Cancelling R1T Preorder - Reasons

ohmman

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First, I want to say that I am not here to complain about anything Rivian is doing or has done. This isn't a rant on Rivian in the least. It's just an explanation of where I am for anyone who feels like reading it.

I've really been looking forward to my R1T. I enjoyed my test drive at the First Mile event and have a lot of respect for the thoughtfulness of the vehicle. It's a well designed, great looking truck that hits a sweet spot on size and power. So why am I canceling my 8/25/20 preorder? Timing, mainly, but also efficiency.

The primary reason for my purchase was to replace or supplement our Model X in towing our Airstream. We've been EV towing since early 2017 and while our LR+ Model X has plenty of range to get us around, I was looking for something that could also get me to remote trailheads once we were at camp. I also liked the idea of bed storage for those trips so that we're not loading the trailer with our toys.

All of that said, towing a travel trailer comfortably requires the max pack, which is what I had on order. It's absolutely possible without it, but I've towed with my old X that didn't have the 370+ miles of range the new one does, and it can be discomfiting and logistically taxing to do so. Add on battery degradation, elevation gain, and cold weather range loss and things get even tighter. With our old X, we charged to 100% more times than I'd have liked, and flirted with the bottom 5% just as often. Those are pretty harmful things to do to a battery and our range degradation confirmed this for us.

My R1T max pack is at least a year away. In the year and a half that I've had a preorder for the R1T, my kids have grown a year and a half older, and they'll be another year (at least) older by the time we get the max pack. We aren't camping as much as they get older and my son will be of driving age by the time the R1T arrives. It's just sadly timed out of being a good fit.

There is one other important factor that has always nagged me, but wasn't enough to make me cancel my reservation earlier. That is the efficiency level of the vehicle. I have a sizable PV array and try to offset our consumption with that array. I am all but certain that I'd be driving our Model X around town for local trips when given the option of it or the R1T, mostly in the name of energy consumption. The R1T is necessarily a heavy and relatively inefficient EV. The max pack version will be even more so, specifically with regards to weight.

So, sadly, I couldn't find a way forward with this very cool vehicle. I've decided to replace my S with a Model Y. The good news is that everyone behind me is likely to get theirs just a little sooner. I'm still a fan!

 

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First, I want to say that I am not here to complain about anything Rivian is doing or has done. This isn't a rant on Rivian in the least. It's just an explanation of where I am for anyone who feels like reading it.

I've really been looking forward to my R1T. I enjoyed my test drive at the First Mile event and have a lot of respect for the thoughtfulness of the vehicle. It's a well designed, great looking truck that hits a sweet spot on size and power. So why am I canceling my 8/25/20 preorder? Timing, mainly, but also efficiency.

The primary reason for my purchase was to replace or supplement our Model X in towing our Airstream. We've been EV towing since early 2017 and while our LR+ Model X has plenty of range to get us around, I was looking for something that could also get me to remote trailheads once we were at camp. I also liked the idea of bed storage for those trips so that we're not loading the trailer with our toys.

All of that said, towing a travel trailer comfortably requires the max pack, which is what I had on order. It's absolutely possible without it, but I've towed with my old X that didn't have the 370+ miles of range the new one does, and it can be discomfiting and logistically taxing to do so. Add on battery degradation, elevation gain, and cold weather range loss and things get even tighter. With our old X, we charged to 100% more times than I'd have liked, and flirted with the bottom 5% just as often. Those are pretty harmful things to do to a battery and our range degradation confirmed this for us.

My R1T max pack is at least a year away. In the year and a half that I've had a preorder for the R1T, my kids have grown a year and a half older, and they'll be another year (at least) older by the time we get the max pack. We aren't camping as much as they get older and my son will be of driving age by the time the R1T arrives. It's just sadly timed out of being a good fit.

