Driver+/Autonomy cannot be trusted in heavy traffic – just got into an accident with a slow merging truck

[AdventureTravel]

The self driving is getting better but with Rivian you do have to be careful and pay attention.

Coming from Tesla FSD I really trusted self driving. My first week in the Rivian and the self driving just disconnected on a turn in the freeway, luckily I caught the wheel as I started to fly into the lane next to me. You also have to be careful in construction areas or with poor lane markings.

One thing I don’t understand is when these systems just disconnect, they should beep if the driver needs to take over but whoever is programming these things to just disconnect when someone is not paying attention, this is literally the most dangerous thing you could program the car to do.

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[Electrified Outdoors]

I hope nobody was injured. Its understandable this is a frustrating experience and unsettling too. We place a lot of trust in these driver assist systems to lessen the stress of driving day to day or on long trips.

With that said, these are ADAS (Advenced Driver Assist Systems). The driver assist is the important part here. They cannot be relied upon to solely operate the vehicle. The driver must supervise and be ready to intervene quickly to any impending trouble. The Rivian system is not hands free and requires driver attention at all times.

Even the hands-free systems (GM SuperCruise, Ford Blue Cruise, and now Tesla I believe) still require the driver to be alert, attentive, and eyes forward. There is no system currently, and I venture to say at least for the next 10 years, that will provide full autonomy. I hope I live to see the day we can take a nap while the car safely takes us to our destination. We aren't there yet.

Until then, manufacturers need to do a better job of communicating to customers what these systems are, what they are/aren't capable of, and what is required of the driver as a result of the limitations.

In this case, it sucks but ultimately because of the above...you are responsible for the vehicle. Supervised is a really good way to put it because a supervisor is ultimately responsible for his/her employees performance.

 

[Riviot]

Personally, I would not post "i'm at fault" out in the public and ask insurance to review if the truck merging is at fault (from the video).

As for everyone here throwing the book at OP, relax, you're not his DAD!

Don't tell us what to do, Auntie Rivian!

Post the video! Post the video!

 

[Webleyaz]

I'm torn on the whole ADAS thing. I really like to use it on open highway situations which are quite infrequent for me. On the other hand, I'd like to trust it in bumper-to-bumper crap when my commute is going to be an extra half hour but, like the op points out, it can't be trusted to just creep along and not hit something. On the other hand, I'm not too sure about being the Guinea pigs during the Ai revolution, either. To me, ideally, every vehicle would be outfitted to communicate with every other vehicle within its personal bubble and they'd all know what's going on before any "testing" is done with lives at stake. You've seen the drone swarms that make up 3d sky art. That kind of cooperation can move me anywhere in the world. Imagine 75% of them being controlled by individuals. And 10% of them are CA drivers!
BTW, op, I know you described a minor accident with minimal damage so even if you end up completely out of pocket it probably won't break you but I've seen way too many at-fault parties held unaccountable by reason of admission of fault by the innocent. Really, this is a PSA for others considering similar posts.

 

[pointless]

Almost wrecked my R1T as Driver, um, Assist, was trying to assist me into the freeway median.

Instinctively pulled hard to the right to break off Driver Assist then had to correct the other way to stay in my lane. R1T was swaying back and forth hard.

The HOV experience as a whole is really bad, non-existent navigation, steering into K Rail. This is in SoCal, even near Irvine. How could it be this bad in Rivian's own backyard?

Gen1 yesterday in HOV lane on highway veered towards the staggered concrete barrier but it's done it before on other sections and I always have my hands on the wheel. Of course it cancelled Driver+ and I was luckily ready for it but the feeling really sucks and makes me not trust it in the HOV lane. My concern is for new EV drivers that would definitely not be ready for that situation after being sold on Driver+ despite being told to always control the wheel. It's not a subtle pull towards the object, it's pretty harsh from my experiences.

 

[LosAngelesR1S]

This is 100% the other driver's fault as they need to yield to you, not the other way around.

 

[Donald Stanfield]

Almost wrecked my R1T as Driver, um, Assist, was trying to assist me into the freeway median.

Instinctively pulled hard to the right to break off Driver Assist then had to correct the other way to stay in my lane. R1T was swaying back and forth hard.

The HOV experience as a whole is really bad, non-existent navigation, steering into K Rail. This is in SoCal, even near Irvine. How could it be this bad in Rivian's own backyard?

You shouldn't be making hard corrections on the freeway. The system doesn't require that much input to cancel it.

 

[godfodder0901]

This is 100% the other driver's fault as they need to yield to you, not the other way around.

Not how the law works in most places. You have a duty to avoid an accident if you can. If you take no action, you share the culpability. Google the last clear chance doctrine.

 

[Zoidz]

Not how the law works in most places. You have a duty to avoid an accident if you can. If you take no action, you share the culpability. Google the last clear chance doctrine.

Agree, shared fault is common in both police reports and insurance assignment of fault.

 

[runwithscissors]

You shouldn't be making hard corrections on the freeway. The system doesn't require that much input to cancel it.

Except it's not a slow drift towards the median from my few experiences. It's pretty harsh and it's why I'll never use it when concrete barriers are right next to me. For mapped roads and the amount of sensors we have, it's pretty inexcusable. I have older SUVs and ICE cars that do a far better job with less tech and on all roads.

 

[pointless]

You shouldn't be making hard corrections on the freeway. The system doesn't require that much input to cancel it.

Sigh. This is why we can’t have nice things. It was about 1.5 seconds.

 

[pointless]

Not asking for advice. Reaches for Ignore STAN button.

 

[Ngkgb]

Almost wrecked my R1T as Driver, um, Assist, was trying to assist me into the freeway median.

Instinctively pulled hard to the right to break off Driver Assist then had to correct the other way to stay in my lane. R1T was swaying back and forth hard.

The HOV experience as a whole is really bad, non-existent navigation, steering into K Rail. This is in SoCal, even near Irvine. How could it be this bad in Rivian's own backyard?

I live in Irvine. No way I trust this system in carpool lanes in SoCal.

 

[DrBad]

Regarding the OP conditions, I've noticed that the assist will pretty much ignore a car pulling into my lane in front of me until the car is all the way in the lane, then slows down rapidly. Human decision making would slow down the car way before then.

 

[SwampNut]

And still no video posted....??

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