2022 vs 2023 Tax credit…Again

[COdogman]

Beginning in 2024 the rebate can be applied at the point of sale. Silver lining for those of us with a long wait?

I sure hope so! That would be a nice surprise for those who are forced to wait. I like some of the things they included like the vehicles have to be assembled in the US - manufacturers are trying to move more production to the US partly in response to that requirement. The battery sourcing is a good idea in theory, but they probably should have eased into that one more slowly. I don't even disagree with the price limit, although I wish they had tiers instead of it being all or nothing at $80k.

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[rivrum]

I am still confused and some new information appeared on some sites (and it seems there is still some plans to try and amend the 2023 law, but I seriously doubt anything will come out of a divided Congress). No political talk please

It seems that while the 2022 purchases get the full 7,500 rebate/refund, that 2023 purchases get 0 rebate?

Seems a huge drop, especially for a made in America vehicle.

I take it the batteries are the issue? Made in China?

Any info would be great just because it looks like I won’t get my truck till January.

Rivian uses Samsung SDI batteries

 

[Gavinmcc]

Are they made in Korea or Japan? Or even China.

Japan (surprisingly) and China don't work with the set requirements, but Korea does.

I agree with everything COdog said. I will say (skating the edge of the political rules) that the one Senator who pushed these changes is a big coal guy in a time that coal is dying.

 

[tbolts10]

Is there an income limit for the 22 credit? I signed the binding agreement so hoping I get it!

 

[clcbjc123]

My only hope is the binding contract (non-refundable deposit) but the question is whether the government will accept the agreement on '23 returns - to be seen.
I signed it multiple times to be sure but never got a copy from Rivian after signing. My question would be does Rivian give you that contract when you sign purchase agreement. Where is said binding contract

 

[COdogman]

My only hope is the binding contract (non-refundable deposit) but the question is whether the government will accept the agreement on '23 returns - to be seen.
I signed it multiple times to be sure but never got a copy from Rivian after signing. My question would be does Rivian give you that contract when you sign purchase agreement. Where is said binding contract

I got the email on 8/10/22 offering the BPA and including a link to review and sign, then when I was done it gave me the option to print it out. Then, on 8/26/22 I received a confirmation email from Rivian saying that I had submitted it within the allowed time frame. This was the text of that email:

Hi There,​

Thank you! You have successfully signed the terms of the binding contract for the purchase of your R1T or R1S before the cutoff of 8/16/2022. Keep this confirmation of your $1,000 deposit payment, and if you haven’t already, please download this PDF, sign in wet ink and save it for your tax return reference records. Wait for guidance from the IRS regarding next steps. You do not need to return these documents to Rivian, as Rivian has recorded your electronic agreement. If you have any additional questions, we might have an answer for you here or reach out for support.​

 

[Jac]

Is there an income limit for the 22 credit? I signed the binding agreement so hoping I get it!

The previous EV tax credit law (which hopefully will be applicable in 2023 for folks who signed the binding purchase agreement before the new EV tax credit was enacted) did not have any income limit, or battery component sourcing requirement, or MSRP cap.

 

[Autolycus]

There is a new bill floating through congress titled Affordable Electric Vehicles for America Act of 2022, that would delay many requirements that were put in place within the IRA.

https://electrek.co/2022/11/07/new-electric-vehicles-would-qualify-for-tax-credit-with-new-bill/

Text - S.5020 - 117th Congress (2021-2022): Affordable Electric Vehicles for America Act of 2022 | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

I know Senator Warnock (GA) has been pushing hard for some changes to the IRA’s tax credits because Hyundai is saying the new credit structure could “complicate” their plans for a $5.5B EV-specific factory in the Savannah area. Warnock’s in a runoff for the seat, but I’m sure Ossof will take up the charge as well. Walker has generally made fun of EVs, so I’m not hopeful if he wins he’ll do what’s best for GA workers who could get good jobs at Hyundai and that other company y’all may have heard is building a plant in GA.

 

[sac602]

And does msrp include destination charge? Another potential pitfall

 

[Tbirdjeff]

i don't mean to add further variables but it's my understanding that if you signed the purchase contract in Aug 2022 you are eligible via the old rules (e.g. $7500, no income limit) even if the vehicle isn't delivered in 2022. Someone correct me if i'm wrong.

I'm clarifying this because this differs slightly from what you mentioned above in terms of 2022 vs 2023 purchases.

If you signed the purchase agreement tied to your deposit, then you can take the credit in 2022. You don't need it delivered in 2022.

 

[Zorg]

As far as I can tell if your vehicle is delivered in 2022, there is no income limit or price cap. Max refund of $7500 depending on your tax liability. As to whether $100 makes one's order a binding contract, it seems that the IRS would disagree. Starting in 2023, it gets more complicated...

 

[Jac]

If you signed the purchase agreement tied to your deposit, then you can take the credit in 2022. You don't need it delivered in 2022.

Suggest you speak with a CPA before taking a tax credit in a tax year prior to the tax year of vehicle delivery.

The new law says vehicles delivered after 2022 can be treated for tax purposes (i.e., what EV credit qualification rule applies) as if delivered prior to enactment of the new law if you signed a binding purchase agreement prior to the enactment of the new law. It does not say what you wrote.

 

[moosetags]

I wonder if any of this will apply if I get my R1T in 2024 or 2025.

Brian

 

[Yodi]

I got the email on 8/10/22 offering the BPA and including a link to review and sign, then when I was done it gave me the option to print it out. Then, on 8/26/22 I received a confirmation email from Rivian saying that I had submitted it within the allowed time frame. This was the text of that email:

I concur. I received the exact same email confirmation.

NOTEWORTHY COMMENT: The bottom of this contract states a signed date of August 15, 2022, which satisfies the BEFORE 08/16/22 conditions.

Kinda funny tho, looking back on my records, I printed a copy of the agreement when I signed it (08/10/22) and another copy when I received the 8/26 email, but the Contract dates differ slightly (8/15 vs 8/10). I'd venture to guess that Rivian changed all contracts to 08/15.

 

[Yodi]

Suggest you speak with a CPA before taking a tax credit in a tax year prior to the tax year of vehicle delivery.

The new law says vehicles delivered after 2022 can be treated for tax purposes (i.e., what EV credit qualification rule applies) as if delivered prior to enactment of the new law if you signed a binding purchase agreement prior to the enactment of the new law. It does not say what you wrote.

I like your precise interpretation @Jac .

Forgive my Summary; I agree with most everyone's comments here, but want to make sure we're all referencing the same sources, regardless of tax expertise (of which I have some).

I believe the best leg we have to stand on is compiling statements directly from original source documentation (all those '.gov' sites, exactly as referenced by @connoisseurr):

• https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/house-bill/5376/text
  • 
• https://www.irs.gov/businesses/plug-in-electric-vehicle-credit-irc-30-and-irc-30d
  • 
• https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/taxevb.shtml
  • 

To me, they all pretty much say the same thing (phew, I can't believe it, but that's a bit of a big relief these days!), but a few things stand out:

• I'm pretty sure the Date of Enactment is Aug 16th, 2022 (when it was signed into effect)
• '...taxpayer may elect ... to treat such vehicle as having been placed in service on the day before the date of enactment of this Act.'
  • This sounds like pre-08/16/22 contract holders who take delivery in 2023 will need to amend 2022 tax returns (if filed by that point). Might be worth delaying completion of your return as long as you can, if your delivery is close.
• 'Written Biding Contract' appears to be ultimately subject to interpretation by each State

Apologies for the long post... I care a lot about the subject tho, since I'm affected.

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