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Had my First Drive... very impressed, but will now almost certainly cancel my pre-order.

onthebrake

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About a month ago I got to see and drive the R1T for the first time, and was super impressed with the entire package. It is beautiful piece of technology and I am sure many people will make many happy memories with the vehicle. However, the experience helped cement my opinion that the R1T doesn't quite fit my needs/use case, for two reasons:

The first reason is the least significant, but perhaps the most surprising. As I said, I think the R1T is a wonderful piece of technology. But it didn't feel much like a machine ā€“ between the UI and the inherent nature of all EV's, its mechanical character felt hidden from me. It made me realize that EV's are perhaps destined to become disposable consumer products that people switch out every few years, like a new iPhone. People generally have very little emotional attachment to their *actual* phones, only to the content and apps on them. And I wonder if that is what it will be like in an EV world. Very different than how I feel about "Blubicon", my Jeep Rubicon 392, which is like a member of the family and will never be replaced.

The second reason is really the point for this post (to ask advice from current owners about snowy highway driving). I need a vehicle to comfortably and safely get me from NYC to the Adirondacks every weekend, which is a 240 mile 4-hour drive up I-87. Now, it seems like I-87 is frequently unplowed when I drive it (Fri night or Sat morning), and several stretches have high winds. The winter temp is often in the single digits or below. Over the past two years, I have had several butt-clenching moments when my vehicle started sliding at highway speeds. One time I got pushed sideways by the wind across two icy lanes, at 50 mph, and only just managed to catch it before hitting the curb. It's scary enough in an ICE SUV or the Jeep (with snow tires). The thought of such a slide in a 7000lb R1T (with more torque and less feedback) terrifies me. Surface streets don't scare me because the speeds are so manageable. But snowy/icy/windy highways... ugh.

So my question before I cancel the order is whether any of the Colorado owners have experience driving the R1T in terrible conditions on the highway? Does the extra weight/momentum help or hurt?

btw, if I do cancel, I would be happy to explore ways to pass on my pre-price-hike reservation to someone. Not sure if it is possible/allowed. But if so, it might save someone some money.
You didn't drive it long enough to get the feel. I have driven almost 3k miles in the last 10 weeks of ownership and am now starting to really get the feel for it. You're really missing out if you give up now . . .
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ajdelange

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Coasting with OPD seems like it would be a challenge unless (until?) Rivian offers a mode or feature to permit this.
All they need to do is add an instantaneous power meter (I can't believe they don't have this now). Coasting is then a matter of feathering the accelerator to keep the power draw at 0.
 

ads75

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I don't have any experience with a 392 or a R1T, but I would guess just about anything would be better in windy/gusty conditions than a Wrangler.
 

SoCal Rob

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All they need to do is add an instantaneous power meter (I can't believe they don't have this now). Coasting is then a matter of feathering the accelerator to keep the power draw at 0.
So someone is driving in treacherous icy conditions and you want them to keep their eyes on an instantaneous power meter rather than on the road in front of them?

If our goal is for technology to assist the driver then there should be a way to coast or otherwise account for the very low friction surface while in a snow/ice mode or similar. Expecting people to keep their eyes on a non-primary gauge in some of the worst driving conditions does not sound like an improvement or effective use of technology to me.
 

ajdelange

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So someone is driving in treacherous icy conditions and you want them to keep their eyes on an instantaneous power meter rather than on the road in front of them?
No. I want them to include the power meter in their scan just as one does with a speedometer. It isn't a particularly onerous task if the power meter is where it should be i.e. right in front of the driver.

In truth I made the comment about the power meter mostly for for exegesis. In fact one quickly learns how to set the pedal for coast mostly by feel. He checks the power meter occasionally to see if he is in truth coasting mostly out of curiosity but the main sensor when driving in slippery conditions is the seat of the pants. By the time you see you are skidding it's too late.

If our goal is for technology to assist the driver then there should be a way to coast or otherwise account for the very low friction surface while in a snow/ice mode or similar.
As I think someone already pointed out you can't beat the Rivians for torque vectoring. They have done quite a bit of cold climate testing and while I am sure improvements will be made to their algorithms over time I expect they handle slippery conditions about as well as they can be. Now black ice is a different matter. There just isn't much you can do. With 0 coefficient of friction you can't apply any forces to the vehicle and you can't control it.