There is one other important factor that has always nagged me, but wasn't enough to make me cancel my reservation earlier. That is the efficiency level of the vehicle. I have a sizable PV array and try to offset our consumption with that array. I am all but certain that I'd be driving our Model X around town for local trips when given the option of it or the R1T, mostly in the name of energy consumption. The R1T is necessarily a heavy and relatively inefficient EV. The max pack version will be even more so, specifically with regards to weight.

So, sadly, I couldn't find a way forward with this very cool vehicle. I've decided to replace my S with a Model Y. The good news is that everyone behind me is likely to get theirs just a little sooner. I'm still a fan!
There's still a lot of unknowns about the R1T's efficiency, but if your family has grown out of the need of having one, then it doesn't make sense to get it.
 
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ohmman

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There's still a lot of unknowns about the R1T's efficiency, but if your family has grown out of the need of having one, then it doesn't make sense to get it.
True, but it's not going to beat the 280Wh/mi figure I'm getting out of the X no matter what is done. It may get down to the 430Wh/mi range with careful driving. It's a necessity for the shape and weight of the vehicle, not criticizing, just observing.
 

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True, but it's not going to beat the 280Wh/mi figure I'm getting out of the X no matter what is done. It may get down to the 430Wh/mi range with careful driving. It's a necessity for the shape and weight of the vehicle, not criticizing, just observing.
280Wh/mi in an X sounds like a dream. In Wisconsin winters we're usually somewhere in the upper 400s or low 500s. Getting it down to 400 is an accomplishment. Even in good weather I'm not sure its possible to get down to 280 in our X.

You must be really trying to maximize efficiency.
 

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280Wh/mi in an X sounds like a dream. In Wisconsin winters we're usually somewhere in the upper 400s or low 500s. Getting it down to 400 is an accomplishment. Even in good weather I'm not sure its possible to get down to 280 in our X.

You must be really trying to maximize efficiency.
280WH/mi beats my Model Y handily. If OP is getting those figures good on them but no way the R1T is going to match unless its being towed.
 
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ohmman

ohmman

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280Wh/mi in an X sounds like a dream. In Wisconsin winters we're usually somewhere in the upper 400s or low 500s. Getting it down to 400 is an accomplishment. Even in good weather I'm not sure its possible to get down to 280 in our X.

You must be really trying to maximize efficiency.
Our X90D averaged 330Wh/mi lifetime excluding towing. Our 2020 X LR++ is at 282Wh/mi. My 2014 S P85 is at 292Wh/mi.

We live in a temperate climate and in a small town where we rarely exceed 50mph. Those two things make a huge difference. And I like to game my efficiency when I drive, because I'm insane.
 

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If you get more out of your X than others do, you probably would have gotten more out of your R1 than others as well. R1 being heavier can come handy with more stability during towing as well.

That said, towing is one of my main reservations. I feel like with the tech and infrastructure being where it is, if there are long distance towing to be done, it may make sense to get something like a bolt, or even something with half the range for local drives and a gas guzzler for occasional long distance towing.

You can be a pioneer without R1T: If you just made your Y reservation, you should get one out of Texas with front and rear casting and who knows, you may even get 4680 in it.

Goodluck.
 

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Time is the great enemy. I cannot wait beyond the end of this year. If my R1T delivery slips, I'll very likely cancel and buy an ICE truck.
 

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... All of that said, towing a travel trailer comfortably requires the max pack, which is what I had on order. It's absolutely possible without it, but I've towed with my old X that didn't have the 370+ miles of range....
Well, there is another option. You can always replace the camper trailer with something like this...

https://electrek.co/2022/01/19/electric-airstream-concept-is-the-rv-industrys-iphone-moment/

Its a EV tailer with a single motor to offset the tow penalty. Your X probably will end up with same distance with or without it, if you change it to something like estream Airstream.
 

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Time is the great enemy. I cannot wait beyond the end of this year. If my R1T delivery slips, I'll very likely cancel and buy an ICE truck.
Time can be Rivian’s best friend. They have a small window before competition wakes up. They need to deliver as many as they can as fast as they can. Otherwise they lose reservations not just to ICE but also to other EVs.
 

