Is the R1T right for me?

[retart13]

I have a long commute in the midwest. About 15 days a month I commute round trip between 130-180 miles per day (about 2/7 days are 180 commute). I currently have a reservation for an R1T max pack (400+ miles?). Assuming at 80-90% charge with a worst case scenario reduction of 30% in winter driving, I should have about ~220 miles of range. I normally cruise on the highway at 80 mph, but will likely slow it down to a minimum of 70-75 mph. Unfortunately, there is no parked charging options as of now at work. My main concern is 180 mile roundtrip in adverse weather conditions...I assume I will probably need to stop on my way home. Otherwise, I plan on an L2 charger at home between shifts.

Here are my main concerns:
-battery degradation....on my worst days, I may use most of the battery. Will this affect me long term? See my next point
-I drive ALOT...about 32,000 miles/year (not necessarily by choice, and should decrease over the years.) I imagine I would have to charge to 90% which is less than the daily recommended 66%? I'd ideally like to get a good 4-5 years out of the truck before upgrading.
-this could theoretically get a lot better if we find out more with the "conserve" mode.

Should I wait until the battery technology matures in say 5 years before buying an EV. It seems like we are still some ways away from replacing ICE highway miles efficiency/range. That being said, I could save a good amount of money from gas and also drive a sick car. And I know before anyone else says it, the obvious economic answer would be a Honda hybrid vs Tesla M3 for work.

Is there any other points I am missing?

Thanks!

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[thrill]

I think the R1T would be fine for your scenario, especially if it's as comfortable as various people have described. The 5 year lifespan you want is well within the battery warranty. Since you're thinking you'll just roundtrip it and charge at home that's going to be fairly low stress on the battery anyway. Also, if you find yourself struggling for range, the vehicle is likely going to be easily resold.

Edit: Also, if you start out with a warm battery and there's any 120v power at your destination you'll be able to keep the battery from getting cold and probably not lose that 30%, which is as you probably realize only a guess anyway and likely not so severe with Rivian's attention to its BMS.

 

[SeaGeo]

I wouldn't be worried about more than say 10% degradation over the lifetime. That's probably representative of a reasonably conservative representative value.

Tbh, I'd be more worried about wind and snow than anything. Those two things will really hose your range. Have you tried playing with ABRP and simulating some scenarios and playing with weather conditions? I suspect you'd be fine most of the time.

If you do, I'd modify their 65mph value to around 2mi/kWh. What they have seems a bit low compared to EPA highway.

Mind if I ask where you live? Have you checked for DCFC chargers on your route?

 

[retart13]

There may be a chance I can try an extension cord and 120V charge during my shift on those long commute days/cold days.

I live near Detroit/Toledo area. There are some DCFCs and looks like plans to increase more(?). I think Rivian plans to install one of their own in the area as well. Overall I think I will be ok, but again this is my first hoorah into EVs and I am not 100% familiar with range and planning trips.

 

[SeaGeo]

[Got it TE="retart13, post: 53055, member: 3432"]
There may be a chance I can try an extension cord and 120V charge during my shift on those long commute days/cold days.

I live near Detroit/Toledo area. There are some DCFCs and looks like plans to increase more(?). I think Rivian plans to install one of their own in the area as well. Overall I think I will be ok, but again this is my first hoorah into EVs and I am not 100% familiar with range and planning trips.
[/QUOTE]
Got it. Personally I'd feel totally fine with the max pack. I'd probably feel ok with the large park as well.

You should Play with abetterrouteplanner. It will give you a reasonable idea if what to expect.

 

[nukem384]

I have a long commute in the midwest. About 15 days a month I commute round trip between 130-180 miles per day (about 2/7 days are 180 commute). I currently have a reservation for an R1T max pack (400+ miles?). Assuming at 80-90% charge with a worst case scenario reduction of 30% in winter driving, I should have about ~220 miles of range. I normally cruise on the highway at 80 mph, but will likely slow it down to a minimum of 70-75 mph. Unfortunately, there is no parked charging options as of now at work. My main concern is 180 mile roundtrip in adverse weather conditions...I assume I will probably need to stop on my way home. Otherwise, I plan on an L2 charger at home between shifts.

Here are my main concerns:
-battery degradation....on my worst days, I may use most of the battery. Will this affect me long term? See my next point
-I drive ALOT...about 32,000 miles/year (not necessarily by choice, and should decrease over the years.) I imagine I would have to charge to 90% which is less than the daily recommended 66%? I'd ideally like to get a good 4-5 years out of the truck before upgrading.
-this could theoretically get a lot better if we find out more with the "conserve" mode.

Should I wait until the battery technology matures in say 5 years before buying an EV. It seems like we are still some ways away from replacing ICE highway miles efficiency/range. That being said, I could save a good amount of money from gas and also drive a sick car. And I know before anyone else says it, the obvious economic answer would be a Honda hybrid vs Tesla M3 for work.

Is there any other points I am missing?

Thanks!

I don't think you'll have any problem with the large pack. On those cold days, you might be cutting it close though. But what I'd do is wait until the truck comes out and gets into reviewers hands so we can see real world numbers on the range. EPA estimates don't really mean much of anything. Depending on how Rivian submitted their numbers, it could be like Tesla where there's no way you're hitting your EPA numbers, ever. Or it could be like legacy auto (VW, Porsche to name a few) that exceed the EPA numbers by a lot. My first thought is that they won't be shady like Tesla, and that it'll be more in line with legacy auto where you can hit EPA numbers easy.