Expecting people to keep their eyes on a non-primary gauge in some of the worst driving conditions does not sound like an improvement or effective use of technology to me.
Power is not "secondary" IMO. That's why I am so shocked that Rivian doesn't display it right up there with speed. Second, no one is suggesting that a driver fix on the power meter any more than he fix on any other instrument. It would be unsafe and it's not necessary. We hope you will come to understand better when you get your truck.
 

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SoCal Rob

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No. I want them to include the power meter in their scan just as one does with a speedometer. It isn't a particularly onerous task if the power meter is where it should be i.e. right in front of the driver.
If the driver has to rely on an instantaneous power meter to prevent wheel slip from acceleration or braking then the driver has to continuously monitor that instantaneous power meter. The level of accuracy required by OPD on a very low friction surface dictates this unless there is another way to coast. Hopefully that explains my understanding and perspective better.

In truth I made the comment about the power meter mostly for for exegesis. In fact one quickly learns how to set the pedal for coast mostly by feel. He checks the power meter occasionally to see if he is in truth coasting mostly out of curiosity but the main sensor when driving in slippery conditions is the seat of the pants. By the time you see you are skidding it's too late.
By the time you can feel youā€™re skidding it can also be too late. If you can see that youā€™re on a slippery surface your best option may be to coast and preserve what little traction you have for steering.

As I think someone already pointed out you can't beat the Rivians for torque vectoring. They have done quite a bit of cold climate testing and while I am sure improvements will be made to their algorithms over time I expect they handle slippery conditions about as well as they can be.
I hope thatā€™s correct. From what I saw in the snow driving video from @OutofSpecKyle Iā€™m not sure that the vehicle is currently ready for winter driving by people used to traditional (two pedal + ability to coast without actively managing the process) driving.

Now black ice is a different matter. There just isn't much you can do. With 0 coefficient of friction you can't apply any forces to the vehicle and you can't control it.
This explains my desire for the ability to passively coast.

Power is not "secondary" IMO. That's why I am so shocked that Rivian doesn't display it right up there with speed.
I havenā€™t spent a lot of time behind the wheel of a Rivian so Iā€™m assuming that the gauge or meter is presented in the display as secondary and less prominent than, say, the speed.

Second, no one is suggesting that a driver fix on the power meter any more than he fix on any other instrument. It would be unsafe and it's not necessary.
Again, if the driver has no other way of coasting other than relying on an instantaneous power meter to prevent wheel slip from acceleration or braking then the driver has to continuously monitor that instantaneous power meter. We do agree since I also think that is unsafe and why I disagree with your premise that this is a reasonable real-world solution.

We hope you will come to understand better when you get your truck.
I doubt that you consulted with anyone else before writing this so Iā€™m not sure who ā€œweā€ is in your mind. I wish that you could communicate with people in a way which is less condescending. You seem to assume that your way is right, everyone else is wrong, and if others disagree then they simply donā€˜t understand. I think that you are intelligent enough that you can communicate WHY you think youā€™re correct more effectively, less confrontationally, and without the crutch of using more unusual words or phrases in what appears to be an attempt to lend more weight to what youā€˜re writing. From my perspective as someone raised by educators, when you use a needlessly-complex word or phrase you donā€™t necessarily impress people and this potentially undermines your message or credibility when you use an unusual phrase or word incorrectly. More explanation and less attitude will probably do a better job of convincing people that youā€™re correct. Thanks for taking the time to consider this.
 

zefram47

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Power is not "secondary" IMO. That's why I am so shocked that Rivian doesn't display it right up there with speed.
It is right next to the speed...the gray arc on the right. While it could probably be a little more prominent, the one on my MINI is huge and I rarely look at it in-practice. Kinda like learning to drive stick without a tachometer, you just get a feel for it over time.

Rivian R1T R1S Had my First Drive... very impressed, but will now almost certainly cancel my pre-order. 1655312098547

Rivian R1T R1S Had my First Drive... very impressed, but will now almost certainly cancel my pre-order. 1655312167153
 
 




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