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Education on Nema 14-50 (50 amp) plug vs 60 amp hardwire

Jyeh74

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So I have been reading up on the typical NEMA 14-50 plug that most EV owners get. I don’t know why exactly it’s called a plug but the 60 amp is called hardwire. I’m assuming the NEMA 14-50 is a lot cheaper than the 60 amp? At a 135 kW R1S battery, these 2 options are, I believe, a difference of 2 hours.

Does the “plug” mean you can take it to any Tesla charging station and charge it there whereas a 60 amp is dedicated and needs to be installed differently and only for your home, hence the term “hardwire”?
I have the $400 wall charger added to my order but if the cost of installation of the 60 amp circuit to fully realize this extra 25 miles per hour charge is cost prohibitive, I may just go with the NEMA 14-50 installation, like most people do, even if it’s slightly slower to fully charge.

I may also get a hybrid car which only charges at 7.2 kWh vs the Rivian which charges at 11.1 kWh. So not sure which setup is best.
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MoreTrout

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Hardwired means there is no outlet to plug something into. The EVSE is connected directly to the wire that runs to your panel. The NEMA 14-50 is an outlet. You have the male end of the plug from your EVSE to plug into it. That makes it portable since you can plug and unplug it. The max you can run on it is 40A. If you have a need to charge at two locations, then the NEMA 14-50 outlet at both locations and a portable EVSE is a good solution. If you have only one location to do home charging, then a hardwired fixed EVSE can deliver a slightly faster rate of charge as it can deliver up to 48A for the Rivian.
Cost will primarily be determined by how much if any upgrades are needed to your electrical panel, and how far the EVSE/14-50 will be from the panel. The wire required for a hardwire is more expensive than the 6/3 required for a 14-50.
I put NEMA 14-50s in my home garage and at my camp. At home, I had them run the wire from a subpanel in the garage that could support a hardwired EVSE if I decide to upgrade in the future. I think it was about 20 ft of wire. Total bill from the electrician was around $850. It was about 50/50 supplies/labor At the camp, it was a DIY - or more accurately a FDIY - Friend DIY who at least knew what he was doing. I think the 6/3 wire I bought was around $6/ft and needed about 20 feet. Labor was a couple of 12 packs of Twisted Tea
 

DB-EV

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The long and short is that the plug in allows you to draw 40 amps; the hardwire allows you to draw 48(?) amps. Each needs to be on a larger circuit: plug in 50 amp breaker; hardwire 60 amp breaker.

The benefit of plug in is you can easily take your 'charger' (EVSE) with you; the cost is it is 20 percent or so slower.

The benefit fo the hardwired 'charger' is that it charges close to 20 percent faster (getting you to the 11.2 kw the truck can take) but the cost is that it is hardwired into your electric - you can't take the 'charger' to a weekend house, etc.

There are a fair amount of posts about this, and I may be off slightly on the numbers, but this is the basics.

I have gone back and forth on whether to plug or hardwire. For now I am at hardwire.
 

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There are a good number of posts about all the various configurations, depending on your situation and needs. I decided to go with the 50amp circuit and 40amp Juicebox w/14-50 receptacle. There was 2 reasons and 1 justification. I justified that I don’t need the added charging speed. We shall see if/when I get the truck. The reasons: 1. I had a partial spool of #8 3-wire I saved from a home AC install about 20 years ago., 2. I wanted the option of plugging in a welder or other 240v tool/appliance and unplugging the Level 2 charger makes that possible. That’s similar to the portable EVSE scenarios DB-EV mentioned. If not for those considerations the hardwire install is probably a good default if you are hiring an electrician anyway. I did my install.
 

EVTrukHog

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Previous owner of my house had a 10-30 receptacle installed in corner of garage. Curious about why? There is an interior laundry room with clothes dryer so no need for garage clothes dryer.

In any case, I’ll plan to get a 14-50 to 10-30 adapter to utilize until I get hardwired charger installed. Assume this will be a bit faster than 120V receptacle…
 

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Jyeh74

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Most of my neighbors paid around $500-700 for their Nema 14-50 but they all own Teslas. Is Rivian the only one that needs a faster 60 amp breaker since it can handle up to 11.1 kW? Are Teslas not as fast charging?

