove boxes are extinct junk drawers...
I'm legitimately curious where you live that you don't have to keep your registration and proof of insurance in the car in case of a traffic stop.

 

cbuckley

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I'm legitimately curious where you live that you don't have to keep your registration and proof of insurance in the car in case of a traffic stop.
In TX, your registration is a sticker on the windshield and police can typically see insurance when they run your plates but many also have POI on their devices.
 

Smithery

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In TX, your registration is a sticker on the windshield and police can typically see insurance when they run your plates but many also have POI on their devices.
According to this video I found you still need to have your paper inspection report in the vehicle as a backup to the sticker?

And don't you still need to have proof of insurance on hand to share with other drivers in case of an accident?
 

DJG

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I'm legitimately curious where you live that you don't have to keep your registration and proof of insurance in the car in case of a traffic stop.
Several years ago, TX integrated the registration and inspection documents into just the sticker that goes on your windshield. You get your inspection, and the state can see that it passed in their database and they issue you your new sticker to replace the old. That's it. Police can scan it to instantly pull up all the relevant information.

Proof of insurance is on the app on my phone for probably the last 10 years.
 

DJG

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According to this video I found you still need to have your paper inspection report in the vehicle as a backup to the sticker?

And don't you still need to have proof of insurance on hand to share with other drivers in case of an accident?
The video says you should keep the paper in case the information isn't in the computer system. I'll pass, but appreciate their suggestion....The sticker is proof that I passed the inspection and the state approved everything. That's their problem if the computer system has a glitch.

It's much easier to do this through the phone actually. You push a button and it can send it all to a phone number or email. No more having to write it down, and they won't accidently throw it out with the fast food trash.
 


cbuckley

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According to this video I found you still need to have your paper inspection report in the vehicle as a backup to the sticker?

And don't you still need to have proof of insurance on hand to share with other drivers in case of an accident?
The last 3 times I have been pulled over (all for no front license plate over the last 4 years), I tried to hand the officer my paper proof of insurance and they told me that they didn't need it and saw my USAA coverage when they ran my license. My wife is listed as a driver on my insurance so should be covered there too. That being said, I do still have POI cards in my apple wallet and frequently have a non-expired paper copy.

I have never been asked to produce proof of inspection report and can't say that I have ever seen anyone keep that in their vehicle in TX.
 

mgc0216

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Of course you can find a spot but that's where I keep my wallet and glasses because I got tired of trying to find either in the deep dark hole of the center console. My point is we shouldn't even be having this convo -- compartmentalized/handy storage near the driver is a pretty standard expectation, let alone for a luxury car.
Registration and insurance cards are held in the center console by the elastic strap. Which is fine because I literally hope I never need to get them out. How often do you need access to these documents?

Sunglasses in under seat compartment. It's not cumbersome at all for me to retrieve and store them as needed.

Wallet sits on the charging pad if I need it, in w/ my glasses if I don't.

Center console holds my charging cable (because the wireless charger is worthless) and mask. I also have a water bottle I keep in there.

I actually think the way the storage is organized keeps me from just dumping crap into the truck. I have yet to find a home for something that I need regularly.

I do wish there were two more cup holders up front.

In the end it works for me, and what you're suggesting might not. Designers have a goal when they build a product, and those goals aren't congruent with everyone's needs and expectations. That doesn't make them a "miss" it just makes them a bad fit for some folks.
 

Smithery

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Proof of insurance is on the app on my phone for probably the last 10 years.
I'm in tech. More and more so at the crossroads of tech and law.

For your own sake, keep a piece of paper in your car for inspection, and do not use your phone for this.
 

onesoil

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Why should Rivian change their design philosophy to cater to yours, when there are plenty of options that already exist that do?? Do you demand a chimichanga at a Greek restaurant? And in this case, do you demand that after ordering baba ganoush, it be remade into a chimichanga?
Well perhaps you're a more evolved/advanced human than some of us! Or perhaps I'm missing some sarcasm and taking your comments literally... But assuming you are serious, what do you do if you get pulled over and are asked for license and registration? Or insurance in the event of some accident? In my state, you can't even get an inspection sticker without registration and insurance paperwork (I know because I'm waiting on registration to come through due to Rivian's internal disorganization). Edit: At the time of writing this I hadn't refreshed my browser to see your answer to this; my state has different requirements, which involve having multiple pieces of paper in the vehicle at all times, but I will go out on a limb and assume that's the norm, not the exception.

