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Rivian_Hugh_III

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Whoever solves self-driving will almost certainly sell a version to the rest of the world, perhaps not the whole package but then again maybe the whole package for a high price. They’ll effectively own the future in that case and make a true mint.

Therefore, I can see why Rivian would want to join the race, possibly with a unique approach that they think might pan out before others’.

In any case, Rivian licensing someone else’s full self driving is a good possibility, should that breakthrough happen. I wouldn’t be at all surprised to hear Rivians employ Tesla’s self driving software in 2030+ vehicles. Tesla is surely the odds on favorite to win this particular race, if it’s at all winnable that is.
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Eric9610

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Whoever solves self-driving will almost certainly sell a version to the rest of the world, perhaps not the whole package but then again maybe the whole package for a high price. They’ll effectively own the future in that case and make a true mint.

Therefore, I can see why Rivian would want to join the race, possibly with a unique approach that they think might pan out before others’.

In any case, Rivian licensing someone else’s full self driving is a good possibility, should that breakthrough happen. I wouldn’t be at all surprised to hear Rivians employ Tesla’s self driving software in 2030+ vehicles. Tesla is surely the odds on favorite to win this particular race, if it’s at all winnable that is.
MB already solved it the current S class and E class in ICE and electric versions are the only level 3 fully autonomous approved consumer systems available for sale and use today. Requires a lot of lidar sensors. All the current systems from Tesla and others that don't use lidar will never achieve level 3 FSD. This is why Tesla is testing integration of lidar sensors.

How pissed are people who own Teslas going to be when they only have supervised FSD not Level 3 due to hardware. LOL. Wait for the lawsuits, the latest Tesla software added in the verbiage of supervised.
 

Rivian_Hugh_III

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MB already solved it the current S class and E class in ICE and electric versions are the only level 3 fully autonomous approved consumer systems available for sale and use today. Requires a lot of lidar sensors. All the current systems from Tesla and others that don't use lidar will never achieve level 3 FSD. This is why Tesla is testing integration of lidar sensors.

How pissed are people who own Teslas going to be when they only have supervised FSD not Level 3 due to hardware. LOL. Wait for the lawsuits, the latest Tesla software added in the verbiage of supervised.
I figured Tesla went from LiDAR to vision-only precisely so they could license the system to everyone on earth. I don’t follow super closely; you’re saying Tesla is adding LiDAR Again? If I were to defend my conjecture I’d say the Lidar would be to help train the data brought in from cameras, with the goal of camera-only, but I’m really not sure. One way or another they’re definitely going for the gold ring.
 

R1SFamilyGuy

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Rivian should MobileEye and force them out of the restrictions. Problem solved. You're all very welcome.

/s
 

BlueNoles97

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Can Rivian turn the Mobile Eye camera into a dumb camera and not use the SOC and perception stack from Mobile Eye? If they can't then what is the point of the Nivida computer?
 

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allisgoodman

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I am curious why Rivian is not advertising the new MobbileEye system. It's an upgrade from previous gen after all.
 
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MrMusAddict

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I am curious why Rivian is not advertising the new MobbileEye system. It's an upgrade from previous gen after all.
They would have you believe Rivian is providing the features. Technically, they *are* advertising it by showcasing RAP+ (which is what the new MobilEye provides).
 

zymolysis

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a double downward click activates Driver+
Incorrect - a double down click activates "Highway Assist" (which is one of the many features of Driver+). Driver+ is always active. A single down click activates ACC, which is available most of the time (perhaps not when a trailer is attached). Highway Assist is only available on certain mapped highways, and not in construction zones, etc.
https://rivian.com/support/article/what-features-are-included-in-rivian-driver
 
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Tangarg

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I value safety in a car a lot. I bought my R1S after Tesla as they claimed an impressive array of sensors (10 exterior cameras, 12 ultrasonic sensors, 5 radars) and I was somehow under the impression that they use this for the safety features.

