Air Suspension Auto-Adjust Quirks

[SoCal Rob]

I saw this in another thread and figured I should start a new thread in the Tires, Wheels, Suspension, Brakes area rather than go off-topic.

My gut feeling is the auto level suspension is the same way. People are saying that their truck is adjusting suspension at stop lights.

Just poorly written software specs and amateur software developers.

Auto-adjust at stop lights under the right circumstances may be intentional. Our Land Rover will do this and it was a little unsettling until I figured out why it was doing this.

Picture an extended slowdown where the weight transfers to the front suspension (front dive) as you’re braking. The system will detect that the front is too low and increase the pressure in the front to bring it back to parallel* to the road surface. When you come to a stop and unload the front suspension the front ends up being too high (looks like rear squat but the back is at the right height) so the vehicle lowers the pressure in the front to bring it back to parallel to the road surface. Our Land Rover doesn’t adjust instantly, probably to save wear and tear on the valves and compressor, so it can be several seconds after coming to a stop that it self-corrects.

To me it’s kind of cool to see how the system reacts. Of course different manufacturers may implement the technology differently. Our Land Rover will return to parallel when people get out or cargo is removed when the vehicle is locked. It will also “wake up” from time to time and make sure that the vehicle is still parallel by venting air from any corner(s) which are higher than any other(s). This is a good strategy because it keeps the vehicle looking parallel, plus it’s relatively quiet and very low power compared to running the compressor. The only downside (down corner?) is that if you have a slow leak in one corner the vehicle will eventually be resting on the bump stops on all 4 corners so you have to do a little more troubleshooting than walking up to the vehicle and noting which corner is low.

Rivian may not do any of this which could lead to the vehicle looking crooked / not parallel to the road surface (front-to-rear / side-to-side) after removing passengers and/or cargo. Or maybe Rivian engineers studied other similar systems and implemented some or all of their air-spring suspension behaviors. I assume that we’ll figure out what’s normal over time… and then possibly adjust our expectations when OTA updates give us a new normal.

Given the unique (at this time) combination of drivetrain and suspension, I think we all have to keep an open mind when judging the decisions of the engineers who designed the R1 vehicles. Some vehicle behaviors which seem like bugs to us may have been done intentionally and for good reason.

*While it’s easy to use the term auto-leveling for the air suspension, as far as I know only camper and RV jack systems do true auto-leveling (edit since post written before this was a feature: and Rivians while parked and manually activated). All of the air suspensions I’ve encountered in car applications are auto-adjusting the height in an attempt to keep the vehicle parallel to the road surface. As an example, if parked on a slight hill the vehicle won’t be level compared to a bubble level but it will have its normal height from the road surface front to rear and side to side that it would if on flat and level ground.

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[Branden-Design]

I've noticed the leveling at stops with my R1T, too. Seems to work well and is mostly behind-the-scenes except for one instance I had recently.

I took a very "spirited" drive on my local favorite twisty mountain highway with the drive mode set to All-Purpose (I prefer the balance of ride and handling in All-Purpose vs. Sport mode) and once back down the mountain (24 miles, one way), switched it to Conserve for my cruise home.

Shortly after, I decided to switch back to All-Purpose and received an error, "Ride height change not possible due to overheated compressor". This lasted for the remainder of my drive home in Conserve mode, about 9 miles. After letting it rest in the garage for awhile, all systems were back to normal.

I'm wondering if there are different duty cycles for the auto-leveling based on drive mode and will use Sport for the next run up/down the mountain to see if the compressor is overworked again.

As a side note, the R1T can go obscenely fast on twisty roads for a 7,000 lbs truck on all-terrain tires! I may start a thread about impressions of its handling compared to my 1990 Porsche C2.

 

[jjswan33]

Is this something more than you car just raising back up in all purpose or conserve?

In both of those drive modes the car lowers as you speed up to improve efficiency to either low or lowest then when you slow down it goes back up to standard.

 

[SeaGeo]

Mine definitely levels at stop lights even when it's already at the standard ride height. I noticed it a few times today and actually meant to ask if others had been noticing it. Thanks for making the post @SoCal Rob!

 

[Rhidan]

I've noticed All-Purpose will also auto adjust back to "Standard" height after I've intentionally selected "Low." Maybe that's intended behavior, but it seems strange to override an available height setting selected by the driver.

I've been parking in a low-clearance parking garage at work, and the "Low" setting has also felt a little bit more maneuverable in the downtown city. But sure enough, after driving for a bit in All-Purpose I'm back to Standard height.

 

[SoCal Rob]

I've noticed All-Purpose will also auto adjust back to "Standard" height after I've intentionally selected "Low." Maybe that's intended behavior, but it seems strange to override an available height setting selected by the driver.

I've been parking in a low-clearance parking garage at work, and the "Low" setting has also felt a little bit more maneuverable in the downtown city. But sure enough, after driving for a bit in All-Purpose I'm back to Standard height.

Our Land Rover will override height settings under the right (wrong?) conditions. It typically gives a warning ding and message on the dash display to give you a chance to slow down or stop moving. I think it would be nice if Rivian would do something similar. Maybe in a future update…

 

[kylealden]

I've noticed All-Purpose will also auto adjust back to "Standard" height after I've intentionally selected "Low." Maybe that's intended behavior, but it seems strange to override an available height setting selected by the driver.

I've been parking in a low-clearance parking garage at work, and the "Low" setting has also felt a little bit more maneuverable in the downtown city. But sure enough, after driving for a bit in All-Purpose I'm back to Standard height.