Why not include modular drop-in organization options for the center console, and/or some removable storage option for a more coherent use of the open center floor space? I could see an elegantly designed combined cupholder/storage drop in (like Tesla eventually made) that could let us cluttered masses have our document-storing, stuff-organizing, multi-drink-holding use of space cake, and you—superior minimalist human that you must be—eat your wide open black-hole-of-a-space cake too!

I don't think those of us critiquing Rivian's design philosophy expect that they should "cater" specifically to our wishes. But the goal with a design effort such as theirs should be to make as many potential customers as happy and excited about their product as can be reasonably achieved within the constraints of manufacturing, cost, etc. Basic things like internal storage and small item organization, effective use of space, interface/UX decisions for a brand new startup car manufacturer who hope to intelligently design a compelling and appealing product for the widest market possible that hopefully differentiates itself from other vehicles in a very crowded marketplace in part through better design should try not to step backwards in basic functionality for any easily avoidable feature and implementation categories.

The decision to not include Carplay/AA is a perfect example of Rivian making the wrong call in this area; the option could be present, while people preferring Rivian's take on infotainment wouldn't have to use it at all, but it would be available to everyone who is accustomed to direct iOS/Android integration. You may say "well if you want CarPlay so bad, then don't buy a Rivian!" but according to Apple (take that for what it's worth), 79% of new car buyers consider CarPlay to be a make-or-break feature in their buying decision. Even if that number is inflated, why not include the feature as an option?
 
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onesoil

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Registration and insurance cards are held in the center console by the elastic strap. Which is fine because I literally hope I never need to get them out. How often do you need access to these documents?

Sunglasses in under seat compartment. It's not cumbersome at all for me to retrieve and store them as needed.

Wallet sits on the charging pad if I need it, in w/ my glasses if I don't.

Center console holds my charging cable (because the wireless charger is worthless) and mask. I also have a water bottle I keep in there.

I actually think the way the storage is organized keeps me from just dumping crap into the truck. I have yet to find a home for something that I need regularly.

I do wish there were two more cup holders up front.

In the end it works for me, and what you're suggesting might not. Designers have a goal when they build a product, and those goals aren't congruent with everyone's needs and expectations. That doesn't make them a "miss" it just makes them a bad fit for some folks.
Design is always about compromises, but this set of compromises does indeed feel like a "miss" to me when they could have fairly easily made a win-win set of storage organizational design decisions that could cater to both minimalists and maximalists and anyone that lies somewhere in the middle (which is where I would place myself).

I think there is plenty of room for Rivian to design some removable modular dividers for the center console (like the $15 option on Amazon, but maybe smarter/better/nicer in some way), while leaving people who don't need the extra organization the option to remove or never install them in the first place. They could even offer this as another item in the Gear Shop.

Likewise, I think there could be an added option for central storage in the large space in front of the camp speaker. This could be at added cost—at time of purchase, or through the Gear shop as well... but instead it's just a large wasted space that doesn't serve much purchase in storing or securing anything. If that works for you, great, but there should be an option for those of us who that doesn't work for to add utility to that (seemingly wasted) space.

Now you could say: well just wait until the aftermarket makes something, to which I would reply that I think Rivian should have thought of some of these things given how important gear (and its storage) is for many in the demographic they are targeting, and the lengths they've gone through to intelligently reimagine large gear storage.
 


agame32

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I'm in tech. More and more so at the crossroads of tech and law.

For your own sake, keep a piece of paper in your car for inspection, and do not use your phone for this.
I’m curious to understand more behind this recommendation.
 

DJG

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Well perhaps you're a more evolved/advanced human than some of us! Or perhaps I'm missing some sarcasm and taking your comments literally... But assuming you are serious, what do you do if you get pulled over and are asked for license and registration? Or insurance in the event of some accident? In my state, you can't even get an inspection sticker without registration and insurance paperwork (I know because I'm waiting on registration to come through due to Rivian's internal disorganization).

Why not include modular drop-in organization options for the center console, and/or some removable storage option for a more coherent use of the open center floor space? I could see an elegantly designed combined cupholder/storage drop in (like Tesla eventually made) that could let us cluttered masses have our document-storing, stuff-organizing, multi-drink-holding use of space cake, and you—superior minimalist human that you must be—eat your wide open black-hole-of-a-space cake too!

