Automakers are starting to admit that drivers hate touchscreens. Buttons are back!

[Tampa R1T]

Dangerous buttons? Darwinian selection.

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[SANZC02]

Honestly I don't understand the challenge here at all. I rarely touch the HVAC other than to hit defoggers. Audio is controlled by the steering wheel buttons. Then again I don't get the craze about avocados, think they are gross.

I agree, sometimes just takes a little time to adjust. In reality I’m rarely fiddling with anything while driving and seem to have adjusted quickly to the R1S screens. Not sure if it is the layout or because we have had a Model S for 7 years.

 

[Ventura]

I think the issue with the vents could be solved by the addition of presets. I could imagine naming them (direct, indirect, floor, etc...) and the use of Alexa to select them. I think the changing of temperatures and use of seat heating/vents doesn't require much as it is currently set up, though I wouldn't mind heat and vent for the seats to always be present, much like I'd like the camera icon to always be present.

 

[Donald Stanfield]

Yes, in theory that is how things SHOULD happen. But, Edward Snowden pretty clearly showed the world that the US government has been illegally / pseudo-legally been obtaining carte-blanche FISA warrants on anyone and everyone they want at any time. And it turns out these weren't even real warrants, they had carte-blanche authority to get into anyone's cell phone, laptop, vehicle, digital personal assistant, etc. And it is still happening today.

Oh I totally agree that the NSA and US government is well past their given authority, but they aren't private companies. They don't need Alexa or opt ins, they can remote into your cell phones and turn them into listening devices. They can also monitor your internet traffic.

 

[Tony R1S]

I second the request for adding presets for vent positioning (maybe fan speed as well), that would be so awesome. I"m constantly adjusting the vent direction so that I can cool off various body parts (arms, face, chest, legs) because if I don't do so, only one part of my body is at the right temp while the rest is sweating or burning up from the sun (mostly from windwshield or from the roof radiating like a heater). Maybe the A/C is just too weak to keep the cabin cool enough, (or the airflow is too narrow/focused) .. For now, messing with vent control is best way for me survive the heat for now until I get proper IR/tint all around.

 

[AdamsFan1983]

Voice assistant will never replace basic quick functions like next track or changing fan speed.

The ONLY buttons are on the steering wheel, and they only currently do like 2 things. Not sure how you can say they hit the right mix lol

Pretty sure I covered that, mentioning the stalks (which incidentally do have physical buttons on them) and pointing specifically that I find it to be the perfect balance “for me.”

 

[Dohmar]

I think a lot of the concerns about taking your eyes off the road can be addressed by a good in-car virtual assistant. If I can say, “Alexa, set the driver’s temperature to 70 degrees.” or, “Alexa, turn off the second row seat heaters.” then I’m not spending any time with my eyes on a screen or my hands off the steering wheel.

Alexa is NOT going to hear me when I've got Alice in Chains or Slipknot cranked to 11...

 

[the long way downunder]

The touchscreen is a cash cow and a cost-saving compromise – a compromise on safety in terms of it being a distraction to the driver attempting simple tasks.
It's a cost-saving because it simplifies the instrument panel and dash assembly.
It's a cash cow because it opens the market to subscription services and "upgrades."

 

[madgrey]

This is what a bad "screen" implementation looks like - mostly a sea of buttons. Nobody wants this.

Here's a good one. A big touch screen and some special purpose buttons, with many of the functions accessible through the touch screen. Buttons are intuitively placed, e.g. the ride height control is a push up/down toggle, temp up is above temp down, etc.

I'd like Rivian to add a small number buttons. A few configurable buttons would be good, but special purpose ones would also be welcome. On my RAM, I used a few hard buttons often such as the ride height, parking sensor disable (great while cans/bike on hitch rack), HVAC recirculate (you only have a few seconds sometimes before noticing the ICE dumping gas out the tailpipe) and "screen off" button (try to put this on a touch screen, great when parked at overlook).

Regarding the HVAC vents - it's not about whether or not you move them. It's the fact that Rivian took a simple, elegant, time tested solution (manual vents) and turned it into a complex operation that has to be explained again and again to passengers. I haven't had a single person say it was cool, easy, neat, etc. It's always "really"?

 

[Count Orlok]

What is also odd is that the yoke "steering wheel" has failed to take off.

 

[Deleted member 7086]

Rivian, trying to be cutting edge, has made its vehicles needlessly complex simply creating more opportunities for failures (and increased cost) as time goes on. My R1T is a little less than one year old and only has 8,000 miles on it. I am beginning to lose track of the number of things which have required repairs and those not capable of repair. The HVAC system and its infotainment screen implementation are prime examples. Rivian should simply trash it and start over. Rivian is a software driven entity. If you don’t get it right the first time just write some more code to fix it. But automobiles at the end of the day are mechanical devices. The hardware needs to be right the first time. Code can not fix it. Give me a few well thought out old fashioned knobs.

 

[SoCal Rob]

Rivian, trying to be cutting edge, has made its vehicles needlessly complex simply creating more opportunities for failures (and increased cost) as time goes on. My R1T is a little less than one year old and only has 8,000 miles on it. I am beginning to lose track of the number of things which have required repairs and those not capable of repair. The HVAC system and its infotainment screen implementation are prime examples. Rivian should simply trash it and start over. Rivian is a software driven entity. If you don’t get it right the first time just write some more code to fix it. But automobiles at the end of the day are mechanical devices. The hardware needs to be right the first time. Code can not fix it. Give me a few well thought out old fashioned knobs.

Yes, these are complex vehicles. However, being able to fix complex software OTA, even if occasionally introducing new bugs, is way better to me than mechanical complexity.

I think there are more opportunities for costly issues with mechanical complexity (which inherently have opportunities to fail which cannot be fixed OTA and the need for regular maintenance) in what I’m taking off-road: a V8 (with far more moving parts than 4 electric motors) a 6-speed automatic transmission (with far more moving parts than the gear trains connecting those 4 motors to each matching wheel), an open front differential, a dual-range transfer case with locking center differential, and a limited slip/locking rear differential.

I’m pretty sure that if you’re looking at modern near-luxury off-road capable vehicles close to a Rivian, the ICE competition will be more complex and the EV competition which is simpler will be lacking Rivian’s capability. I looked at a Land Rover Defender as a competitor to an R1S and it has a (smaller) touchscreen with complex software which can be fixed OTA on top of all the mechanical complexity. I love my current Land Rover and yet I made the decision to go with an R1S expecting the reliability to be at least as good as a new Defender when it comes to the drive train.

Just wondering: what modern alternative are you comparing your R1T to that is significantly less complex and which matches the capabilities?

 

[the long way downunder]

What is also odd is that the yoke "steering wheel" has failed to take off.

Once Tesla uses a variable ratio steering rack, a yoke would be interesting at least for a sports sedan or the Roadster.

For the X, it's just daft and cumbersome, even disconcerting for city driving to be distracted by fumbling to find wheel while focusing on maneuvering at low speed.

 

[longhornguy2015]

Buttons lead to limitations. A full screen gives you the ability to add features, do a redesign etc. old car manufacturers see a car as a car, ev car companies are seeing their car is hardware that they can improve and add features through software.

 

[Deleted member 11292]

Regarding the HVAC vents - it's not about whether or not you move them. It's the fact that Rivian took a simple, elegant, time tested solution (manual vents) and turned it into a complex operation that has to be explained again and again to passengers. I haven't had a single person say it was cool, easy, neat, etc. It's always "really"?

Exactly. Fixing "problems" that don't exist with gimmicky features because somehow buttons have become the enemy of fingers.

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