Yeah I am a bit uncomfortable with the automatic adjustments overriding a manual setting. I think the right mode adjuster in each mode should have separate menu toggles for "Automatic" and "High/Medium/low/etc", in addition to showing the current level.

If you manually select something, if shouldn't auto adjust until you change back to automatic, switch modes, or without showing a large (full screen/modal) confirmation dialog (e.g. I can imagine it might be a safety issue if you're trying to drive highway speeds in Highest). This could be an issue at both extremes (e.g. auto lowering in high clearance offroading, or auto raising in low overhead clearance parking garages etc.).

 

[SoCal Rob]

Yeah I am a bit uncomfortable with the automatic adjustments overriding a manual setting. I think the right mode adjuster in each mode should have separate menu toggles for "Automatic" and "High/Medium/low/etc", in addition to showing the current level.

If you manually select something, if shouldn't auto adjust until you change back to automatic, switch modes, or without showing a large (full screen/modal) confirmation dialog (e.g. I can imagine it might be a safety issue if you're trying to drive highway speeds in Highest). This could be an issue at both extremes (e.g. auto lowering in high clearance offroading, or auto raising in low overhead clearance parking garages etc.).

My understanding is that Land Rover made the decision to override height choices to save on warranty claims (CV joints on our LR3 are supposedly under more stress as the angle increases with height) and improve safety (increased risk of a rollover at high speed in high setting). Probably in that order, too. Anyway, depending upon the school of thought at Rivian (longer half-shafts = less angle for CV joints and with the EV center of gravity so low I don’t know if a rollover is a significantly greater risk) they may or may not allow locking out automatic height changes.

I totally agree that a prominent warning for the driver would be the bare minimum if the vehicle is overriding what was manually selected.

 

[Iwantatesla]

Mine definitely levels at stop lights even when it's already at the standard ride height. I noticed it a few times today and actually meant to ask if others had been noticing it. Thanks for making the post @SoCal Rob!

Yes it levels. Operation will vary depending on speed and how hot the air compressor is.

 

[time]

Well I hate it. Adjusting itself at every stop, in every drive thru, at every light is just annoying. Half the time it makes the truck more unlevel. It doesn't matter why they have it, its annoying and I'll never just get used to it. I just hate it.

--
I was charging a little while ago and someone asked me what I thought of the Rivian and I genuinely for the first time said I didn't like it. I really meant that too. I don't like the truck today because of this issue. It was a particularly bad day for software doing things on own and generally not working - I'm just over it. Rivian is losing my interest over this issue and the dozens of other software issues.

 

[SoCal Rob]

Well I hate it. Adjusting itself at every stop, in every drive thru, at every light is just annoying. Half the time it makes the truck more unlevel. It doesn't matter why they have it, its annoying and I'll never just get used to it. I just hate it.

Maybe there is something wrong with the air suspension on your truck and service can check it? I only suggest that because I don’t think we know 100% what is normal behavior. If the vehicle is often not parallel to the ground (side to side, front to back, or one corner low) then it may be a sensor issue, a bad valve, or that it just needs to be recalibrated. Parallel to the ground the Rivian may not always be true bubble-level level.

On our Land Rover the auto-adjust at a stop is pretty rare since it is only after a faster than normal stop and it is always lowering the front to bring the vehicle parallel to the ground.

 

[time]

Had a theory today, still testing out my hypothesis on this. My suspension always adjusts in drive thrus. It also always seems to make the level worse - very annoyingly.

• Do your windows switches not work sometimes?
• And does your suspension start moving after you've rolled down / up your windows?

To day I seemed to notice a correlation between the windows not working correctly and the truck suspension being more active than usual.

 

[SeaGeo]

Had a theory today, still testing out my hypothesis on this. My suspension always adjusts in drive thrus. It also always seems to make the level worse - very annoyingly.

• Do your windows switches not work sometimes?
• And does your suspension start moving after you've rolled down / up your windows?

To day I seemed to notice a correlation between the windows not working correctly and the truck suspension being more active than usual.

Have you submitted a service ticket yet?

 

[opnwide]

Had a theory today, still testing out my hypothesis on this. My suspension always adjusts in drive thrus. It also always seems to make the level worse - very annoyingly.

• Do your windows switches not work sometimes?
• And does your suspension start moving after you've rolled down / up your windows?

To day I seemed to notice a correlation between the windows not working correctly and the truck suspension being more active than usual.

Does the truck auto-level after they hand you the food through the drive thru or before? Try a non-food drive thru like a bank or pharmacy and see if it happens, maybe the truck is in a low state of charge and the scent of fries is overwhelming. I’m totally kidding! And couldn’t help myself! Your post made me start off my day with a good laugh…thank you! That would be one wacky connection between the windows and the suspension, but I like your thought process here, “time”.

 

[Trandall]

I'm not as annoyed as @time, but do agree mine is adjusting height more frequently than I would think prudent. I've not had a compressor overheated warning yet however even though I've demonstrated the ride height adjust feature between lowest to highest probably almost ten times for people. Have not had issues with the power windows although mine seem to have built in stop positions so if I hold down they only go down part way and I need to re-press the button to go all the way and same on the way up. All-in-all the truck is more sorted than I had mentally prepared for and am giving a bit of leniency while OTA updates are coming at a good pace and each one has a good bit of improvements. My guess is the R1 line will be less quirky as the months progress.

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