I don't think those of us critiquing Rivian's design philosophy expect that they should "cater" specifically to our wishes. But the goal with a design effort such as theirs should be to make as many potential customers as happy and excited about their product as can be reasonably achieved within the constraints of manufacturing, cost, etc. Basic things like internal storage and small item organization, effective use of space, interface/UX decisions for a brand new startup car manufacturer who hope to intelligently design a compelling and appealing product for the widest market possible that hopefully differentiates itself from other vehicles in a very crowded marketplace in part through better design should try not to step backwards in basic functionality for any easily avoidable feature and implementation categories.

The decision to not include Carplay/AA is a perfect example of Rivian making the wrong call in this area; the option could be present, while people preferring Rivian's take on infotainment wouldn't have to use it at all, but it would be available to everyone who is accustomed to direct iOS/Android integration. You may say "well if you want CarPlay so bad, then don't buy a Rivian!" but according to Apple (take that for what it's worth), 79% of new car buyers consider CarPlay to be a make-or-break feature in their buying decision. Even if that number is inflated, why not include the feature as an option?
Registration is a sticker on my windshield since 2014. Ours works the other way around - you first get an inspection, which logs in a database that then lets you get registration online. Both are a single sticker with a barcode that an officer can scan. License is in my wallet, but the officer could look that up via the barcode on my sticker as well. Insurance is on my phone and can quickly be sent to someone else's phone or email with push of a button without transcription errors or possibility of being misplaced.

My take is that they intentionally left things a blank slate, because it allows users to customize their own space. I'll never put anything in the lower storage bin beneath the screen, I like it being an open space to place wife's purse, food, etc. Others want more cupholders there, or organization trays, or whatever. Now everyone is happy. Same for the armrest cubby. Some want an empty cavern, some want trays and can buy them. They didn't want to make those daily use decisions for people. It's quite possible that eventually they will add options of their own making to the gear shop, but that's not a focus right now.

CP/AA is its own can of worms, and I laid out my argument earlier in another thread of why I think they aren't offering it, because it's a ubiquitous commodity and it adds zero value from their perspective (it surely adds value from the perspective of many consumers, but that's not their concern). Tens of millions of people defiantly saying, "you've lost yourself a sale Rivian", is meaningless because they don't have an infinite ability to supply that demand anyway. They can match supply/demand with the current factory without an infotainment system at all. Until such time that not providing it prevents them from running factories at full capacity and achieving their goals, there is no business rationale for spending any resources on it. Legacy automakers have significantly more invested in factory capacity, and need to do everything possible to ensure they are running full output. They also make more commoditized products, with no commitment to their own infotainment development, and so can't afford to not offer it. It would give people the only reason they need to buy the GM vs. the Ford, because they are essentially the same product when you get down to it.
 

onesoil

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Wondering how many more pages we can get this thread to, complaining about the lack of storage for a single 5" x 8" slip of paper in an 8,000-lb truck... :)
These pages are stored on servers, so let's shoot for as many as we need—no console storage needed!
 

Smithery

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I’m curious to understand more behind this recommendation.
You'd usually have to have your phone be unlocked to show POI, and there are precisely zero circumstances where you should ever hand an unlocked phone to an LEO. Doing so means you're willingly handing over all contents of the phone. You might be handing it over with the intention of just looking at your POI, but legally they can then do whatever they want.

Especially in the currently evolving political climate, it's not a matter of "I have nothing to hide", but rather "They will find a reason to detain if they feel like it."

e.g. In Texas specifically, I sure hope you have no info about any pregnant friends/family members on your phone, and especially ones who were recently pregnant and are no longer.

---

At a higher level than this specific POI conversation::

While LEOs can *not* force you to give up a password to unlock your phone, they *are* legally allowed to *force you* to engage biometrics to unlock a phone (e.g. force a FaceID unlock, or force your finger onto the fingerprint sensor)

So in any encounter with an LEO, your first reaction should be to disable biometrics before they get close to the device. I'm an iOS guy, and therefore not sure of an Android analog, but see:
https://daringfireball.net/2022/06/require_a_passcode_to_unlock_your_iphone

This is not theoretical. This came up recently in the January 6th investigations:
https://daringfireball.net/linked/2022/06/28/eastman-iphone-searched
 

 
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