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1st deliveries in November says my Rivian Guide. Communication from RJ expected today

Smithery

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Yea, I think that was an exaggeration. I bet they READ the forums... But I'm not convinced they actually talked to customers, recently (outside of guide contacts).
Pretty sure every single phone and web chat is also considered "talking to customers", especially when they specify they are a preorder holder.

And I bed those conversations are orders of magnitude more numerous than Guide contacts.
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CommodoreAmiga

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Pretty sure every single phone and web chat is also considered "talking to customers", especially when they specify they are a preorder holder.

And I bed those conversations are orders of magnitude more numerous than Guide contacts.
That's the same vein as guides, imo. Also, I'd be surprised if RJ is fielding CS phone calls or chats.
 

RWerksman

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still clearly think this?
No at all. What you presented was very, very correct and I appreciate the fact that you stuck to your guns in a way that was collaborative rather than condescending. I apologize if I came off poorly.

I thought that it would be unheard of to delay for a 5th time just 45 days after delaying for a 4th time. Apparently, their situation and estimation ability is even worse than even I thought.

My biggest take away was this admission:

I have spoken with a number of you and know we need to do a better job at communicating specifics around deliveries.

My biggest frustration - addressed.
How exactly is this addressed? Knowing something and doing something are very different things. Him writing that isn't worth the electrons it's stored with. If he would have stated something like:

I have spoken with a a number of you and know we need to do a better job at communicating. We'll be updating our site by the end of August with a timeframe for your delivery that will consistently narrow based on our your place in line and our production volumes. Additionally, we're committing to weekly updates about our buildout process. As an early backer of Rivian, being clear, concise, and consistent in our communication to you is the best way we can reassure you that the faith you had in Rivian was well founded.

For me, it has as much worth as the delivery timelines that were released on May 28th.
 

Diddy123

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How exactly is this addressed? Knowing something and doing something are very different things. Him writing that isn't worth the electrons it's stored with. If he would have stated something like:
Correct.

Acknowledged? Yes. Addressed? No.

The fact that RJ's still being completely ambiguous on when we'll hear more, is very concerning. It would have been a perfect time to provide some more specifics. I.e., "we're excited to share our EPA results with you next Monday, and a walk through of the UI the following week". But instead we get the same 'soon' comments we've all come to abhor.

You’ll be hearing more from us over the coming weeks with additional updates and progress
Now where have I heard that before?
 

kylealden

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Yea, I think that was an exaggeration. I bet they READ the forums... But I'm not convinced they actually talked to customers, recently (outside of guide contacts).
RJ is recognizable and I'm sure he runs into people in all kinds of places who ask/complain about this stuff. It's safe to say most Rivian preorder holders aren't on the forum.

I met him at the Seattle preview event and he was super approachable, candid, and receptive to questions. I wouldn't be at all surprised if this statement reflects in-the-wild conversations with preorder holders, some of whom are no doubt friends and professional acquaintances.
 

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Trandall

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You should. range is king
@TessP100D,
I'm recommending you change your handle to "Range King". Your persistence is wearing me out and I have "stubbornness of epic proportions" or so I've been told.
 

Smithery

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That's the same vein as guides, imo. Also, I'd be surprised if RJ is fielding CS phone calls or chats.
I missed the specific language where he said "I have spoken to a number of you..."

I autocorrected it to "we have spoken to a number of you"

I'd wager it's an editorial mistake and doubt he literally meant himself personally, but who knows! *

* - Nobody yet, because they're not communicating better yet
 

Gshenderson

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In all seriousness, the line in the email that matters the most to me is this
  • "I have spent a lot of time in the R1T and R1S in just about every conceivable environment, and I am excited for you to experience the combination of refinement, capability and performance – it will be worth the wait!"
I know it will be, that's why I'm so excited for Rivian! I can't take delivery until Q4 2022 anyways so the delay doesn't affect me personally, but I'm just super confident this company has the right strategy and approach to their products. The quality and product will speak for itself when it's finally released. I can't wait still.
This is a great point. Not often is a CEO out there actively testing pre-production product.
 

Gshenderson

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fortunately I never cared what random people on a random forum thought of my listening comprehension
I hope your Guide doesn’t get fired for leaking that information early! That’s the part that I found “unbelievable” - that given Rivian’s extreme control on outbound information of any value, that a Guide would actually preempt a letter from the CEO himself. I still find it “unbelievable”, even though it happened!
 

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Mass-production of a new model is a super complex process even for an established OEM. Must focus on parts coordination/logistics timing and perhaps RJ was unclear on overall production readiness in the past. Pandemic or not... Mass-production launch readiness should be predictable now.

Mass-production of a new vehicle is a really complex process even for an experienced OEM. On the June 27th delay, RJ may not have had a clear view of launch readiness. Expect that organizational weakness may have been exposed by now that can and must be managed toward a reliable delivery schedule for customers.
I don’t think anybody has experienced what we are going thru now. I have a brother in-law who deals in agricultural equipment and manufacturing. It’s brutal right now. The supply chain is f&$ked. How could RJ have it all figured out if two weeks before his launch date he gets news that his parts are again delayed. Maybe, just maybe he’s getting the whole. It will be there “soon” line
 

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I am surprised that he has talked to customers directly and none of them happened to be on this forum .
I'm not surprised at all. This forum appears to have about 2700 members. Many of them have 0 posts and 0 replies. I'm guessing that 30% of the members don't have acual pre-orders in place. So in reality, maybe only 700 to 1000 of the members are active here and have pre-orders. That's 2% of the pre-order holders or less. RJ could have talked to 50 customers and not a single one on this forum.
 

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I don’t think anybody has experienced what we are going thru now. I have a brother in-law who deals in agricultural equipment and manufacturing. It’s brutal right now. The supply chain is f&$ked. How could RJ have it all figured out if two weeks before his launch date he gets news that his parts are again delayed. Maybe, just maybe he’s getting the whole. It will be there “soon” line
this last year has been crazy in mfg, for everything. The company I’m involved with is the largest non-automotive consumer of steel in Canada. They’ve had to basically scour the world for steel, as their biggest supplier (dofasco) had an explosion that cut their capacity in half, and it’s in short supply everywhere else too.


you can have everything ready and humming along, but if just one critical piece of the process breaks suddenly. There’s a weeks, or months long delay because its 2020+1, which means everything is fucked, and that thing that would ordinarily be here in a day is 12 weeks out.

I’ve been in a new product situation where everything is ready, we’re going to ship next week, my first production version is being built aaand… someone uses an $8000 sensor on a CNC machine as a step. That sensor is discontinued so it’s months to get an equivalent replacement. And that was without a pandemic.

I think their biggest constraint right now is automation related. Saw elsewhere here someone’s relative is involved in setting up the robotic welding line and that’s still in progress. Or the battery assembly equipment is down so they’re building packs by hand. That sort of thing.

it also seems like their priority is (rightly) the vans for Amazon. If they’re late on the first batch there are probably big penalties. 30,000 R1 preorders are trumped by 100k sold orders for vans - no vans, no R1

I don’t imagine anyone involved in production at rivian is getting any sleep lately.
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