Are you saying that in reality, Gen 1 vehicles are relying only on a single forward-facing camera for their driver assistance features? What are the sensors doing then exactly? Just providing a 360* view?
 
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MrMusAddict

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I value safety in a car a lot. I bought my R1S after Tesla as they claimed an impressive array of sensors (10 exterior cameras, 12 ultrasonic sensors, 5 radars) and I was somehow under the impression that they use this for the safety features.

Are you saying that in reality, Gen 1 vehicles are relying only on a single forward-facing camera for their driver assistance features? What are the sensors doing then exactly? Just providing a 360* view?

The forward facing camera AND the forward facing sensors are being used for driver assistance.

The 360° camera appears to only be used for the camera app in the vehicle, and gear guard.

The 360° sensors are only being used for parking proximity, blind spot monitoring, and presumably also gear guard.
 

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Tangarg

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The forward facing camera AND the forward facing sensors are being used for driver assistance.

The 360° camera appears to only be used for the camera app in the vehicle, and gear guard.

The 360° sensors are only being used for parking proximity, blind spot monitoring, and presumably also gear guard.
I really think that's deceiving marketing on their end. I am sure there are many others who felt that the whole suite of sensors and cameras were being used for driver's assist and not just gear guard which itself has a very unreliable detection.
Rivian should either switch to using the full hardware similar to their plan for gen 2 or provide a way to upgrade to new hardware for a fees.

We don't need to have the latest features for self driving from gen 2 but at least safety features and accident prevention ones should be there.
 
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MrMusAddict

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I really think that's deceiving marketing on their end. I am sure there are many others who felt that the whole suite of sensors and cameras were being used for driver's assist and not just gear guard which itself has a very unreliable detection.
Rivian should either switch to using the full hardware similar to their plan for gen 2 or provide a way to upgrade to new hardware for a fees.

We don't need to have the latest features for self driving from gen 2 but at least safety features and accident prevention ones should be there.
Yeah, Gen2 is compatible with (but not currently capable of):

  • Front/Rear collision avoidance
  • Evasive maneuver assist
  • Accelerating to prevent cut-ins

I've not owned a Tesla, only heard stories of their accident avoidance. If these are features offered on the base Autopilot (even in a limited capacity), then yeah it's quite frustrating to know Gen1 won't be getting them.

We DO have front-collision avoidance at the very least, but that's not saying much since that's mandatory since 2022.
 

Tangarg

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Yeah, Gen2 is compatible with (but not currently capable of):

  • Front/Rear collision avoidance
  • Evasive maneuver assist
  • Accelerating to prevent cut-ins

I've not owned a Tesla, only heard stories of their accident avoidance. If these are features offered on the base Autopilot (even in a limited capacity), then yeah it's quite frustrating to know Gen1 won't be getting them.

We DO have front-collision avoidance at the very least, but that's not saying much since that's mandatory since 2022.
Yes, that's exactly what i perceived when i bought the gen 1 earlier. It is a perfect car for me and i don't want any fancy features from gen 2. But safety features are important from everyone. Thinking to start a petition for this.
 

922110

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This is a superb write up, thank you.

I am glad I waited for gen 2. The gen 1 promises were hopelessly optimistic. I don't see Rivian offering a superior solution to Mobileye given their relatively small volumes. That is unless they partner with someone (like VW who does have the capital, scale, and resources to do it).

Pretty sure VW is also using Mobileye, as is BMW. Wouldn't it make more sense for them to all work together on this and pool resources, rather than falling behind with half baked attempts?
 

mpshizzle

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Based on some of the things that they were talking about and showing during the investor day, it's very clear that they are working as fast as they can to use their own Nvidia computer and move away from mobile eye.

They talked a lot about how they're gathering fleet data for autonomous functions. Given that mobile eye is an off-the-shelf product, they have no need to collect fleet data to support that system. The screenshots they showed for data collection also included a lot of City driving. Another use case not optimized for mobile eye.

Hopefully this means they make the switch to their own software and hardware stock sooner than later
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