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First, I want to say that I am not here to complain about anything Rivian is doing or has done. This isn't a rant on Rivian in the least. It's just an explanation of where I am for anyone who feels like reading it.

I've really been looking forward to my R1T. I enjoyed my test drive at the First Mile event and have a lot of respect for the thoughtfulness of the vehicle. It's a well designed, great looking truck that hits a sweet spot on size and power. So why am I canceling my 8/25/20 preorder? Timing, mainly, but also efficiency.

The primary reason for my purchase was to replace or supplement our Model X in towing our Airstream. We've been EV towing since early 2017 and while our LR+ Model X has plenty of range to get us around, I was looking for something that could also get me to remote trailheads once we were at camp. I also liked the idea of bed storage for those trips so that we're not loading the trailer with our toys.

All of that said, towing a travel trailer comfortably requires the max pack, which is what I had on order. It's absolutely possible without it, but I've towed with my old X that didn't have the 370+ miles of range the new one does, and it can be discomfiting and logistically taxing to do so. Add on battery degradation, elevation gain, and cold weather range loss and things get even tighter. With our old X, we charged to 100% more times than I'd have liked, and flirted with the bottom 5% just as often. Those are pretty harmful things to do to a battery and our range degradation confirmed this for us.

My R1T max pack is at least a year away. In the year and a half that I've had a preorder for the R1T, my kids have grown a year and a half older, and they'll be another year (at least) older by the time we get the max pack. We aren't camping as much as they get older and my son will be of driving age by the time the R1T arrives. It's just sadly timed out of being a good fit.

There is one other important factor that has always nagged me, but wasn't enough to make me cancel my reservation earlier. That is the efficiency level of the vehicle. I have a sizable PV array and try to offset our consumption with that array. I am all but certain that I'd be driving our Model X around town for local trips when given the option of it or the R1T, mostly in the name of energy consumption. The R1T is necessarily a heavy and relatively inefficient EV. The max pack version will be even more so, specifically with regards to weight.

So, sadly, I couldn't find a way forward with this very cool vehicle. I've decided to replace my S with a Model Y. The good news is that everyone behind me is likely to get theirs just a little sooner. I'm still a fan!
I'm sad to read this. Your contribution at TMC about the Model X has been significant I was looking forward to reading your reviews and benefiting from your insights around the Rivian here.
 

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Well, there is another option. You can always replace the camper trailer with something like this...

https://electrek.co/2022/01/19/electric-airstream-concept-is-the-rv-industrys-iphone-moment/

Its a EV tailer with a single motor to offset the tow penalty. Your X probably will end up with same distance with or without it, if you change it to something like estream Airstream.
Here's another article with some technical details. Keep in mind it's a concept, not a product, at this point. 80 kw, 242 hp in this trailer! ? This would easily hit $100k+

"This concept camper packs 80 kilowatt-hours' worth of energy by way of its batteries, which then feed a pair of electric motors (one at each wheel) that are capable of producing a maximum combined output of 242 horsepower and 132 pound-feet of torque."
 
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ohmman

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I'm sad to read this. Your contribution at TMC about the Model X has been significant I was looking forward to reading your reviews and benefiting from your insights around the Rivian here.
Hey, thanks for the kind words. I'm also sad to write it. I still haven't officially canceled, even though I'm decided. It's tough to move on!

Well, there is another option. You can always replace the camper trailer with something like this...

https://electrek.co/2022/01/19/electric-airstream-concept-is-the-rv-industrys-iphone-moment/

Its a EV tailer with a single motor to offset the tow penalty. Your X probably will end up with same distance with or without it, if you change it to something like estream Airstream.
Yes, I'm aware of this and find it pretty fascinating. I'll be interested to see how they handle a number of things like tongue weight. That's a lot of batteries and if the trailer tongue is 10-15% of the weight.. well, that's going to exceed a lot of EV's rated capacities.
 

 
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