A friend told me if I am going with Nema 14-50, to request specifically for a Hubble plug since it’s higher quality and not worth going with cheaper quality brands. Anyone else disagree?

Some people paid more for a permit but I never understood why you need a permit?
 

godfodder0901

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Some people paid more for a permit but I never understood why you need a permit?
Many municipalities require a licensed electrician to install EVSE to ensure it is done in a start and code compliant manner. Having this equipment installed without the required inspection could lead to fines and other repercussions depending on local laws. In many states, like my state of WA, the electrician is responsible to pull the permit and the fee is built into the overall cost of the install anyway.
 

JoulesVerne

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One wrinkle here is that Rivian's included portable EVSE can only charge at 32 amps. So if you install a 14-50 outlet and expect to charge at 40 amps you'll have to buy another portable EVSE at around $300-$400.

Since the cost difference between installing an outlet + portable EVSE and a hardwired EVSE are negligible I would go with the faster charging speed. If you get a second EV you will appreciate it when both are dependent on charging speed. Also, over many years the time saved continues to add up, where as the installation/purchased cost is a one time expense.
 
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Jyeh74

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So would you guys install a Nema 14-50 and the Rivian wall charger? Or would you just buy a clipper creek splitter so it’s shared circuit?
 

Revelation

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So would you guys install a Nema 14-50 and the Rivian wall charger? Or would you just buy a clipper creek splitter so it’s shared circuit?
You would typically install a NEMA 14-50 if you were going to use the mobile connector. If you want to go with the Wall Connector then you will want to hardwire it.

*NOTE* I know there are other ways to do this, but it is not recommended and not up to code in most locations.
 

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Jyeh74

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Correct, but do you guys think it makes sense to have both or is it overkill? Don’t know if there will be a need to simultaneously need two chargers
 

Revelation

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Correct, but do you guys think it makes sense to have both or is it overkill? Don’t know if there will be a need to simultaneously need two chargers
Overkill. If you end up needing a second down the road, hardwire another wall connector in.
 
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Jyeh74

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But then that’s having two dedicated circuits vs splitting one circuit with a clipper creek? Curious what people eventually do that’s more cost effective if they need two chargers.
 

CommodoreAmiga

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But then that’s having two dedicated circuits vs splitting one circuit with a clipper creek? Curious what people eventually do that’s more cost effective if they need two chargers.
If you have the capacity in your panel for two hardwired EVSEs then I prefer that. That's the route I'll go. Two dedicated EVSEs provide flexibility in mounting locations and are typically cheaper than a single EVSE with dual J1772 connectors. You also gain redundancy if one fails you still have a working one to use.

But there is no always-right solution. You need to consider factors unique to your situation to determine what is best for you.
 

shrink

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If you have the capacity in your panel for two hardwired EVSEs then I prefer that. That's the route I'll go. Two dedicated EVSEs provide flexibility in mounting locations and are typically cheaper than a single EVSE with dual J1772 connectors. You also gain redundancy if one fails you still have a working one to use.

But there is no always-right solution. You need to consider factors unique to your situation to determine what is best for you.
The Grizzl-E Duo is actually relatively inexpensive (especially as compared to the Clipper Creek dual J1772 unit, which is also likely much more robust. Clipper Creek makes good products) and would be cheaper than buying two EVSE's. It would require only one circuit that would share 40 amps and comes with either a 14-50 or 6-50 plug.

While I don't have any experience with this unit, I like the price, and flexibility. In a garage, I personally prefer an EVSE plugged into a 14-50 because if the EVSE has a malfunction, one can still use the mobile unit to charge using the 14-50 outlet. In a hardwired situation, you're stuck waiting for a repair and may only have access to L1 charging in the meantime.

https://grizzl-e.com/product/usa/duo/grizzl-e-duo/

That said, I personally have two outdoor EVSE's hardwired on separate circuits at my primary residence.
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