That said, the 66% is really just a sweet spot. If you have that luxury, that's where you'd want to charge it every day for maximum longevity of the battery. In reality though, charging to 90% every day is not going to hurt the battery. There's still plenty of room for those electrons to move around and you should be fine. You could easily have this truck for 5 years with the mileage you're putting on it. I'm sure Rivian's battery tech is up to par with Tesla's, and the old 2170 batteries that are in the 3/Y now are rated to go 250k.

If all else fails, and you're worried, then just get the max pack and you shouldn't have any range anxiety at all. I would actually recommend this considering how much you're going to be driving the car and your distances. It'll give you the most peace of mind, even in the winter when it's cold. You won't have to worry about it as long as the car is charged up to 90% in the mornings.

 

[McMoo]

with a worst case scenario reduction of 30% in winter driving

I don’t think Rivian will be as bad as Tesla in this regard just by doing the math. If it takes 3 kw per hour to run the heat, that’s 4% of the model 3 battery pack. Whereas for a Rivian, it may only be 2% of the pack. So the mileage losses from using the cabin heat should be reduced in the Rivian. Also, perhaps Rivian could free up some battery capacity in the winter if they have a big buffer. The two factors killing range are less energy density in cold, and heater use. Tesla has relatively small buffers so this would never be an option for them.

 

[retart13]

I don’t think Rivian will be as bad as Tesla in this regard just by doing the math. If it takes 3 kw per hour to run the heat, that’s 4% of the model 3 battery pack. Whereas for a Rivian, it may only be 2% of the pack. So the mileage losses from using the cabin heat should be reduced in the Rivian. Also, perhaps Rivian could free up some battery capacity in the winter if they have a big buffer. The two factors killing range are less energy density in cold, and heater use. Tesla has relatively small buffers so this would never be an option for them.

I think you have a valid point....it seems like Tesla was designed with it's ideal driving environment either in SoCal or somewhere in the SW US. Rivian on the other hand was purposefully tested in all environments. I have to imagine it will not be as bad.

 

[Big_Ike]

First, I think you'd be fine with the max pack and the scenario you describe. I think there is some great advice above.
I wouldn't be afraid to ask your employer if they would consider installing a few level 2 chargers in your parking area. To get a head start, you may want to research your employers local electric utility as they may have incentives for business charging installations.

 

[PastyPilgrim]

Seems like a perfect use-case for a Rivian. It's very comfortably within range, you'll save a ton of money on fuel given how much you drive, Rivian is offering a stellar battery warranty that should have you covered for degradation (though fine print and how difficult Rivian makes battery claims remains to be seen), etc.

Also agree with @McMoo that cold weather perf may not be that bad. Doesn't the R1T have like double the battery of a model y? My intuition is that the effect of cold weather wouldn't scale with battery capacity (meaning the effect would be a smaller percentage of your battery with a larger capacity). We'll have to wait for the winter to find out, but I'd guess that with such a large battery that the effect of cold would be buffered.

Further, EVs are only going to grow, so it's feasible that your destination will have chargers in the near future (you could even campaign for them as suggested above).

 

[retart13]

Do you guys think given the amount of highway miles I will drive, it is worth the decrease in range for the 20s? That's a worst case reduction of 60 miles, which is no joke.

 

[SeaGeo]

Do you guys think given the amount of highway miles I will drive, it is worth the decrease in range for the 20s? That's a worst case reduction of 60 miles, which is no joke.

Honestly, we all need to wait and see what real world range is in the highway. I have a hint that we will end up at about 300 miles with the 20s with a "range" mode. But we will have to see. That's mostly speculation mixed with some amount of information (like the MT article).

 

[crashmtb]

Block heater p

Do you guys think given the amount of highway miles I will drive, it is worth the decrease in range for the 20s? That's a worst case reduction of 60 miles, which is no joke.

i think if you’re looking to squeeze out the most range, the most efficient wheel/tire combo should be your first choice - the standard 21” all seasons.

 

[DucRider]

Do you guys think given the amount of highway miles I will drive, it is worth the decrease in range for the 20s? That's a worst case reduction of 60 miles, which is no joke.

Everyone has to balance of trading range for performance (on road with the 22s or off road with the 20s).

If "Range is King" for your use case, then you are unlikely to want to make that trade.

My prediction - at a steady 65 mph in dry weather with no wind at about 70 degrees on flat terrain you will get about 85-90% of the unadjusted efficiency returned by the EPA test on the hwy portion.

Change any of those variables and the result will change - speed being the easiest for the owner to control.
As others have pointed out, heat usage in winter will very likely carry a lower range % penalty than the most efficient EVs. If your EV is sipping from the pack, adding in a heat draw is a significant bump - if it's already gulping electrons, adding a heat load will be less noticeable. The Rivian leans a lot more towards gulping than sipping.

 

[YamaLink]

I assume I will probably need to stop on my way home.

I believe this would be a dealbreaker for many (most?). I've got too many other things in life to do beside stop after work just to get home. Day after day after...
If I was in your shoes, the anxiety of cold winter range for work use would have me waiting a few years. For me it'd be like starving college student days all over again; staring at the gas gauge as I drove by yet another station.
But if a L2 charger was at work then all of this is moot.
FWIW, my 2021 M3 AWD LR, with improved heat pack, will go 185 miles in the dead of winter factoring in range loss. I would not buy my Tesla if I had your winter commute. I'd be in a Toyota Rav 4 Hybrid which my nephew is getting better than EPA claim.

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